Am I the only liberal Christian that ISN'T creeped out by the whole hands waving in the air thing?

[ButterflyBlood]

I see a lot of bashing of that here and was reading some comments by someone on another site summarizing a bunch of churches she was sampling that had that. I understand the connotations, it sort of reminds people of the blatant brainwashing in Jesus Camp and seems kind of cult-like. But really, I was thinking of all the secular music I go to, which consists of people jumping on top of each other, carrying each other threw the crowd, and slamming into each other and getting far more moved and I have to wonder what makes this so extreme. And for the record, the above happens for Christian music too (and no I'm not talking about the unbearable CCM crap everyone associates with Christian rock, more like this: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=GxkRXEijCxo)

And really, if I'm going to go to church, something I didn't do for years, I want there to be some type of passion. Honestly a bunch of people mindlessly reciting sayings led by someone wearing a white robe strikes me as far more cult-like and kind of disturbs me at a level beyond where it bores me. And honestly yes, it does feel like it lacks passion. I actually thought the girl in Jesus Camp who was mocking more mainstream churches actually had a bit of a point when she accused their services of just being souless reciting of something like "We worship you o Lord" over and over again. That's probably the only time in that whole movie I actually thought they were right about something.

I've just felt like a bit of an oddball lately. I obviously don't want to go to a church that preaches typical evangelical stuff but I don't want to go to one with Catholic-esque rituals either just because they might not be as backward on gays and have women priests, that still doesn't fix the root issue for me. Interestingly I appear to have found one with the charismatic-style worship (but no speaking in tongues mind you!) and a fairly progressive agenda, but it still just feels odd to me that more people aren't wanting places like this. I'm just wondering if I'm the only one here like this.

[LAGC]

1. I think there's something in the "God center" of our brains that yearns for acting out.

I've been to a charismatic church, and while I didn't agree with any of it, it was hard not to be caught up in the "spirit" of the crowd...

[Gman]

6. Like John Belushi in the church in The Blues Brothers movie with James Brown as the preacher

[Adsos Letter]

7. One of my absolute favorite segments of one of my absolute favorite movies.

"Dooo Youuuu Seeee the LIGHT!"

And a whole lotta' great dancing.

[laconicsax]

2. I'm an atheist who was creeped out by it exactly once.

I was subbing in a church band and one of the pastors did the gesture where you touch your hand to your heart, then hold it up over your head. The second part of that gesture was done very precise and ended with his hand and arm extended straight out similar to what you might see in parts of Europe in the 30s and 40s.

He didn't do it the same way during the second service.

As for the waving thing, it's just shared and imitated behavior just like the wave at a football game. It doesn't really mean anything; it's just something to do.

[saras]

3. I've always been creeped out by mass behavior, including sports and rock shows

[peace frog]

4. The arm wavers will looooove Matthew 6:5

"When you pray, you are not to be like the hypocrites; for they love to stand and pray in the synagogues and on the street corners so that they may be seen by men. Truly I say to you, they have their reward in full."

[Igel]

10. And yet . . .

It somehow misses the point.

Praying in public to be seen praying in public is condemned. Therefore, you pray in private to avoid the possibility of wrong intent and motive.

This leads to the question of prayers during synagogue services. It's fashionable among some sects to think that praying in a temple, synagogue, or mosque gets you more Prayer Points (tm) towards your next Divine Answer. That can easily become a show of righteousness. The easy way to avoid shows of righteousness is by praying in public; then there's no way for the intent to shift motives and intent.

What about prayers as part of a corporate entity or group? It's hardly going to happen that everybody's about to say grace and the person about to say it says, "I'll be back. I need to go to my private chamber." Or, "Let's all go to my private chamber." No, it's part of a group; there's nothing individual about it, which is the same for prayer as part of services, Xian, Jewish, or Muslim.

Then again, the Jesus narratives say as much in other places. Numerous times they show Jesus praying in public--giving thanks for food and blessing it, giving thanks for other things. If they show him doing it just to be seen, then he's a hypocrite. On the other hand, there are other reasons adduced for it.

People like reducing religion to a set of codes and behaviors not typically endorsed by the religionists themselves, and then accusing them of hypocrisy when they don't live up to the externally attributed to them. It greatly simplifies the thinking need, rendering it far simpler than possible. Oddly, this is considered a good thing.

[ButterflyBlood]

13. That's not the reason for me

The condemnation is against praying in public to appear righteous and all. But it's a church, as noted above, is everyone going to go to some private quarter during the service.

I can't sit still if moved by something. Chalk it up to my youth. But note this video as well: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=SgL7Fh6ZjnI

I was actually there. You can't see me because I'm too far to the left side of where the camera is shooting, but I was up front and there and acting like everyone else. And quite frankly, I think THAT'S how we should be worshipping. It's too bad I haven't found a church with that type of music (the band isn't Christian, but Christian bands that sound like them do exist.) or people acting that way. But I don't want to be just sitting in a pew or standing still if I'm praising my Lord. It's uninspiring, and it's a sacrifice of passion for the sake of ritual.

[riverwalker]

5. it's the "eye squeezers" that puzzle me

as though they are trying to force out a prayer, shoot it up to heaven. They seem to equate the tighter the eye squeeze, the more powerful the prayer. I am always baffled by them. Seems more like having a bowel movement than communion with God.

[kwassa]

8. Doesn't bother me at all.

My taste in churches is similar to yours.

[frogmarch]

9. Waving hands in the air doesn't creep me out

unless the wavers are holding snakes.

[Igel]

11. Or guns.

Or presumably pitchforks or nooses.

Come to think of it, these make "snakes" as an option look pretty attractive.

[darkstar3]

12. "Bashing"?

I haven't seen any bashing of this phenomenon here. I'm beginning to think too many here like to overuse the word...