From Hillary on voting irregularities

[roenyc]

In reply to my message to her:


February 2, 2005

Thank you for sharing your concerns regarding irregularities in the
2004 election, during which, unfortunately, some Americans were
not given a fair opportunity to exercise their right to vote and have their vote counted.

I applaud both Senator Boxer and
Congresswoman Stephanie Tubbs Jones for raising this issue,
important to our democracy, during the Congressional certification
of the 2004 electoral votes. The election of 2000 raised many
questions about the accuracy and integrity of our election system.
Additional questions arose during the 2004 election, deepening the
concern of many people about whether we can assure the
continuity of our democratic process by ensuring the consent of the
governed and the acceptance of the results of the election.

Last year with several of my colleagues, I introduced legislation,
The Restore Elector Confidence in Our Representative Democracy
Act of 2004, to assure that each and every voter who casts a vote
on an electronic voting machine is able to verify his or her vote
through a paper ballot so that there is extra assurance that all votes
cast are properly recorded and counted. As a nation, we should be
setting the standards for electoral integrity. I will continue in this
new Congress to advocate for a voter verifiable paper record for all
such voters as well as for other much-needed improvements in our
voting process. This is so important because few things are more
sacred and important to our nation than the foundation of our
democracy - the right to vote. Indeed, this year we will celebrate
the 40th anniversary of the Voting Rights Act of 1965. I hope that
the entire United States Congress will use the anniversary as an
opportunity for us to take a look at this landmark legislation and
determine how we are going to move it into the 21st century so that
it accomplishes all of the purposes for which it was intended.

I am grateful that the objections raised to the certification of the
Ohio electoral vote allowed for discussion on the Senate floor of
the serious issue affecting disenfranchisement of some American
voters. I believe that Congress should take up these important
issues this year. However, I did not feel that the case had been
made to overturn the outcome of the Ohio vote tally. Therefore, I
voted to accept the Ohio count. No matter what the outcome of the
2004 election had been, I would still raise questions about the
election process. The voting irregularities of the past two elections
raise profound questions about our nation's belief in the equality of
all Americans. Please be assured that during the 109th Congress I
will continue to fight for improvement in our election process.

Again, thank you for writing. Please check my website at
http://clinton.senate.gov for updates on this and other important
issues being discussed before the United States Senate.

Sincerely yours,
Hillary Rodham Clinton





http://clinton.senate.gov

[feelthebreeze]

1. judge by actions, not speeches

[Senator]

2. Translation >>>

Hours-long poll-tax-lines for poor, minority voters and none for affluent, white voters is tolerable to me personally. -- HRC

You can redeem yourself Hill, just take the pledge.

You had your chance, and you flubbed it. -- Michaeleen Oge Flynn


-----------------
www.thedeanpeople.org

[FloridaCrat]

3. 57000 affadavits = EVIDENCE of Election FRAUD represent tip of the iceberg

We need to continue to reframe this education challenge to the DNC - Even
Dean thinks there isn't any evidence, just suspicion, of Election Fraud.

There is a huge amount of evidence already. Not just suspicion, but
hard evidence. This consists of voters, poll workers - real people who
have signed affadavits of votes being switched on touch screen machines -
always FROM KERRY TO BUSH. This is one type of problem that was
experienced. Multiply this by the number of touch screen machines in use
on election day. Use the expert testimony of the scientists and you can
see how huge this problem really is.

Who are the DNC listening too??? I sent a pretty blunt message to their
blog yesterday saying they needed a real butt kicking for their uninvolvement
in the election fraud issues.

Later I saw that the DNC sent $500K to Ohio to look into Election Issues.
That's a start, anyway.

[merh]

5. We need to find out who those 20 people are that make up the

team that will investigate this for the DNC - we need to bombard them with the evidence.

We must be heard on this and they must not ignore all the work we have done.

[Hugin]

4. Note: Please change your post headline.

We're attempting to move the frame from "Voter Irregularities"
which implies the voters were in the wrong. To "Election
Reform" which means bringing the vote back to the people.

