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Has anyone heard anything from the election fraud Hearing in Miami?

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berniew1 Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Feb-04-05 11:25 PM
Original message
Has anyone heard anything from the election fraud Hearing in Miami?
If so post what you've heard.

There was widespread touchscreen vote machine fraud in the S. Florida and coastal area touchscreen counties, as well as systematic dirty tricks in minority precincts and manipulation of absentee and provisional ballots affecting large numbers of voters in many counties in Florida. Many more votes appear to have been swung in Florida than in Ohio.

http://www.flcv.com/fraudpat.html
http://www.flcv.com/dirtytrf.html
http://www.flcv.com/EIRSFLA2.html

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KaryninMiami Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Feb-05-05 12:06 AM
Response to Original message
1. I've heard nothing and I'm in Miami- so if anyone has news, please share!
I attended the Election Protection hearing yesterday, but there did not seem to be any movement towards anything substantial as follow up, although I did not stay until the very end. But, it appeared mostly to be a hearing where people shared their experiences so we can learn and make changes for the future. It was not as well attended as I'd hoped, but there was very little publicity unfortunately for it. .

There's also a group that meets every Wednesday night at the ACLU called the Miami Election Reform Coalition who are a community group, all volunteers who are working on a non-partisan basis to make recommendations to the city and the county on what needs to be done for a fair, verifiable election. However, in spite of their best efforts, the machines were still rigged, the codes were kept secret and in many locations and neighborhoods, there was widespread disenfranchisement.

So, if anyone has any news any legal actions or groups moving to take legal action, please post or send me an email as I'd love to become involved. Frankly, it feels like most people here, have zoned out for the most part or have "gotten over it". It's very discouraging.

(Not me however- for me, it will never be over until we expose the fraud and those who are guilty are put on trial.)
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dzika Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Feb-05-05 12:37 AM
Response to Reply #1
2. Thanks for posting!
I was wondering if anything was going to come from these meetings. I've been a little surprised at the lack of action in Florida.
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berniew1 Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Feb-05-05 12:56 AM
Response to Reply #2
4. The hearings had virtually no publicity; Media has blacked out fraud cover
coverage and hasn't covered the widespread dirty tricks, malfeasance regarding manipulation of absentees, provisionals, etc.
or had any coverage of the widespread touchscreen fraud. To me its very strange. It appears there was more flagrant touchscreen fraud and more votes swung in Florida in 2004 than 2000 when it was clear Gore won Florida and had election stolen through massive fraud.
But someone who controls the Media seems to have made a decision not to cover fraud and suppression in Florida this year.

It seems there is a need to develop a new means of educating the public on such issues. A major problem is the Dems timidity to speak out about such things even when its obviously to their advantage to do so. Seems the Media only covers things that politicians say these days. And the Dems don't say much. Thats a major difference. The Repubs often don't have much useful to say but say nonsense in a forceful manner and them Dem leaders have a lot they could say but are so timid they don't say things that clearly would be to their advantage to say. With only a few exceptions, such as the recent Congressional Hearings. And even there several wimped out. But it seems to me Dem supporters also don't understand how much writing letters to Ed and their Dem officials and participating in forums, chat rooms with those other than Dem activists can accomplish. The majority is convincable if you find the right means.


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berniew1 Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Feb-05-05 12:40 AM
Response to Reply #1
3. See the Action Plan in my Florida summary article. Some of us take it ser
seriously and there are some planning to pursue it. It may sound a little watered down but thats what happens in group process, but the intent is real and if carried out it could accomplish some major goals. Contact me off list.
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berniew1 Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Feb-05-05 12:58 AM
Response to Reply #1
5. I'd be intererested in more details about what problems were discussed
WAs there something that came out not covered in my documentation??
Or additional areas/ issues?

