"When Somebody Goes Wrong You Have To Help Them"

[Solomon]

Spiritual arrogance. My problem with "christianity."

[hobbit709]

1. They always want to do

something for your OWN good.

[Bluerthanblue]

4. key word-

help.

if you mean trying to force someone to do what YOU want them to, that isn't 'helping'-

On the other hand, if someone is doing something clearly wrong, and you look the other way, or enable them, then you are actually HURTING them.

i lived in an abusive marriage for 15 years, thinking that my 'submission' and 'obedience' and 'loyalty' was 'right- (not to mention the sub-concious notion that i didn't deserve anything else) and after i was free, after friends interviened and litteraly took me and my children away from him, it became clear that my 'love' my submission was in a twisted way enabling, and encouraging my ex to stay stuck, and never change.- i believed, if i waited long enough, was 'good enough' prayed enough, and lived as sinless a life as possible, "i" could 'save' him- or 'heal' him, when in fact i was doing just the opposite, and playing 'god'-

We can gently, but clearly try and 'help' people see places in their lives that are damagaging- and harmful- we can 'love' them from a distance, but to 'enable' or 'ignore' is every bit as wrong as to try and FORCE someone to change.-

We ALL have our own walk to keep our feet on, and we cannot impose our desires, or even accurate perspectives upon them.

like forcing 'freedom' on a nation, by declaring war on it.-

[Solomon]

5. Helping somebody is one thing. Butting in in the name of religion is

quite another.

[bertha katzenengel]

2. Hear, hear.

It makes me sick to think that I was once that arrogant. But keep in mind that (while this doesn't excuse the arrogance) some christians honestly do CARE about saving people from what they think happens after death. The specter of the christian-created hell is terrifying to them, and -- well, I used to cry for people who wouldn't accept Jesus, because I just knew they were doomed to eternal physical and emotional torture, not to mention permanent separation from the love of God.*

It's not an excuse - just pointing out a fact that I know from my experience.

Looking back, I wish that I had channeled that very deep concern into meeting peoples' needs in this life. My mother-in-law, Southern Baptist, has done that for years at her church, running their food pantry and clothes closet ministries. They don't preach at anyone. They don't "witness." All they do is give food and clothing to people -- anyone -- who need it. IMO that's true Christianity.

* Of course, among the many things that never occurred to me back then is that if he's a God of love . . . . Many C/christians just don't think.

[Solomon]

3. Agreed. I wish more people would walk the walk instead of talking

the talk.