Thanks! =)

[roenyc]

9. i used the headline because its the way she phrased it

i watched the vote on gonzales yesterday until i saw her blond head pop up and waited for her no. cause i am telling you i was going to go balistic if she voted yes. she did good.

i filled out a survey for zogby yesterday. i gave her and schumer a fair rating. i have really had it with soft democrats. and frankly both have been soft. republican light.

we lost in my opinion and i think most of the people in this forum anyway because of voter supression and election fraud. i dont think it had anything to do with our values or our position on abortion or terror or anything else.

i am so worried that we are not going to have voter turnout in 06 and even if we do will it be worth it.

[EST]

17. Unfortunately, I am not terribly sophisticated.

Would you please enlighten me, either here or pm, why the quibble about the original poster's headline? Thanks in advance.

[sepia_steel]

18. Because...

the VOTERS didn't commit the fraud, the proper term is "Election Fraud'.

I thought the explanation provided BEFORE you posted this question (again) was pretty simple:

"We're attempting to move the frame from "Voter Irregularities"
which implies the voters were in the wrong. To "Election
Reform" which means bringing the vote back to the people.

[EST]

20. Thanks. What do you think of the idea (not mine, unfortunately)

that we should adopt the notion that it should not be "election reform" at all, but that one of the principles we should, both as a party and attempt to sell to the electorate in general, is a stand for a constitutional amendment that actually guarantees the right to vote for all? Currently there is no such guarantee in the constitution and this plan would do away with all the HAVA tangle, the provisional votes, etc, and would bring a halt to the sort of voter fraud and vote fraud that have been endemic, at least in recent elections.

All the nonsense about no paper trail, proprietary software, on and on ad nauseum would disappear and any further crap would be strictly unconstitutional and easily prosecuted and provable.

Should be a fairly easy sell, especially with all the trivial amendments the neocons have been trying to peddle, and might well get complete support from both sides, since everybody suspects the other guy of fraud, no matter which side of the line.

[marions ghost]

6. I see that

Hillary uses the word PAPER...

"I will continue in this new Congress to advocate for a voter verifiable *paper* record for all such voters as well as for other much-needed improvements in our voting process."

I take that to mean she supports the Ensign patch on HAVA...

Well at least she's not blind to the issues, tho her record has been disappointing. I say keep after Hillary and make sure she "continues to advocate" as she promises, in the new congress.

[NationalEnquirer]

7. While this sounds pretty good.

Talk is cheap, however, it does go in the right direction, so I'll give her credit.

[demodonkey]

8. I got the same response with slightly different arrangement of..

the paragraphs. Received 1/14/05 in response to pre-January 6 e-mail.

[Peace Patriot]

10. RE the title: I always put "irregularities" in quotes, and I'm usually...

using it in the phrase "election irregularities" (not "voting irregularities"--which is inaccurate, I think)--but I DON'T put the word "election" in quotes, just "irregularities."

Example: 2004 election "irregularities" included secret, proprietary programming code used in all the electronic central vote tabulators--code owned and controlled by extreme partisans of the Bush regime.

In other words, I use quotes around the word "irregularities" to mock the use of the word "irregularities."

Hillary says "irregularities in the 2004 election" not "voting irregularities."

DEMODONKEY: Would you post the version you got in January? (Do you still have it?)

The thing that immediately struck me about this H. Clinton message is that she put electronic voting FIRST in her concerns. I wonder if it was first back in January.

And I started reading between the lines (maybe reading too much into it): She knows! She knows! --based on that very thing, the organization of the paragraphs.

It also struck me that the issue of the 2004 election is important enough for her office to have prepared a rather long, detailed letter about it, in which, among other things, she puts electronic voting as her first concern, and also tries to gain some Leftist political points by praising Boxer/Jones' January 6 action (top of the letter), while (towards the bottom of the letter) sticking to the tired, useless, blind, "head in the sand" DNC line that Ohio "irregularities" would not have changed the outcome of the election (this, I think to try to justify her inaction on Jan. 6).

