Memo to Religious People: Many Atheists Don't Want to Hear That Their Loved Ones "Are in Heaven"

[SecularMotion]

New Group for Non-Believers Helps Atheists Grieve


How do you deal with death -- your own, or that of people you love -- when you don't believe in God or an afterlife; especially when our culture so commonly handles grief with religion in ways that are so deeply ingrained, people often aren't aware of it?

A new online faith-free grief support group, Grief Beyond Belief, is grappling with that very question. And the launch of the group, along with its rapid growth, presents another compelling question: Why do so many atheists need and want a separate godless subculture... for grief support, or anything else?

Grief Beyond Belief was launched by Rebecca Hensler after the death of her 3-month-old son. Shortly after Jude's death, she discovered Compassionate Friends, an online network of parents grieving the deaths of their children. But even though Compassionate Friends is not a religious organization, she says, "I often felt alienated by assurances from other members that my son was in heaven or by offers to pray for me, comforts that were kindly meant but that I do not believe and cannot accept."

http://www.alternet.org/belief/152028/memo_to_religious_people%3A_many_atheists_don%27t_want_to_hear_that_their_loved_ones_%22are_in_heaven%22_--_new_group_for_non-believers_helps_atheists_grieve/

[Ineeda]

1. I will never forget

how angry I was at my husband's remembrance gathering when someone said, 'he's in a better place.' Although this person was well-intentioned, I knew that my husband's 'better place' was with me and his friends and children, healthy and whole, with many years yet to live.

[arcane1]

7. Pat Tillman's brother let loose on McCain during the funeral

for doing the same thing: giving a speech at the funeral about how Pat was in heaven looking down on everyone.

[GKirk]

17. I suppose that would bother me too...

...especially for a spouse who passed to soon or a child. Not so much when an elderly parent passes.

[dmallind]

2. ....and to cover in advance the "how rude - just accept they are trying to be nice" canard

Consider how your deeply religious relatives/friends would feel if a devoted ecologist "comforted" them after your death by saying, with all sincerity and kindness, that at least your rotting body will now provide nutrients for hosts of maggots and worms, thus continuing the life cycle.

And the difference is that's at least true.

[unblock]

6. ++

[yodermon]

10. .. and i find that much more comforting, actually. n/t

[dmallind]

11. Well me too, but in our irrational society it would cause much more angst than "better place"s nr

[cleanhippie]

3. I don't think many believers are on the distribution list for that memo.

Asking them to refrain from comments like that is an infringement of their liberties, don't ya know?

[frebrd]

4. An enthusiastic K & R!

Thanks for posting.

[Cirque du So-What]

5. I've come up with a plan for discussing death with relatives & friends of the deceased

'I am sorry for your loss.'

EOM

It's a very good plan, and I stick to it religiously (in a manner of speaking).

[Permanut]

8. These traditions are so deeply ingrained

in our culture that it's almost an automatic response. If people are indeed trying to say something comforting, it's not fair to just piss on them like they're trying to cause further pain. Their attempts at empathy are poorly done and badly misplaced, but genuine nonetheless.

These traditions will take time to change, but they are changing.

[trotsky]

13. Wouldn't you agree...

that a good way to help change those traditions is to post in a somewhat public forum how it harms those you're trying to console? As opposed to "pissing on them" when they are in the actual act of trying to comfort?

[Permanut]

14. Agreed, Trotsky,

Upon re-reading my post, it looks way more harsh than I intended. Poor choice of words on my part. The point is well taken, as is yours. A public forum like this is an excellent vehicle to encourage changes in outmoded traditions.

[LuvNewcastle]

9. It makes me nervous as hell to be

around grieving people because I'm afraid of saying something stupid or offensive. When a member of my family dies, there's usually a lot of ladies who bring food for us. When I go through the line to give my sympathies to the mourners, I usually ask them if they've eaten. I don't know what else to say.

[provis99]

12. actually, little things like that tend to matter to mourners.

Just getting help on things to do with the funeral, or taking over some of the burderns of ordinary life while they prepare for a funeral, do a lot to help mourners; more anyways than some tool in the line saying "He's with Jesus now!".

[LuvNewcastle]

15. Well that makes me feel better.

Thank you.:)

[jeff47]

20. Another thing that always works:

"I'm sorry".

[LuvNewcastle]

21. I don't like saying that I'm sorry when

I haven't done anything to cause the situation. It just sounds sort of reflexive.

[jeff47]

25. One can either be sorry for causing the situation, or one can be sorry for the situation

Causation is not required.

