something we CAN do to guard our votes.

[mopinko]

i have tossed this idea around a couple of times, and have come to the conclusion that it WOULD help, if we were organized enough to do it.
maybe we could do it right here.
this is how it is in illinois, and afaik, also in other places- at the end of the night, before abandoning the polling place, the poll tape of results must be posted in a visible location. if EVERY ONE OF US checked our own polling place, at least, and posted those results, then compared them to the publicized, precinct by precinct reports, we could at least catch fraud that was occurring in the central tabulations.
it would be gravy if we could snag those tapes. also afaik, they are not required to be posted for any length of time. once the poll workers leave, it is no longer a polling place. all that would be required would be that someone have access to the building when it re-opens as whatever type of establishment it is. they should be free to take the tape. probably not probable in government building in rethug districts, but in a lot of places, it should be possible.
if we wanted to push for a specific piece of legislation that would skirt the whole bbv issue, i would recommend pushing for voting rights groups to be entitled to a copy of that tape. no doubt they would want money for that. i would not be opposed to a small fee, to cover the costs. no doubt they would pull the same crap they do with foia, charging ridiculous amounts per page. but......

[Catamount]

1. You might be on to something here!

K&R

[GuvWurld]

2. I think CA requires poll tape to be posted for 48 hours

Even still, this is not always observed. We needed the poll tape to efficiently wrap up our parallel election after last November's official "election" and it was not posted. We were also not allowed into Arcata City Hall to observe the poll closing procedures. Both violate our rights under the law. Elections officials poo-poohed our complaints like it was no big deal and we should have made prior arrangements.

[mopinko]

4. i think many such things would occur

one thing about this junta that i am struck by is that they are so corrupt that they cannot even abide by robert's rules. most people do not realize the significance of this. i keep thinking about the hearings on the patriot act renewal, where sennsenbrenner turned off the mics, and nadler's plaintive call of "point of order, point of order!" i thought, my god, we are a dictatorship.
but you know, if you can snag them on the little shit, sometimes you can make change. let these low level folks know that the citizens are watching. we can do this. and it will make some change. maybe it will be small, a local office here, a tight race there. but the more i see, the more i think that if i can make change for my great grand children, i will be lucky.

[FredStembottom]

3. I'm not even sure what a poll tape is.......

but I have been thinking along the same lines - at least as far as planning to be off work that night to do WHATEVER kind of observing is possible. I would think that just the sheer shock of large numbers of people, all across the country, showing up at polling places just as they close to ACTUALLY claim our promised rights would be worthwhuile!

:thumbsup:

[mopinko]

5. be a poll watcher!

the poll tape is the official tally of all votes cast in a precinct. they are long strips of paper, and must be posted at the end of the night. there was a move to do this on election night '04, but i never heard any results.

obviously, the best thing would be for all us lefties to take the day off, and be poll watchers. i know that is not practical. but i think of it every time i see howard's quote about voting only gets you a D in democracy, to get an A you have to run for something. but i think you should get an A for poll watching or judging.

[Peace Patriot]

6. This is one of two things that I would very much like to see in Nov., and

in the primaries, if possible:

1. At least one poll watcher at closing time getting the tape and posting results on an independent web site, and, best scenario, groups of citizen poll watchers throughout election day at every precinct in the country, with various tasks (including getting the end of day tape); and,

2. Democratic Party funding of INDEPENDENT EXIT POLLS in every Congressional election. The war profiteering corporate news monopoly exit polls are not to be trusted.

We need an organized effort. I don't off-hand know if anyone is organizing any such thing (as item #1). www.UScountvotes.org is getting organized--and needs donations for--a project to provide quick statistical analysis of results. It would be great to have one place--one web site--where the poll tape results could be posted, and where, before the election, people could sign up to poll watch, so that we can see at a glance what precincts are not covered (and recruit poll watchers there); the site could also provide instructions and information to signed-up poll watchers, so that they are savvy on the ways of government secrecy, know what to look for, how to obtain and handle information/data, get documentation, and prepare reports. Precinct/region-specific problems could also be discussed. What would be best is if a local/regional voters rights group handled the monitoring and perhaps vetted the poll watchers. The web site would be for determining coverage levels, and posting results.

And I simply don't know if such a thing is already being organized, or contemplated. But below are some places to go for that information--and/or to suggest such an effort.

As for the Democratic Party--our leaders need to be coerced and shamed into funding independent exit polls! They have been utterly derelict--if not outright corrupt and collusive--in selling out our right to vote to PRIVATE, RIGHTWING, BUSHITES CORPORATIONS who now control the "tabulation" of all of our votes with 'TRADE SECRET', PROPRIETARY programming code and virtually no audit/recount controls. It's my belief that Diebold and ES&S are putting a 5% to 10% "thumb on the scales" for Bushites and warmongers in our so-called elections. That is a huge handicap against the true progressive, anti-Iraq-war majority in this country. Where is the outrage among our Democratic leaders about WHO is now "counting" our votes (corporations with close ties to Bush and to extremist 'christian' causes) and HOW they are "counting" them (behind a veil of secrecy!)? That outrage is non-existent! There has not even been a whimper of objection from our Democratic leaders! What gives? Are they insane, or what?

Anyway, they owe us one, big time! They owe us INDEPENDENT EXIT POLLS!

--------------------------

SOME RESOURCES FOR AMERICAN REVOLUTION II:

Hopeful signs - latest news:

California voters sue the state over Diebold:
www.VoterAction.org is suing the state of California and 18 Calif county registrars on behalf of 25 California voter/plaintiffs, on the illegal Diebold "certification" by Schwarzenegger appointee Bruce McPherson.
http://www.democraticunderground.com/discuss/duboard.php?az=view_all&address=102x2180496

Maryland rejects Diebold:
http://www.democraticunderground.com/discuss/duboard.php?az=view_all&address=203x418263

Florida - anti-trust accusations against Diebold, ES&S and Sequoia, re: heroic Florida election official Ion Sancho:
(FLA AG subpoenas the companies)
http://www.computerworld.com/governmenttopics/government/legalissues/story/0,10801,110192,00.html
http://www.tbo.com/news/politics/MGBKSY8W8LE.html
(info & discussion)
http://www.democraticunderground.com/discuss/duboard.php?az=view_all&address=102x2183630

Utah county clerk fights back!
http://www.democraticunderground.com/discuss/duboard.php?az=view_all&address=203x419226

-----

More resources for American Revolution II:

www.votersunite.org (MythBreakers - easy primer on electronic voting--one of the myths is that HAVA requires electronic voting; it does not.)
www.UScountvotes.org (statistical monitoring of '06 and '08 elections--they need donations)


(Activist sites with links to state activist groups or info)
www.votetrustusa.org (news of this great movement from around the country)
www.votersunited.org (good general info, and state links)
www.verifiedvoting.org (great activist site)
www.solarbus.org/election/index.shtml (fab compendium of all election info)

www.freepress.org (devoted to election reform)
www.bradblog.com (also great, and devoted to election reform)
www.TruthIsAll.net (analysis of the 2004 election)* :patriot: :applause: :patriot:
www.votepa.us (well-organized local group of citizen activists in Pennsylvania, where important legal issues are at stake, including state's rights over election systems)

The Voter Confidence Resolution
http://tinyurl.com/rlnr2 (“We Do Not Consent”)
http://guvwurld.blogspot.com (GuvWurld blog main page)
http://tinyurl.com/amryg (Voter Confidence Resolution

www.debrabowen.com (Calif Senator running for Sec of State to reform election system)
www.johnbonifaz.com (running for Massachusetts Sec of State on strong election reform and antiwar platform)

*Some tributes to TruthIsAll, who is very ill:
http://www.democraticunderground.com/discuss/duboard.php?az=view_all&address=203x417007
http://www.democraticunderground.com/discuss/duboard.php?az=view_all&address=203x417231
http://www.democraticunderground.com/discuss/duboard.php?az=view_all&address=364x675477

Congressional bills:

Russ Holt's HR 550 requires a real paper ballot, bans secret software in "voting machines", and has more than 170 co-sponsors, but the audit required is too weak, it promotes electronic voting and centralized power, and the secret software might be permitted to continue in the central tabulators (the bill is not clear). To sign the HR 550 petition: http://www.rushholt.com/petition.html
At lot of discussion at DU of the loopholes/pitfalls in HR 550:
http://www.democraticunderground.com/discuss/duboard.php?az=view_all&address=203x422926
http://www.democraticunderground.com/discuss/duboard.php?az=view_all&address=203x421136
http://www.democraticunderground.com/discuss/duboard.php?az=show_mesg&forum=203&topic_id=422967&mesg_id=422967
(Note: Senate Bill-SB 330 and House-HR704 simply require a "voter verified paper audit trail" (VVPAT), which may be best for the moment.)


Also of interest:

Bob Koehler (-- four recent election reform initiatives in Ohio, predicted to win by 60/40 votes, flipped over, on election day, into 60/40 LOSSES!--the biggest flipover we've seen yet; the election theft machines and their masters are now dictating election policy!)
www.tmsfeatures.com/tmsfeatures/subcategory.jsp?file=20051124ctnbk-a.txt&catid=1824&code=ctnbk

Bob Koehler's latest: "Take this box and stuff it" (3/16/06)
http://commonwonders.com/archives/col337.htm

Amaryllis (Diebold, ES&S, Sequoia lavish lobbying of election officials - Beverly Hilton, Aug. '05)
www.democraticunderground.com/discuss/duboard.php?az=view_all&address=203x380340

------------------------------------------------

Throw Diebold, ES&S and ALL election theft machines into 'Boston Harbor' NOW!

:think: :patriot: :woohoo: :patriot: :think:

-----------

"That to secure these rights, Governments are instituted among Men, deriving their just powers from the consent of the governed, — That whenever any Form of Government becomes destructive of these ends, it is the Right of the People to alter or to abolish it." --Thomas Jefferson, The Declaration of Independence

[shraby]

7. Another thought on this, get out the digital cameras

and photograph the results on the poll tape. Those can be posted to a central website.

[mopinko]

9. that is hard

they are usually displayed behind glass, often back lit, the ink is usually faint, they are long and thin.
someone did this in '04. i signed up, and took pics of my tape. they never announced any results. i suspect it is because they got little usable data. i know mine was not very good.

[mopinko]

8. exit polls are a waste, and dems are crooked, too.

i live in chicago. i never, for a minute, thought that it was only thugs that were stealing votes.
there are corporate toadies, and there are honest representatives. you can count the latter without removing your shoes, imho. we cannot shame enough of them to even say out loud what they know, let alone do anything real about it.
exit polls are legally meaningless, as we know. we need to collect evidence of these crimes, not take pictures of it. we need lawyers, not pollsters.
we do not have a dime, an hour or a prayer that can be wasted on anything that is not admissable in court. the machinery is there, enshrined in our oldest laws. a beautiful system of checks and balances. we just need to get together to work it.