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KaryninMiami Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Feb-05-05 01:14 AM
Response to Reply #5
6. At the meeting in Miami?
I stayed for about the first 15 testimonies. There were an array of complaints. Some from firsthand experience- a few from Little Haiti where there were numerous problems with people not speaking the language and not having enough help, long lines, many challenges, etc. Major problems there during early voting especially.
Susan (can't remember her last name) who was in Valusia county with Bev Harris presented a laundry list of things including the now famous dumpster evidence that they found up there. She had lots more to tell but didn't have enough time. A friend of mine who was there from the Herald got the rest (I sent him out after her to interview her) so hopefully he'll do a story.
A few just wanted to express their feelings in general about the machines, about the lines on early voting, etc.
Two spoke about the nightmare with absentee ballots. One woman had a son in college in Orlando who did not get to vote because it never arrived- even though they ordered it months in advance. These were a huge problem in Dade and Broward.
One woman from Palm Beach talked about her issues with the machine defaulting to Bush after she voted for Kerry. When the election worker came to check (she did not hit the final ok button since she wanted witnesses to see what had happened), he told her not to worry about it since when they re-checked the steps, it showed she had in fact, voted Democratic even though the final check out said she had voted Republican. She demanded they remove the obviously malfunctioning machine which they did but not before giving her a hard time about it. She has a sworn affidavit stating what had happened with witnesses and said it had happened to many others (no surprise).
Another issue which we were very aware of that the MDERC, is that there are serious questions regarding the accuracy of early voting which we will never really know about. Another is the absentee ballots in Dade where over 110,000 were returned, but there was no actual procedure for storage, security, handling, etc. Nor was there enough staff or time to count them. The ACLU tried to get an extension but this was not granted.
Long lines during early voting came up as well.

I did not stay until the end- was exhausted and could not imagine this was going to lead to any real action. Just more reporting over and over. For me the bottom line is we NEVER should have used those machines. Period. Not to mention the disenfranchisement in Little Haiti, other downtown areas and at UM where they were short changed on machines big time, so many students never voted.

Please send your report and keep me posted on what you are doing and things going on here!

Thanks!

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KaryninMiami Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Feb-05-05 01:24 AM
Response to Original message
7. Did anyone atend any of the other FL hearings?
Just curious. AND did anyone hear any specific action plans?

I will call the director of PFAW next week since he hosted the panel in Miami and I'm wondering what their plans are moving forward. I hope and pray someone is planning to take action with this but it just didn't feel like this was the plan. Maybe I'm wrong- I hope so!
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corbett Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Feb-05-05 02:18 PM
Response to Reply #7
10. Yes, I Was At The Hearing In Orlando
The action plans discussed merely were that the sworn testimony given to the Election Protection member groups to be included in their lobbying and legislative efforts to pass meaningful election reform.

You can read my report at

http://www.democraticunderground.com/discuss/duboard.php?az=view_all&address=203x310391
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KaryninMiami Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Feb-05-05 07:11 PM
Response to Reply #10
12. Thank you. for sharing that!
I wish there was something more substantial we could all be doing here. It's nice that Election Protection and the NAACP, People for the American Way, ACLU, and other groups are listening to all of these sworn testimonies, but I just cannot figure out why people aren't more outraged and getting together to take action. Especially over the number of people who attempted to vote for one candidate and had it switch over to the other and the fact that none of them went from Bush to Kerry is extremely disturbing. It happened to me in 2002- my machine switched from McBride to Jeb- much to my horror. That's when I knew they had manipulated the defaults, figuring that most people would not bother to re-check their votes. Why aren't people screaming? I just don't get it and if one more person emails or tells me to "get over it", I really am going to scream.
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corbett Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Feb-06-05 07:11 AM
Response to Reply #12
17. Definitely NOT Over It
I'm glad that you enjoyed my report and share your horror at how Jeb won reelection. I knew that at a minimum, the results should have been very close.

As for why the groups didn't seem more outraged, I have two thoughts:

1) At my poll monitor training on November 1, it was obvious to me that Election Protection volunteers were prepped to keep their (justified) moral outrage to a low simmer because all of the member groups are non-partisan. Their 501(c)(3) tax status is very important to them.

2) While I refused to believe it at first (well, for the last two months of 2004), I've come to the realization that when Kerry conceded, he put out the word to the institutions which supported him not to rally their memberships to demonstrate in the streets and cry foul. This, of course, was a fundamental error of Beltway thinking with which I couldn't have disagreed more but his behavior since then has been, in my humble opinion, consistent with a concerted effort on his part to launch his 2008 campaign now and push through several pieces of big tent legislation which will give him name recognition when the campaign heats up in 2007.

Representative Conyers is a friend and mentor to Kerry and I've concluded that Kerry believes that meaningful election reform can be pushed through the Congress and ultimately signed by the shrub in time to make the mid-term elections a fair fight. Right or wrong, he believes this and is placing all of his eggs in that basket. If I'm right, then the time for Election Protection to lay all of their indignation and outrage on the table will be in hearings on the fraud perpetrated in 2004. Those hearings will come as a part of the process of passing election reform, assuming that Representative Sensenbrenner passes the subpoena mantle to Conyers.