[stopbush]

16. Believers say such things because it's all about them, not the deceased person.

I lost my MiL in April. She was a vocal non-believer.

At her wake, friends and relatives offered a few words of remembrance. Everything was fine until my BiL's ex got up and read something she had written about my MiL being in heaven with Jeebus. The room went quiet with the same embarrassed stillness one gets when they let out a rasping fart as they're saying their wedding vows. You could tell by everybody bowing their heads or looking away that the room wished she'd just shut thefuck up.

[ThoughtCriminal]

18. I hope so too

But I also find myself hoping that Batman defeats the Joker.

[MountainLaurel]

19. Want to send this

To the hospice manager who just couldn't believe that my aunt didn't want a religious component in her husband's memorial service.

[frogmarch]

22. I see why certain religious

comments could be offensive to some atheists - including your-loved-one-is-looking-down-from-heaven comments - but when I know such comments are meant to be comforting, I don't let them get to me. My sister and her husband recently died a few weeks apart, and I appreciated their friends trying to console me, even though much of what these friends said was religious in nature. If, on the other hand, someone had come up to me and said, "I hope you find solace in knowing that Vee and Don are now worm fodder," I have cold-cocked the bastard.

[struggle4progress]

23. Any emotion can be converted into anger: grief frequently is. So bad reactions from

the bereaved are common

Once the wife of a friend of mine was killed in an auto accident. I went to the hospital to support him. His in-laws were there. I had liked her and was sorry to see her go. Her father understandably didn't handle the death of his daughter well. Finally he started screaming at me that they didn't want or need me to tell them what to do -- but I hadn't tried to tell any of them a single thing about what to do. He was hurting and so he lashed out. I stood there and listened to him until he stormed away. If I were smarter maybe I would have handled it better, but I think he might have shouted at me until he was all shouted out, no matter what I did or didn't do or said or didn't say

She was in her early thirties, killed by a drunk driver. It's unfair. It's natural to be angry about it

[darkstar3]

27. Yes it is, and the basest rule for friends and family is: don't aggravate it.

I think this OP serves as a PSA, not just for generally "spiritual" people, but for people of all faiths and none. If the bereaved agrees with your worldview, and you know that, it's natural to offer words of comfort along those lines. If there is doubt, your words should be chosen more carefully. You should never assume that their view is yours, nor should you kick someone when they're down.

[rug]

24. Is there a way that the atheism of a mourner is known?

[struggle4progress]

26. If I'm at a funeral, and during a hymn one of the mourners starts shouting that

religion is just another way scam-artists take money from suckers, I generally try to be sensitive enough not to tell that person the deceased is smiling down from heaven

But it's usually not that easy to tell, since atheists are usually normal folk just like most everybody else

:shrug:

[darkstar3]

28. Read #27.

[rug]

29. That really doesn't answer the question.

If an atheist keeps his or her views private, it should be neither surprising nor offensive that a common response will be like the one described in the OP. It's difficult to defer to, let alone respect, the views of another if they renmain hidden. What's interesting is that this essay was sparked by remarks posted on the internet from presumable strangers.

[darkstar3]

30. Again, you refuse to acknowledge the problem of assumption.

Why do you assume that your religious-based remarks fall in line with the worldview of the bereaved? Why can't you just keep it simple?

[rug]

31. It's very simple.

Daily life revolves around assumptions. You are asking peoplw assume a mourner is an atheist, and to therefore avoid a mention of common conventioal words of solace on the statistically small chance that the griever is an atheist and on the statistically smaller chance that the person will take offense. If you expect to take offense at an innocuos remark from a person who fails to assume you are an atheist, at least have the integrity of not hiding your views in the first place. I hope you never sneeze in my vicinty.

[darkstar3]

32. Wrong.

Would you tell a Muslim that the dead person is "with Jesus now"? Would you tell a Hindu, who believes in reincarnation, that the dead person is "in a better place"?

Your egocentrism is unbecoming. Catholics and Christians may be interchangeable with regard to their "words of solace", but that doesn't apply to the plurality of faiths, and lack thereof, that can be found in this nation, let alone the world. It's not about avoiding certain words on the "off chance" that you might offend someone, it's about having the self-awareness to recognize that not everyone thinks like you do.

Or you could just barrel through life not caring that your words might be offensive, even in cases where emotions and tensions run high and your boorishness might be far more hurtful than normal.

[rug]

33. In order,

if i knew he was a Muslim, no.

If I knew he was a Hindu, no.

Nor would I discus vultures with a Farsi, if I knew he was a Farsi.

