Democratic Underground Latest Greatest Lobby Journals Search Options Help Login
Google

Sad News: PA Citizens Lose AGAIN -- Day #4 of Allegheny County PA Lawsuit

Printer-friendly format Printer-friendly format
Printer-friendly format Email this thread to a friend
Printer-friendly format Bookmark this thread
This topic is archived.
Home » Discuss » Topic Forums » Election Reform Donate to DU
 
demodonkey Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Apr-28-06 07:41 PM
Original message
Sad News: PA Citizens Lose AGAIN -- Day #4 of Allegheny County PA Lawsuit
REPORT FROM PITTSBURGH:

After stating the unusual circumstances this case generated (normally he would have time to re-read the entire hearing transcript and issue his opinion in writing), Judge Gary Lancaster proceeded to read aloud from a certified copy of his ruling to a nearly-full courtroom.

Basically, he stated that he had to consider 1) chances of success on the merits of the case, 2) whether or not irreparable harm was being done to the plaintiffs, 3) make sure the relief would not be worse than the problem (my wording of this), and 4) consider the public interest.

He opined that the plaintiffs were unlikely to succeed on the merits of the case, because Section 301 of HAVA provides no private right of action. 301 is not sufficient to create a private right of action because it creates no private remedy (the remedy is that the DOJ punishes the state or county and/or makes them return the HAVA funding.) The only recourse HAVA provides an individual voter is to file a complaint under the procedure laid out in Section 402.

He stated that the ES&S iVotronic is certified to meet Section 301 of HAVA and that 30-some Pennsylvania counties have chosen it.

He stated that the case is unlikely to succeed on the constitutional merits (saying that constitutional rights are threatened because of the strong possibility of disenfranchisement or problems at the polls with the iVotronic) because said problems may happen, or they MAY NOT.

In what was perhaps the most difficult statement for those of us who know these machines (and the slick demonstrations ES&S provides) to accept, Judge Lancaster indicated that he was convinced by the ES&S demonstration of the iVotronic during the hearing. He said that the machines appear easy to use; no worse than a ticket kiosk at Greater Pittsburgh Airport, or an ATM machine, both of which have been used by Allegheny County citizens for years.

As to the disability issues with the iVotronic, the judge stated that the ADA and Rehabilitation Act require only that the disabled voter be able to vote -- NOT that he or she must be able to vote privately and independently. No mention of HAVA's requirement on this matter.

Finally he stated that the Public Interest would not be served by halting use of the iVotronic in favor of staying with the lever machines. This would result either in the County not being able to hold a Primary at all, or if they held it on lever machines they would be in violation of HAVA. Either way the county would have to forego the $4 million in HAVA funding it was receiving to purchase these machines that (again) are certified as HAVA compliant.

So that was it. Once again, the big-money vendors and our county and state government (this time adding the Feds) have managed to quash the citizens in the Keystone State.

MB in PA

One local media report follows:

-------------------------------------------------------

Federal Judge OKs New Machines For Allegheny County Primary


PITTSBURGH -- A federal judge in Pittsburgh has ruled that Allegheny County can use new electronic touch-screen voting machines in the May 16 primary.

U.S. District Judge Gary Lancaster disagreed with several voters and the group People for the American Way who sued claiming there's not enough time to train poll workers to use the new machines. They said the machines also violate the rights of some disabled people.

But Lancaster, after a courtroom demonstration of the machines, said he is confident the machines purchased earlier this month are not too complicated for poll workers and voters to use so soon.

County officials had argued that they couldn't switch back to old mechanical lever machines in time for the primary. They also said not using the new machine would cost the county $4 million because that would violate the federal Helping Americans Vote Act.
"With today's ruling, we can now focus attention on having a successful election," said County Executive Dan Onorato.

MORE: http://www.thepittsburghchannel.com/news/9069921/detail.html#

Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
IndyOp Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Apr-28-06 07:48 PM
Response to Original message
1. It would be really bad form for me to wish that
the Judges' vote is eaten by his voting machine, wouldn't it?

:(
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
BeFree Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Apr-29-06 02:10 PM
Response to Reply #1
6. It might...
...eat his vote. But he doesn't care, he doesn't really believe in democracy, he trusts the government too much.