Like you, I feel that a genuine and crucially important opportunity for a Selma-type march from Columbus, Santa Fe and Tallahassee to Washington, DC already has passed but console myself in the knowlege that there are enough bigots and cheats in this country at whom we can aim our belated rage.
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eomer Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Feb-05-05 08:53 AM
Response to Original message
8. I audio taped it and am working on a transcript...
Here's what I've finished so far:

Moderator Jorge Mursuli (People for the American Way): Good evening. I'd like to thank all of you for being here this evening and just sort of like to start by saying that we may not get the attention… election reform issues may not get the attention that we got before the election but it certainly doesn’t make it any less important… and so we’re very, very grateful for those of you that are here, we’re very eager to listen to your testimony and we should have a very fruitful evening. We’ve been conducting… the partnership of the NAACP and the Lawyers Committee for Civil Rights under the Law, People for the American Way Foundation has been conducting these hearings throughout the state. The purpose of these hearings is to gather information to help mold our election reform agenda in partnership with all of our partner organizations. And we haven’t started here. This is an additional step in a long line of steps that reflect our commitment to election reform. Most of you know that the partners around Election Protection this past election were in all of the states all over the country. As a matter of fact, People from the American Way Foundation had over 25,000 volunteers around the country in precincts trying to learn what we could do to ensure that people’s vote was counted and that people actually got an opportunity to vote. We then produced, in collaboration with our partners, a report called “Shattering the Myth” that sort of quantified and qualified all the things that we experienced across the country. And that, of course, is available to anyone who wants it at the front desk. It really sort of gives you an overview of the kind of things we experienced. Today what we’re doing, like we did in other cities around the state – we’re giving an opportunity to those folks that possibly may not have had an opportunity to present a formal complaint and we wanted to sort of dot our i’s and cross our t’s as we sort of develop a legislative agenda. And as we sort of look for leaders around the state to help us correct the problems that still exist. Now many of you heard and possibly experienced the fact that things were a lot better this year than they were in 2000. Well, there was certainly nowhere to go but up I suppose. But we’re happy, we’re not looking for the problems, as a matter of fact we’re looking for the solutions. And our hope is that now that the partisan rhetoric is turned off we can really focus on ensuring that legislation in the state of Florida reflects the kinds of solutions that folks like yourself need in order to have your vote count in the future. And the truth of the matter is… it’s... I think I can say it’s People For’s position and I suspect it’s the position of the many organizations that are represented here today… is that, you know, when one person’s vote isn’t counted, to us that’s enough. There isn’t a magic number, one, a thousand, a hundred thousand… I don’t know what that number is. I know that when one person’s vote doesn’t count that’s enough because it’s not about someone else – tomorrow it could be your vote. So we’re very happy that you’re here. Before we introduce our panelists I just want to recognize a couple of people in the room that we very much appreciate that they’re here…

Moderator recognizes some members of the audience:
Selden Carter, national representative of AFL-CIO
Emilio Vazquez, regional director for Senator Bill Nelson
Ronald A. Brisey (spelling?), representing Representative Philip Brutus (Florida state representative)
Milton Collins, Deputy Supervisor of Elections, Miami-Dade County
Ida Corman (spelling?) Assistant Supervisor of Elections, Miami-Dade County
Arthur Anderson, Supervisor of Elections, Palm Beach County
Edina Sorrell and Jeff Tarter (spelling?) with the Palm Beach County Supervisor of Elections
Marsha Barnham (spelling?), League of Women Voters of Broward County
Mary Mann (spelling?), United Teachers of Dade (organization hosting the hearing)
Monica Russo, SEIU

Moderator introduces panelists:
Courtnay Strickland, ACLU-Florida
Ana Cela Harris, Lawyers’ Committee for Civil Rights under the Law
Andy Rivera, the Advancement Project
Jill Hanson, American Federation of State, County and Municipal Employees (AFSCME)
Adora Obi Nweze, National Board of Directors, NAACP
Edeline Clermont, SEIU
Reggie Mitchell, Florida Legal Director, Election Protection