Meanwhile, you have not addressed the question of why you would keep your own atheism hiddren from people who know you well enough to give you words of consolation, regardless of whether those words cause you to bristle.

To expect the world at large to defer to your hidden unspoken values is itself the very height of egocentrism.

[darkstar3]

34. Assumption again. Where did I say I was hiding my atheism from people who know me well enough?

Where did anyone say that? Read upthread about how religious people have offered entirely egocentric words when they were fully aware of the views of the deceased and the bereaved.

That straw in your hand won't help you.

[rug]

35. Simple.

If you had shared your views with them, and they cared enough to give you sympathy, why would they disrepect your views?

Besides, you've posted often enough how you do not jeopardize contracts by discussing atheism.

[darkstar3]

36. Oi. Contracts are generally not with family and friends.

And they would disrespect my views, as they have in the past, becuase they believe theirs are superior. Sound familiar?

[rug]

37. I'm sorry they disrespect your views.

I doubt they would get anything out of the OP.

[laconicsax]

42. Wow, so if you didn't know they were Muslim, Hindu, etc., you'd go right ahead?

No wonder you don't get it.

[darkstar3]

43. Thank you.

Somehow, in my quick draw response, I missed responding to that, and the thread got away from me.

[trotsky]

44. Bingo.

Yup, assume they're Christian just like you!

And they say atheists are the ones who are disrespectful.

[rug]

50. Yeah, if I had an inkling they believed and would find it comforting.

And you? You'd use a death attack religios belief? No wonder you don't get it.

[laconicsax]

54. You say that if you knew they were Muslim or Hindu, you wouldn't...

But if you didn't know and "had an inkling they believed" you'd go right ahead and insult them.

Astonishing, rug.

[rug]

55. You have a curious view of insults.

Bless your little heart.

[laconicsax]

60. So telling a Muslim that the recently deceased is with Jesus wouldn't be an insult?

You just said that you'd say as much if you didn't know they were Muslim and "had an inkling they believed."

Assuming that everyone shares your beliefs is bigoted.

[rug]

61. Rearranging words to fit a prefab argument

is stupid.

[laconicsax]

64. Don't be so hard on yourself. n/t

[trotsky]

46. Would you ask a male coworker about his girlfriend...

if you didn't know he was gay? I mean, if he hasn't bothered to come right out and tell you he's homosexual, then you can assume he's straight just like you, right?

[rug]

51. Would you equate sexual orientation with an intellectual conclusion?

Anyone else you'd like to hide behind?

[trotsky]

53. I'm just curious if you assume everyone is like you.

You've demonstrated the answer. Thanks.

[LeftishBrit]

70. If the 'intellectual conclusion' leads to discrimination, yes.

Many people have been blacklisted for jobs, imprisoned, even tortured or executed for what you call 'intellectual conclusions': atheists and 'blasphemers'; members of minority religions; political dissidents. It's not a triviality. If you think that atheists do not suffer discrimination or abuse for being atheists, then say so. Indeed, I *haven't* personally where I live in England, though religious right-wingers have had some seriously undesirable influences on politics even here, though considerably less than in America.

But calling a belief or non-belief an 'intellectual conclusion' does not make any actual discrimination or abuse less important. One cannot force oneself to believe that something is true when one doesn't, any more than a gay person can force themselves to be straight. Let's note that some people minimize homophobia on the same sort of grounds: e.g. 'You can't equate a sexual lifestyle with skin colour!'

What is important is the level of discrimination or abuse, not the basis/excuse for it. Would you defend persecution of Christians in the countries where it occurs on the grounds that 'it is an intellectual conclusion'?

[PassingFair]

59. Rule of thumb: If they are sitting in a CHURCH, with organ music blaring...

it is probably OK to mouth Christian platitudes.

In a funeral home, not so much.

[NMMNG]

38. Just more evidence of the smug privilege in our society

So many people just presume everyone is a straight Christian just like they are. If the other person doesn't come right out and say they aren't, it's that other person's fault if the straight Christian says something presumptive ("your dead grandma is in a better place"). If the other person *does* come right out and say they aren't they're "flaunting it", being "anti-Christian", or whatever.

Damned if you do, damned if you don't, just plain damned if you're not part of the privileged yet somehow also persecuted majority.

[darkstar3]

39. Thank you for getting it.

[NMMNG]

40. As a lesbian atheist

I can't help but get it. I see it every day of my life.

[trotsky]

45. And straight white male Christians never will. n/t

[cleanhippie]

52. "it's about having the self-awareness to recognize that not everyone thinks like you do."

Bingo! We have a winner!