I would wager that his decision comes back around and bites him in the ass.
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
IndyOp Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Apr-28-06 07:50 PM
Response to Original message
2. DD - Did the case get to a point at which you could have a
computer security specialist testify? Or show video of rigging/hacking -- like Votergate? WESH-TV piece on Ion Sancho and the Hursti hack? Clinton Curtis' demonstration program? Or was that legally not allowable?

:shrug:

:cry:
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
flyingobject Donating Member (324 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Apr-28-06 09:01 PM
Response to Original message
3. this was a politically expedient decision
The judge had pressures to bear that made him decide this way.

Few judges will go against the grain on an issue like this.

You stood up, you refused to shut up, and you wouldn't go away.

It isn't over -


Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
Yellow Horse Donating Member (462 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Apr-29-06 12:43 PM
Response to Original message
4. K & R - this was a huge case with national experts testifying...
Not getting the attention it deserved.

Bad loss here.
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
Amaryllis Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Apr-29-06 12:58 PM
Response to Original message
5. MB, thanks for all your hard work here. You gave it all you had. Kudos for
that. :)
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
Kip Humphrey Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Apr-29-06 05:07 PM
Response to Original message
7. PA goes GOP in 2008, thanks to ES&S and the RNC - my prediction
Sorry Demodonkey. Seems clear PA is on the RNC shopping list for states to steal in '08. Looks like they are on their way.
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
demodonkey Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Apr-30-06 06:47 AM
Response to Reply #7
8. I believe it Kip, and the sad thing is that the DEMS are helping them...
Edited on Sun Apr-30-06 07:10 AM by demodonkey
Our so-called Democratic Governor Ed Rendell (and his Secretary of State Pedro Cortés) have a total "can't do" attitude when it comes to getting Voter-Verified Paper Records on the machines here. Even though they claim they are 'neutral', evidence shows otherwise. Appears that the Dems are joining the GOP behind the scenes to fight the proposed VVPR legislation, and doing all they can to publicly fight every effort the citizens make to hold back the tide of paperless DREs (such as knocking our lawsuits down.)

Many officials have swallowed the snake oil being peddled by the vendors and go way out of their way to spread false information. Just yesterday morning I spoke at a League of Women Voters Candidates' Breakfast. Immediately following me was one of our Democratic County Commissioners who showed the 'new' ES&S iVotronics he selected for us. Among many snake oil statements he made, he said that there is no Voter-Verified Paper system approved and legal for Pennsylvania. FALSE! Optical scan IS approved, legal, and has been used here for decades but HE -- a so-called Democrat -- chose instead to buy paperless DREs from ES&S.

ES&S, Diebold, Danaher, WINvote, Sequoia, and Hart (and the powers that control them) now 'own' PA -- but we are still fighting here and have not given up.

(On edit) Part of the problem: Amidst many "pro-life", "pro-gun" DINO-Democrats who spoke, one of the GOP candidates at the breakfast yesterday said that he wants to work for PA to become the Red State that it should be. I thought to myself, "you sure don't need too much help for that, buddy."
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
WillYourVoteBCounted Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Apr-30-06 03:51 PM
Response to Reply #8
9. Is there a trace to lobbyist money?
I am just wondering.

And, while you have had set-backs, you are now in position to do
some serious finger pointing in November.

Try to get the lobbying info and donations to lawmakers SOS etc.

Keep a running list of voting machine malfunctions in PA.

Keep writing and the reporters will be saying - the voting integrity advocates
told us so.

We will support you all we can, it is just a matter of time....
Printer Friendly | Permalink |  | Top
 
DU AdBot (1000+ posts) Click to send private message to this author Click to view 
this author's profile Click to add 
this author to your buddy list Click to add 
this author to your Ignore list Thu Dec 26th 2024, 03:56 PM
Response to Original message
Advertisements [?]
 Top

Home » Discuss » Topic Forums » Election Reform Donate to DU

Powered by DCForum+ Version 1.1 Copyright 1997-2002 DCScripts.com
Software has been extensively modified by the DU administrators


Important Notices: By participating on this discussion board, visitors agree to abide by the rules outlined on our Rules page. Messages posted on the Democratic Underground Discussion Forums are the opinions of the individuals who post them, and do not necessarily represent the opinions of Democratic Underground, LLC.

Home  |  Discussion Forums  |  Journals |  Store  |  Donate

About DU  |  Contact Us  |  Privacy Policy

Got a message for Democratic Underground? Click here to send us a message.

© 2001 - 2011 Democratic Underground, LLC