<Panelists, in turn, say a few words about themselves and their mission>

Witness Arthur Anderson, Supervisor of Elections, Palm Beach County: Good evening to the panel and to the audience. I’m delighted to have this opportunity to appear before you this evening and have a few remarks. Let me say that not only is our topic of the evening one that is timely at any point in time in our lives but it’s especially meaningful to me this evening because as you know we are in the midst of the observance of Black History Month. And when I think in terms of the black historical experience in America, which of course is an integral component of the American historical experience, much of that effort was centered toward a focus on acquiring voter rights for all of our citizens – the most fundamental and basic guarantee that we have under the Constitution of these United States. You know, we should all be very grateful to the fact that much of the impetus toward voter reform in this state and nationwide originated in our outstanding county. For if it were not for the butterfly ballot, to some great degree we might not be here this evening. So, in a less than desirable fashion, we’re now moving in the right direction, which is – ultimately we want to guarantee that every vote counts. And if we think back to the 2000 elections, of course, which again very much has contributed to us being at this point this evening, we know that there was much concern, much dismay, much disenfranchisement of voters by way of the fact that every vote apparently did not count. Going back to the 2000 election in Palm Beach County, where we utilized that <inaudible> punch card ballot approach to voting we find that some 6.4% of punch card ballots went uncounted in the 2000 presidential race. However, since we have adopted in Palm Beach County the touch screen voting systems, the electronic ballots and equipment, we utilize Sequoia, again, that some .4% (a reduction of 93%) of touch screen voters did not record a vote of the presidential election in 2004. We were concerned as well you would understand that many voters either still casted <sic> a vote for president in 2000 or made some errors in casting their vote. I am reminded that 92,843 Palm Beach County voters who cast a vote by an absentee paper ballot vote or a provisional ballot vote, only .9% went uncounted in the recent presidential election. Much of the debate since we moved away from the punch card balloting, driven in large measure by <inaudible, Congress?> as well as our own state reform initiatives, the controversy has very much centered over what is best - to go with an optical scan system of voting or to go with electronic balloting equipment. As you know, some 52 counties in the state of Florida have selected the optical scan system; 15 have selected the electronic balloting equipment. There has been much debate and also, of course, legal actions brought against certain parties in this state and others that those residents in the 52 counties that have acquired the optical scan system enjoy an advantage to those in the 15 counties that did not due to the fact that as required by state law if a contested election outcome occurs you should be able to conduct a manual recount. We, of course, are not able to do that with electronic ballot equipment. And so, much debate has then emanated over that seeming disparity and that possibly residents in the 15 counties are being denied their equal rights as regarded by the fourteenth amendment to the Constitution. As I’ve endeavored to address these concerns, of course, it has been <inaudible> suggested that we institute the paper audit trail and add printers to those electronic balloting machines that are currently in place. In Palm Beach County we are apparently moving in that direction. The County Commission has approved the expenditure to purchase the printers for the electronic ballot equipment when they are indeed certified in the State of Florida. Personally I have encouraged my staff, and we will be forming a technology advisory committee in the near future, that we’re welcomely open to any innovations or recent technological developments that might occur in the field. Ultimately what we want to do is ensure that every vote does count for our citizens and, although we are in the mode of moving forward with our electronic balloting equipment, we will consider any developments elsewhere and ultimately provide to our students <sic> the best remedy that is possible for them. Thank you very much.
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MelissaB Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Feb-05-05 10:22 AM
Response to Reply #8
9. WTG eomer!
:yourock:

Please let us know wnen you finish the transcript. I'm cross posting this thread in the "daily thread" in hopes that more people see it.
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sunnystarr Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Feb-05-05 02:32 PM
Response to Reply #8
11. Thank you for your hard work in transcribing the tape.
Please, when you have it all done would you please post it, or send it to me?
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KaryninMiami Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Feb-05-05 07:14 PM
Response to Reply #8
13. Wow- great work!
Please PM me when it's complete. I would love to read the entire thing since I had to leave before it ended.

Thanks you so much!

K
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minorjive Donating Member (66 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Feb-05-05 07:45 PM
Response to Reply #8
14. you're awesome!
I want to add my voice to the thank yous. If you could pm me as well, when it's through, I'd love to get notification. In any event, consider starting a new thread with the completed transcript so all will take notice of it.
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rigel99 Donating Member (621 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Feb-05-05 08:13 PM
Response to Reply #8
15. You're a star EOMER
this transcript is fantastic.

GA is deeply interested in your activites there in Miami.

We are also having trouble conducting a manual recount as well, only in our case it's in all 159 counties because of Diebold touchscreens.... I'm interested in what problems you've learned from Diebold DRE machines specifically, since GA is 100% Diebold. Especially curious how you tie DRE machine malfunction to actual electoral or constitutional law....

Good work!
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corbett Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Feb-06-05 07:26 AM
Response to Reply #8
18. Link To "Myth"
Great job! I look forward to reading your transcript in its entirety. From what I've read so far, I'm pleased that county and state officials were present.



http://www.pfaw.org/pfaw/general/default.aspx?oid=17514
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Wilms Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Feb-06-05 12:36 AM
Response to Original message
16. Kick n/t
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