[Odin2005]

41. When my stepdad died of panceatitis...

All the "he's in heaven now, probably fishing with his dad" comments meant to comfort folks just made me want to cry even harder because I don't believe in an afterlife. :(

[SwissTony]

47. I'm an atheist and don't have a problem with such sentiments.

Generally, such sentiments are meant for more than one person at a time and may mean something to someone else. If it was addressed to me personally, I'd (gently) tell the person that I don't believe. And probably roll my eyes.

I once had a nun offer to pray for me. I told her I was an atheist and she said she'd pray for me twice!! I thanked her because her intentions were good.

[ATLdemocrat]

48. I'm an atheist and don't consider it insulting at all

They believe a certain thing and are displaying their condolences in the only way they know how. Being offended by the way someone offers condolences is a great way to ensure you never have any friends, but this is all just my opinion on the matter.

[Iggo]

49. In fairness, most of us don't wear an atheist uniform.

I can tell the difference between someone who's throwing me a stock condolence phrase and someone who's pushing their religion on me while I'm grieving. They're usually family members anyway. And after 5 decades, I can see 'em coming a mile away.

[Meshuga]

56. Memo to anyone...

Death is viewed differently among religions (and sects within religions) and obviously viewed differently by non-believers of whatever (or all) afterlife beliefs there are out there. In other words, there is a chance that you might say something that the grieving person doesn't want to hear. So, the best approach (in my opinion) is to use caution.

The article merely states the obvious that an atheist grieving group is the most appropriate grieving group for atheists. The same goes for Jews, Catholics, etc.

[darkstar3]

57. Normally, I'd just post a smiley like the applause one here,

but I feel I have to ask: Didn't I basically say that above?

[Meshuga]

58. Pretty much. n/t

[Deep13]

65. Grieving group? My friends and family have various religions...

...or none. I can't really avoid them if they don't see it the way I do. I'm related to them so I'm pretty much stuck with them. All I would ask is not to assume that whoever one is talking to believes what that person believes about an afterlife.

[Meshuga]

66. I understand but...

The article presented by the OP talks about a grieving group (support group outside your friends and family circle) and what would be appropriate for atheists. Family and friends are what they are and you get what you get from them depending how understanding (or not) they are.

[Deep13]

62. Really, there's something condescending about that...

...demeaning, even. It's as if ones grief for the loss is somehow misplaced or even illegitimate because, after all, the deceased is in "a better place."

[raccoon]

63. I agree. I hate all those stupid platitudes. Just say, "I'm sorry for your loss."

[ZAROVE]

67. Ofence Is More For Personal Reasons Than Reality.

I always wondered why Atheists consid3er themselves as Not being Religious or we have to now say “people of all Faiths or None”. Its pretty obvious that I've said before that Religion and Theism are not Synonymous, and religion is just our beliefs about the world. If someone is a Secular Humanist, rather than not be Religious, they are Religious. Secular Humanism is as much a Religion as anything else.

This is why some (Not all) atheists are really offended by words of Solace as well. It really makes no Logical sense to be insulted by someone saying “They are in a Better Place” or some other platitude. But it contradicts the persons “Not a Religion” to think of someone as having an afterlife. The Atheist who is offended by someone telling them this is offended not because the other party is insensitive, or even because its insulting to think of a Loved One in an Afterlife, but simply because the Atheist is adamant that no such a place exists. Its no different than an Atheist who is offended by someone praying in Public or an Atheist who is offended by someone mentioning God.

I once had an Atheist yell at me for simply saying God had helped me in a particular situation.

Its less that what I said was actually offensive, and more that they just wanted me to blindly conform to their own “Worldview”, which I still contend is a useless word made up because they are just as offended when you call them Religious.

I agree with the sensible Atheists here. People do not offend me when they speak out of heir Faith even when I do not share them. I've had Wiccans offer me rituals and I've had Mormons offer me certain Prayers in Temples for losses. I am not a Wiccan nor a Mormon, but I don't see way its so offensive. I also don't get why so many people are offended by Mormons Baptising by Proxy their dead Relatives or Friends. I mean, if you really just don't believe in it then they just dunk someone you never met before in a tank of water in some temple somewhere and that is that. People are offended less because of the actions and more because “Gosh! They don't believe the same things I do! How DARE they mention this!” Its all rather silly.




That said, Muslims actually shouldn't be offended by saying “He's with Jesus Now”. Muslims believe Jesus was a Prophet and is now in Paradise. Its as offensive to them as saying “He's with Abraham now”, or “He's with Muhammad Now.”

