Please, I'd like to know more about the Central Tabulators

[kster]

We know the optiscan machines (the machines where you scan your paper ballot into a machine that counts and stores YOUR BALLOT) can be hacked, We also know the Touchscreen machine's can be hacked (for obvious reasons) Zero paper.

I haven't heard much about those Central Tabulators, where the secret vote totals from the optiscan and the touchscreen machines end up, to be tabulated in secret. MAYBE I WAS ABSENT THAT DAY.

ANYONE?

[lvx35]

1. I've got a big suprise for ya...

they can be hacked!

I remember seeing an article on it where it was demonstrated, I think by black box voting.

[kster]

3. OH my, who would have "THUNK"...... nt

[texpatriot2004]

2. Shh...it's a secret, it's proprietary, not just anyone is allowed to

know, you know.

[kster]

4. Oh, you mean Polticianprietary,

only the politicians are supposed to know, that the votes are being counted in secret. My lips are sealed.

But what about them central tabulators?

[texpatriot2004]

6. Exactly, about those central tabluators see those go right along

with the secret vote countin' software. Those tabulator thing-a-ma-jigs have several opening, like little doors, that are left wide open, you know, in a friendly, hospitably gesture to your other politician friends so that they can come on in any time, you know.

[AndyTiedye]

5. This is How the Tabulators Worked in the 2004 (s)Elections

[kster]

7. Posted by TorchesAndPitchforks

How Triad hacked
SUMMARY

This paper presents a simple formula that vote tabulation software can employ to steal an election undetected.

I will show that this algorithm is guaranteed to be immune from detection under all conceivable circumstances except one: a full hand recount in a precinct that was hacked. I will also show how the formula can be designed to significantly reduce this risk using publicly-available information. I will highlight some political and procedural ways that this risk factor can be further reduced.

This document is based on information regarding the tabulation software called ElecTab produced by Triad Government Systems, Incorporated. Triad software was used in many counties in Ohio that voted using punch card and optical scan ballots. This algorithm could be adapted to work with many others systems’ tabulation software.

more here.....

http://www.democraticunderground.com/discuss/duboard.php?az=show_mesg&forum=203&topic_id=337686&mesg_id=339752

[Ellipsis]

12. A "most excellent" post by TorchesandPitchforks!

Great find Kster !

[kster]

13. In that case I HOPE EVERYONE READS IT.....

Thanks btmlndfrmr.

[yowzayowzayowza]

8. FYI: Pretty much...

all machines can be hacked without appropriate controls.

[kster]

9. We don't have appropriate controls? We don't have checks and balances

in place, and still our government allows, and to date REMAINS SILENT ABOUT these machines that count and tabulate our votes?

Whats even more strange, not only are OUR votes being counted and tabulated in secret, but that would mean that there isn't appropriate controls or any checks and balances to count and tabulate their very own contest or race?

I could see the Politicians not being concerned about our votes and how they are counted and tabulated, but don't you think that they should be ve r-r-r y concerned about how their very own contest or race was being counted and tabulated?

THE POLITICIANS ALREADY KNOW WHO'S GONNA WIN BEFORE THE ELECTION, ITS THAT SIMPLE!! OTHER WISE THEY WOULD BE ALL OVER THIS BULLSHIT!!

[yowzayowzayowza]

17. Ya jus...

modify the forumula a lil, scatter 'em in the rite precincts and PRESTO: hacked HCPB.

[kster]

18. Please tell me you are kidding...nt

[FogerRox]

10. Its like this

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=HvwnJqLLgK8&mode=related&search=

[kster]

11. How do you think it works? Does the Politician (A) know

He or she is gonna be selected, prior to the election, so that he/she can get the speech together, or (B) is it sprung on him/her the night of the election?

Which way do you think it all plays out?

I'm going with (B) it looks better for the camera, when the Politician doesn't know till the last minute if he/she was
S-ELECTED by the secret vote counting machines.

How about you? ;-)

[diva77]

14. nah, it's A.

As I understand the way things are, with override capability of central tabulators and/or easter eggs, the fix is already in. would be interesting to go back and look at the election nite footage of some of the unlikely winners against popular incumbents of the past; maybe start an "academy awards" ceremony for some of those "winners"

[kster]

16. Academy Awards, I like that, no, I like that ALOT

We got to watch that big state California, which they (the criminal's) hope we have long forgotten about, but their recent past performance (Thanks Landshark) has exposed their corruption, but yet again nothing was done about it, Thanks Politicians, and our "GO GET THE STORY" media.

Can we have an Acadamy Awards for the media, they are a big part of this corruption.

[eridani]

15. In the WA 2004 gubernatorial election--

--we had a central tabulator machine count, a poll tabulators plus central tabulator for absentees count, and one hand count. All were within 0.01% of each other. (Too bad that was also the difference between the two candidates.)

Yes, they can be hacked, but they mostly won't be, any more than a house burglar is going to hit all the houses on one block. Fuckups are of course an option as well.

No excuse for having all this data proprietary, of course. And we should insist on far more stringent auditing requirements also.

I personally favor poll tabulators because you can check the number of ballots against the strip tallies, and because people can correct ballots that the scanner doesn't accept. With central tabulation in King County, each rejected ballot (usually because of ink blots from folding them and runnung them through a stamp cancelling machine, occasionally because assholes insist on displaying their talents as editorial cartoonists in the margins) has to be duplicated by hand by two poll workers, which is a really expensive hassle.

[Febble]

19. Well, what I would like to know

is: how easy is it to check that the precinct count matches the county tabulations?

I know that sometimes it isn't possible because precinct counts aren't available, and sometimes because (though I remain incredulous about this) it seems that precinct vote totals aren't broken out by absentee vote and votes cast at the precinct.

But it seems one thing that could be done, and I'd love to know if it is going to be done is that where possible, observers could simply note the precinct counts at the end of the day and check they match the central tabulations.

Or does do you guys do this anyway?

[BillORightsMan]

20. GEMS tabulator and the Dean Demo

Find out about the Diebold GEMS tabulator at Who's Counting
http://www.whoscounting.net/Technology.htm#B.%20Tabulators

Of course there is the famous (or maybe not-so-famous) Howard Dean Hack,
which was broadcast LIVE on CNBC
"The Howard Dean Demo" In Still Images

In early August, Bev Harris demonstrated to Howard Dean on CNBC how MS-Access can be used as a "hack tool" to alter votes in a way that precinct spot checking such as the California mandated 1% manual recount won't catch, even if there's optical ballots and a proper paper trail.

The implication is that even with a "Voter Verified Paper Trail", election tampering is possible with dishonest software such as the Diebold GEMS product - the central vote tabulator software in any Diebold voting system configuration (touchscreen or optical scan).

Here is the transcript from the show "Topic A with Tina Brown" that Howard Dean guest-hosted:
http://www.crocuta.net/Dean/Dean_Host_TopicA_Aug8_2004.htm

I hope this helps answer your questions about central tabulators being hacked.

imbillorightsmanandiapprovethismessage