I'm fed up with the Democratic leadership's ignorance/denial/malfeasance on electronic voting in the 2004 election. I think we should hit them up front with an accusation: HOW ON EARTH COULD YOU HAVE PERMITTED WALLY O'DELL AND H. AHMANSON TO GAIN CONTROL OF OUR ELECTION SYSTEM, and, WHY DIDN'T YOU WARN US? WHY WASN'T THIS A CAMPAIGN ISSUE? You took our money for the presidential campaign, you took our time and energy, and then you let voting proceed in an INHERENTLY FRAUDULENT ELECTION **SYSTEM** WITH HARDLY A PEEP OUT OF YOU!!!

It's hard to knock some sense into these people--our leadership--all of whom live in a glass bubble of privilege, power and money.

But on the positive side, what the election fraud 2004 means is that the Democrats in Congress in truth represent the MAJORITY of Americans, and that's how I've been putting it lately, and recent opinion polls back that up...

63% of Americans oppose torture under any circumstances (recent ABC poll).
57% of Americans oppose the Iraq War (recent polls).
Bush's approval rating has sunk as low as 43% (Rasmussen poll) and is hovering at or below 50% (other polls)...

...altogether a resounding and unprecedented "vote of no confidence" by the American people in a recently inaugurated president (literally unprecedented--no president, so situated, has ever had such low approval ratings).

The mountain of evidence that we have gathered on the fraudulent election is CORROBORATED by these polls. Bush does not represent the majority, and was not elected!

[garybeck]

11. then why did you vote to approve the Ohio electors, Ms Clinton?

say one thing, do another

[Andy_Stephenson]

12. Because it was the politically expidient thing

for her to do. She took the path of least resistance.

[Wilms]

13. kick n/t

[bush_is_wacko]

14. Why the hell don't they just call it what it is?

A STOLEN ELECTION! Bush has stolen the office of president four 8 years! What the hell is wrong with these people. The evidence is insurmountable. If ANY of the charges were brought into open court and judged by a jury ALL HELL WOULD BREAK LOOSE. The problem is our judges are NOT representative of our citizenry! What the hell does it take to get a 50 state jury trial to hear the evidence? I know this is an impossibility with this particular subject but it sure as hell shouldn't be!

[Nightjock]

15. She consistantly disappoints me

She's such a strong woman and she seems to be wimping out.

[BeFree]

16. Next year, eh?

Ms. Clinton says:
"The election of 2000 raised many
questions about the accuracy and integrity of our election system.
Additional questions arose during the 2004 election, ...

So, she noticed the elections are screwed up. Two Points!

Now she vows to continue to fight for improvement. Fight for Improvement? That's pretty damned lame.

2006 will see all of us vote on Paper Ballots, that are then counted by humans, or we will have lost America.

[loudsue]

19. Somehow, we need to get our RESEARCH into the hands of Dean &

Congresscritters. It is so exhasperating that they still don't know what we know. Even Kerry! If they could SEE the research, from the ownership of the voting machines to the UNELECTED Elections Commission, to the discrepancies in the exit polls.... ALL of the original BBV evidence, plus what we've come up with since the election, including the affidavits, they would have to finally see what we're talking about.

Every single one of them need to be hounded with it all, because they won't pay any attention to just a few faxes or e-mails. We have to figure out some way to actually LOBBY them with the information... you know, get 'em cornered and SELL 'em with it, in numbers!

The first thing we need to do is get Dean on board, and maybe with Conyers and Boxers help we can do that.

SOMETHING has to finally dawn on them. We have to do the same thing with our local and State elected officials, too, because THEY are the ones who can outlaw the voting machines in each state, or at least demand open source code and strict laws regarding who gets to touch the machines, the ballots and when, and under whose supervision.

Damn! There's so much more work we have to do before everyone just gives up and walks away, like what happened in 2000. I simply cannot face 2006 knowing that the same thing is going to happen if we don't get it corrected NOW.

:kick::kick::kick: