Clear paper ballot counter, transporter and storage box

[kster]

Clear Automatic Paper Ballot Counter / ballot transporter / and ballot storage box, all in one?

Clear compartmentalized ballot boxes. Run an election for pennies!



1) No more electronic GLITCHES.
2) No more humidity problems.
3) No technical assistance needed to operate.
4) No problem if there is a power failure.
5) No special rooms for storing after an election.
6) Completely transparent, reusable multi-purpose stackable ballot box.


Items needed at polling place :

1) Flashlights, in case of power failure. People need to see to vote.
2) A couple of fans, to make people comfortable in case its humid outside.
3) Hand-held calculators to keep a count of the ballot box totals, to prevent ballot stuffing, and for reporting totals to the media. You know how they want their totals immediately.
4) Democrat, Republican and Independent observers. The more the merrier.


Instructions:

1) At the beginning of the day, place an empty ballot box into the voting booth.
2) When one of the four compartments gets full, remove from voting booth. If it is mostly filled with Democrat ballots put it on the Democrat table. If it is mostly filled with Republican ballots, it then goes on the Republican table.
3) Replace the full ballot box that you remove from the booth with another empty ballot box.
4) The Ballot boxes on these tables are the totals that you call into the media throughout the day.
5) Take plenty of pictures of the ballot boxes that are on these tables.
6) At the end of the day, add up the totals from all of the ballot boxes, and check to see if the ballot total matches the amount of voters that voted that day.
7) Call in these totals to the media. We now have a BALLOT TOTAL at the precinct level. Hopefully with plenty of photos.

Now they become ballot transport boxes:

Load up and transport the ballots to the central counting facility. With PLENTY of observers from all parties present, we hand count the ballots, with no rush, because we already have a general idea of who won.

When Winners AND losers are satisfied the election is complete..

Now they become storage boxes for the ballots. Transport the ballot boxes back to their community where they are stored, in these same ballot boxes, for the amount of time the state requires. After that amount of time the ballots are then recycled, and the boxes are then ready for the next election.

For the HAVA requirement for disabled voters



http://www.vote-pad.us/

Unless you like these machines that cost hundreds of thousands of dollars to have and to store, having Democratic votes stolen and the Republican party hijacked by a group of Neocon’s, AND HAVING YOUR VOTE COUNTED IN SECRET, then by all means, buy the electronic vote counting/scanning machines and have your ballot locked inside a machine that no one can see or worse yet, an invisible ballot recorded electronically.


But if you are concerned about the future of Democracy for your kids and grandkids, DEMAND to see the ballots EVERY STEP OF THE WAY. Most importantly, Don’t rely on a machine to count your vote IN SECRET. It’s your Country! Demand to WATCH AND/OR COUNT THE BALLOTS BY HAND, OUT IN THE OPEN WITH PLENTY OF OBSERVERS from all parties.



It was Joseph Stalin who said, "It is not he who casts the votes that matters, but he who counts the votes."

[Mr_Jefferson_24]

1. We really do need...

...something on the order of The Boston Tea Party where we heave touchsreen machines into the harbor.

[goclark]

6. Please read My Journal on organizing a Boston Tea Party

I believe this is the best way to spend the 4th of July!
Let me know what you think.

You can email me.

[Mr_Jefferson_24]

8. That's a great idea and should...

...be reposted on DU, and other Dem/progressive boards, at least once a week until July 4th. What would really be great is if we could get Dean to speak at one of them and some media coverage.

[goclark]

9. Here is the Link to the Boston Tea Party Idea

http://www.democraticunderground.com/discuss/duboard.php?az=show_mesg&forum=203&topic_id=424195&mesg_id=424195

I can try reposting it but I'll need some supporters to keep it going.

I'll be out of town tomorrow.

Email me if you have some creative suggestions that we could use.

Thanks

[Wilms]

2. I like it, except for steps 2-5.

Could they be eliminated, or is there a function they serve that I missed?

Step four is particularly troublesome as announcements while the polls are open can have a negative impact on turn-out.

[kster]

4. I'm easy

the rules aren't written in stone.

[goclark]

7. Exactly ~ what ever would need to be done

I see your idea as a Measuring Cup or one of those Coin Holder that you can look through and see instantly how many pennies,nickels,dimes you have.

I am sure the RepubliCONS would hate your idea because it is not made of OIL and doesn't grease the palm of Halliburton.

That's why I like it!

It is a PEOPLE MACHINE for THE PEOPLE to be able to get some idea what the score of the game was for them before they leave the stadium(polling place.)

[IndyOp]

23. Plastic *is* made of petroleum products & Halliburton can build them -

I would be OKAY with that one single contract to Halliburton. I don't think they could F* this up.

:kick:

[goclark]

31. If Halliburton got their hands on the plastic

I bet they could fix it so that the Democratic Votes would be magically melted by some type of sizzle stick. :crazy:

[msongs]

3. if we could just get the democrats to support it.....

that would be a start.

Msongs
www.msongs.com/political-shirts.htm

[goclark]

10. They need some POWER and some SPINES

to stand up to these vote stealers and take our country back.

[goclark]

5. Bravo for coming up with a plan

that would WORK if they wanted it to work.

I love the way you explained it, even I could understand your graphics. :)

You also made an excellent point about watching the ballots every step of the way.

In '04 I was working the polls. There was a Captain that was elderly and she was trying her best to organize everything that morning.

Well about 15 minutes later, in walks Miss Know It All. I have no idea who sent her all I know is that she took over!

After a long day,Miss KIA(Know It All) took over the ballots, directed all of us and became the one that took the ballots/in the box - in the back of her car to the Ballot Depository.

I will always remember that about 2 hours before the polls closed(heavily Democratic neighborhood) a first time voter came in crying. I was showing her the procedure for voting and noticed that she was in tears!

She told me,"They are saying on the television that Bush is winning!"

Of course I was shocked and disappointed but I remained professional.

When the brand new voter left, I mentioned to Miss KIA what had happened with the young girl. Her personality turned to ICE and she told me," We are not to discuss how anyone VOTES,we just do our job."

I agreed but inside I always remembered those tears on the face of the first time voter and I will always wonder why I didn't follow that car!

This is the first time that I have ever told this experience. it hurts to tell it but I needed to because the next time, I want to follow those ballots.

[kster]

11. Thank you

but I have to confess its my Daughters graphics, I explained what I wanted and there it is, With all the debates going on, I figured it would be a good thing to start getting a picture of what Paper Ballots Hand Counted could look like.

May not be a perfect plan but its a plan, got to start somewhere.

[goclark]

12. Talented daughter and talented Dad!

What will be your next step?

Keep us posted!

Good luck!!!!

[Mr_Jefferson_24]

13. It's impressive and the simplicity...

...of it is downright elegant.

[kster]

21. Its vote counting at a glance

everyone seems to be worried about the rapidity of counting votes, this is one idea probably out of many that can count paper ballots as fast or faster than e-voting. Simplicity and rapidity is what I was after, Thanks

[Monk06]

34. Paper is the way to go. BTW your story made my skin crawl>>>>

Canada has always had a paper ballot.

It's efficient poll result are available within hours
of polls closing except for recalls which are mandated
if a race is within several hundred votes.

Elections Canada runs the national elections and is
independent of government interference.

Here's the cost for the last national election.

Total cost

$277.8 million breakdown of expenses

Operations of local returning offices, including Election Day activities: $90 million

Pre-election activity, including staff training, maintenance of voter lists and systems readiness:$50 million

Election day delivery activities (public information) at the Ottawa office of Elections Canada:$35 million

Reimbursement for candidate election expenses and for registered political parties:$24.8 million Breakdown of expenses

Election delivery activities, including fees to election workers and poll officials, printing lists of electors, and renting offices of returning officers and polling sites:$108 million

Pre-election activity, including electoral material and supplies, the training of returning officers and other key staff. Maintaining the National Register of Electors since the 2000 general election, ad and outreach campaigns, support network and information technology support:$111.5 million

Reimbursements to candidates and parties according to new political financing provisions under Bill C-24:Estimated at $58.3 million


One change may be saving Canadians money. In 1996, Elections Canada began maintaining a National Register of Electors, rather than creating a new list each time through door-to-door registration. Elections Canada reports the change has saved $110 million to date.

With $110 million cost saving deducted by going to a permanent registry the bill comes to $167.8 million for an efficient and fair election. Multiple by 10 for the cost of this system in the US

[autorank]

14. Very proud to be #5! This is simply outstanding...it will come to this.

The 2006 train wreck of electile dysvunction is in full force, comming at the American electorate, thos who bother to vote. The other 50% will read about it in their papers; it will be too big not to cover.

This is great, imagine that. A verifiable, HAVA compliant item.

Congratulations and I'm bookmarking this puppy;)

[Greyskye]

15. K&R for thinking out of the box!

Or "inside the transparent box", in this case.

[kster]

32. E-voting companies have everyone thinking their way

is the only way to get a fast count, this is just a way to challenge that selling point, with this ballot box we can also have a fast count of the ballots, the difference we can take ours to the central counting facility and double check everything, with their system "not so much".

[rumpel]

16. love it! This needs a special front page spot.

k&r

:hi:

[kster]

22. That would be nice,

I appreciate that thought.

[crispini]

17. How does this preserve the secrecy of the ballot?

The voter would have to choose which of the four "buckets" to put their ballot in, correct? So the voter would be seen voting straight D, straight R or split. This would not preserve their right to cast a secret ballot.

[kster]

18. They would be in the voting booth

when they put their ballot into the box. No one would see what slot they put their ballot into.

[IndyOp]

24. You need to specify that each box is kept in a curtained booth -

The top is locked in a way so that no one can take any ballots out.

You can't get anywhere close to a close estimate on number in a close race by looking at the height of the stack - some ballots that have been handled will be 'puffier' - I know this because I give scantroon exams. I would suggest entirely separate boxes for Repubs, Dems, Indep, Split -- when one of the four (or more) fills up then that one is removed and the others remain until they are filled. One can then weigh them independently and weight can give a better estimate of # of votes in each stacker -- each ballot weighs a certain number of milligrams, so total weight divided by that value will get you a pretty close vote count until they are hand counted at a central location.

I love your *take lots of pictures* idea!!

[druidity33]

25. how can we be sure...

someone doesn't walk in with 200 filled out ballots in his pantsleg taped to his thigh? Could the boxes be already on scales so that if someone puts in something that weighs more than a few milligrams an alarm goes off? Or the slot can only fit 1 ballot and has an open and close button you can use only once?

This needs thinktank like attention...

[IndyOp]

26. I like it! The slot that fits only 1 ballot and has an open/close

slot that can only be used once. Simple mechanical solution works best!

[kster]

28. Because all the evidence (ballots)

is right there in front of us, thats how we would know, with the electronic vote counters someone could walk in with a card in their front pocket,slip it into the machine and change all the numbers and no one would know except the e-voting vendor.

One ballot at a time, good idea it would take alot of time to put 201 ballots in one at a time.

[druidity33]

29. yes

I agree with you that all machine counting (or as much as possible) should be eliminated. My concern however, is based on the fact that while voting WE WON'T be able to see what the voter is doing because they'll be in the voting booth. Hence my example of the thigh ballots.

Also, shouldn't we all be talking about Instant Runoff Voting too? If we're going to change the system, shouldn't we be changing everything for the better?

keep rockin' kster!

[CornField]

55. You wouldn't have to have them in each booth

Now many people mark in a booth and then walk across the room to feed into an OS machine. You could have booths for marking and a centralized booth for putting them into the box.

Also, when it comes to people bringing in additional ballots -- each precinct could be given a special sticker or stamper. When you sign in and get your ballot, the poll worker would place the 'marker' on your ballot. Any ballots without the stamp/sticker would be spoils.

ETA: You actually would not want the boxes in the voting booth -- at least not in a way where they could be seen by the person filling out the ballot. If they could be seen before a ballot was marked, they could influence how that individual votes.

[kster]

56. These are some good suggestions did you know

the clear ballot box is similar to how they did it in the past before the crooks convinced everyone that the sky would fall if we didn't have a quick ballot count.



Glass globe ballot jar
Like the slot-top wooden ballot box, this 1884 box with a glass chamber is typical of the devices used to secure single party tickets. The image of the glass ballot box became a symbol of democratic self-government

[Wilms]

19. Almost.

What kster proposes here would occur inside a booth. So it's secret in that way.

[katinmn]

20. Paper ballots and transparency. Excellent!

:thumbsup:

[kster]

30. Yes ,we can start right here

to find out more about compartmentalized ballot boxes. Think they would mind getting a multi-million dollar contract?


http://www.plasticfab.com/ballotbox.htm

[Amonester]

27. K&R ->Great ideas + room for improvements, but it's a...

really good start! (Now I'm gonna K&R the New Tea Party thread.)

Thanks! (Never Give Up! Fight The Good Fight For Real Peace!) :thumbsup:

[Mnemosyne]

33. Exactly! Thanks kster! n/t

[goclark]

35. This post is URGENT and MEANINGFUL ~

Somebody that can DO something and get this shown to John Conyers , Howard Dean.

Please step up to the plate
Help and keep it kicked until we find out what can be DONE.

[Bill Bored]

36. Did somebody say...

...transporter?

[kster]

37. Meanwhile, the master electronic vote tranporter

wizard is hard at work.


Will the starship enterprise get there in time to save democracy?

[goclark]

38. This device could outslick Rove ~ full steam ahead

Please keep this kicked for additional input.

Thanks

[kster]

40. Yes, and VVPB People, and the HCPB People, can get along now

because everyone gets exactly what they want, with this device.

[dchill]

39. Simplicity? Transparency?

That ain't gonna happen. Even the officials at the basic, local level want some way to shuffle the deck. Paper ballots that can be recounted will just make more problems for them. Remember, voter intent is what the media say it is. A video clip of a cross-eyed guy holding a chad up to the light means Democrats are losers - even if they won. Anyone who wants paper ballots is a spoilsport and a sore loserman. Quit whining and take your medicine - if you can afford it. Otherwise, just crawl off and die. It's all over but the counting, and they'll do the counting.

By the way, I love your ideas, and really hope something like your plan is implemented.

[goclark]

41. I love the idea too but what can we do to tout it~kick for ideas

[kster]

50. We can start by having a

a Boston Tea Party!

http://www.democraticunderground.com/discuss/duboard.php?az=show_mesg&forum=203&topic_id=424195&mesg_id=424195

And at that party we can figure out the best method on how to count the ballots by hand.

[kster]

42. Kick......... nt

[WillYourVoteBCounted]

43. special situation in NC

we have a weird straight ticket law in nc

straight ticket doesn't count for president or for judicial contests.

If you vote straight ticket, you still have to vote
for pres and judge separately.

We have alot of undervotes in NC because of this archaic law set
up by Dems, because we have a weird state that
votes for local dems and GOP president.

But keep on going. If this could permeate beyond the .5% of the public
and into the mainstream, we could get somewhere.

It takes time, but you have to keep going.

Providing real information like you are doing is the best tool
to persuade the decision makers.

[WillYourVoteBCounted]

44. Have you started a website for this?

There doesn't seem to be any single website dedicated to such a project.

there is a swiss company that markets a hand counting paper ballot system that is supposed
to be easy to use, even in US where the ballots are extremely complex and long.

www.swissvs.org

If folks in the US are serious, they need to volunteer to be available
anytime BOES have to do hand counts (when the machines flub) and
show they are willing to do the hard work that they prescribe.

someone has to show how its done, and that it isn't so bad,
and that it is worth it.

[kster]

49. The SwiSs voting site

has got some very intersting ideas on it,

Thanks

[BillORightsMan]

45. HCPB is the way - I'm missing something, tho'

I'm all for a Hand Count Paper Ballot! I like the clear boxes - TRANSPARENCY!!!
See Paper, Pen & People!


I guess what I'm missing is how each race is separated. In November we will have:

• US Senate
  
• US House
  
• OH Senate
  
• OH House
  
• OH Supreme Court (non-partisan)
  
• OH Court of Appeals (non-partisan)
  
• County Commish (and a few more county positions)
  
• Local Judges (depending on your locale - also non-partisan)
  
• Mayor and Council Seats (depending on your locale)
  
• Statewide Issues
  
• Countywide Issues (depending on your locale)
  
• Local Issues (depending on your locale)
  

HECK! I took me 10 min. to vote in 2004 and I how I was going to vote!

So would you have a separate clear box for each race, for each pricinct and ward? (Atsa lotta boxes!)
I like the idea, I'm just fuzzy how one would get the visual count about who won which race, as boxes fill up and are placed on the respective tables.

How would you create the paper ballot, like a tear-off for each race, maybe color-coded, where each part of the ballot is dropped in the respective bins?
(Add numbers, too, for the color-blind.)
An extra box for the unused tickets (undervote)? Maybe a shredder for this?
What happens if the voter drops the ORANGE (US SENATE) ballot in the LIME GREEN (local school levy) box? Sort this out during the hand count?
Then, in some judicial races they ask you to "pick two". How would this be handled?
And what about spoiled ballots?


Sounds like a step in the CORRECT direction. Recommended for good graphical representation and EXCELLENT content!

:patriot:

BTW, The regressives would NEVER go for anything like this (even HCPB) because they woud never win another election again!

[kster]

46. Thank you and Welcome to the DU "BillORightsMan"

Paper, Pen & PEOPLE!!! Good and Simple idea that the majority of people understand, thats why the Government, Dems and Repugs will never buy into it, They rather play the SILENCE GAME, so they can continue to steal elections.

I will give some answers/ideas on your questions about the clear ballot box, The clear ballot box is just an idea I had, that I posted so that it would get kicked around a bit.

Thank you for kickin it around.

:thumbsup:

[mmarcus]

47. I like it! What about ballots that aren't straight ticket?

See, that only works if someone votes a straight ticket all democrat or all republican. Or maybe I missed something.

[kster]

48. If you split up the ballot, it would go into the split slot.

as BillORightsMan points out there are kinks that have to be worked out, but the beauty part of this is that all the evidence (ballots) sit stacked out in the open for all to view, and count or recount.

With the $$$ we would save with this idea, we could give out College credits $$$ to any student or their parents that sign up to count the ballots.

[FogerRox]

51. nice idea, too good, almost--- LOL- KNR

[kster]

52. Coming from you

I am honored.

Thanks.

[goclark]

53. Bingo! Bingo! Bingo! This is the best!!!!

What can we do to make it happen? :bounce:

Why are we always complaining about the awful RepubliCONS and those god awful DIEBOLD Computer VOTE STEALING MACHINES?

Let's do something!

Is there someone with enough influence to get this to someone like Conyers or Michael Moore or even KEITH?

I think KEITH would be the perfect person because he loves visuals and he could than have the opportunity to talk about the fact that "some people feel the machines are ROVE FIXED!

I think you should be on Keith's Show with your marvelous patented idea!!!!!

Let's make it happen DU!

Nothing else is as important as ELECTION FRAUD, nothing!

[Stevepol]

54. GREAT IDEA!!

[kster]

57. Kick....nt

[kster]

58. kick.nt

[rumpel]

59. kick

:)

[mopinko]

60. find someone to make them

and sell them. make sure it is not someone with a propensity to fly small planes and drive steep mountain roads.

[kster]

61. kick....nt

[kster]

62. We don't need your secret vote counting machines!!

Kick.