Hindu's may believe in Reincarnation but they also believe the Soul must first go into another Realm beforehand. It snot like your Reincarnated the very moment you die.

Saying to a Hindu “He is in a better place' just means he is rewarded for a good life now before he is sent back to Earth.

Plus, even if he was reincarnate the Moment of his Death, he may still “Be in a better place” if the next life is better than this one was.

No that it matters, as I tend not to get offended by Sincere offers of consolance.

[laconicsax]

69. Umm...Do you realize that offense IS a personal issue?

People take offense at things for personal reasons. That's reality.

[ZAROVE]

71. Personalas

But my poitn is, the reason they are offended is because they don't liek the fact that peopel disagree with them personally and it has nothign to do withhte deceased.

A Mature Adult accepts that when someone of a different beleif tries to comfort you but does so in the context of their beleifs, this is not offensive. Only the really intolerant sort must force complaince on all levels or be offended that someone wants to pray for you or says a dead relative is with God or some such.

[laconicsax]

73. Oh, the irony...

"Only the really intolerant sort must force complaince on all levels or be offended that someone wants to pray for you or says a dead relative is with God or some such."

[ZAROVE]

74. Irony?

This is only Irpony if you can show how I try to force my beelifs onto others...

[laconicsax]

75. It's ok, I don't expect you to understand.

You have the privilege of the majority. That makes it very difficult to understand the position of the minority.

[ZAROVE]

76. Majority Minority

Majority or Minority it doesn't matter. I would not feel offended if a Wiccan told me they'd hold a circle or do a ritual for me in my grief, even though I am not a Wiccan. I'd not care if a Mormon told me that they would hold some sort of Temple service or prayer to Heavenly Father even though I am not a Mormon. I'd not care if a Catholic said they'd hold a Mass for the deceased even though I am not a Catholic. I just don't see why people have o be quick to be offended just because someone else offers them comfort and tries o help, even if you do not share those beliefs.




Would it really be better if I screamed the Wiccan that magic doesn't work or a the Catholic for believing in Purgatory?

[laconicsax]

77. That you separate out Mormonism and Catholicism shows that you don't get it.

Assuming that everyone shares your beliefs because it's the majority view is bigoted.

[ZAROVE]

78. Majority Again?

Lac, I didn't dingle out Mormons and Catholics, and my point is the opposite of what you said. I don't assume everyone shares my beliefs, if I did then there would be no Mormons or Catholics to trouble me. My point was that even though Mormons and Catholics exist and offer comfort out of the context of their belief system, I am not offended by them doing so. I am likewise not offended by Wiccans doing so. Why should I be?

How is accepting that people have different beliefs than mine and tolerating them a bigoted assumption that everyone's beliefs are the same as mine?

How is Graciously accepting their condolences even form the context of their own beliefs Bigoted?


How on earth is not being offended by them proof that I assume the Majority share my beliefs?

Also, I am not in the Majority where I live. I live in Tennessee, which is mainly Baptist. I am Church of Christ. The two are actually very, very different. Most Christians here are of the Evangelical/AFA Variety, and I am not.

That doesn't mean I am offended when they speak out of the context of their own beliefs.

[laconicsax]

79. Mormons and Catholics are Christians, as are Baptists and Church of Christ.

You don't get it. Plain and simple.

[ZAROVE]

80. Of Course Catholics Are Christians But Wiccans Aren't...

Lac, I never said Catholcis weren't Christians, and with Mormons it really depends on how you define "Christian". Because, even wthout it beign hateful one can legitimatlkey say that a Polytheistic Religion that beleives you can become a god and that rejects jesus as beign God himself is not actually Christian.

But even if you accept Mormosn as Christian, what ourpose does thta serve here?

Its not liek Catholics and Mormons have the same beelifs as each other, or as baptists. Baptists and Church of Christ are also very, very different.


Furthermroe, I did not single out Mormosn and Caholcis laone, I also mentioend wiccans, Hindu's and Muslims, whoa re most assureldy not Christians.


The poinrt I was making is that I am not offended when a Catholic yes Christian says a Mass for a deceased Loved one who was not Catholic. I also find no reason to be upset if sa Wiccan decides to hold a Ritual regarding the same Dead Loved one who was not a Wiccan.

If a Muslim decides to offer prayers for the Family at Mosque, I am equally not offended.

I am not offended if a Secular Humanist says "I am sorry do ryoru loss" and decides to hodl a private memorial at a Humanist Hall.

Why woudl I be?

The point wasless that I'm sayign "Catholcis and Mormosn are not Christian' but rather I'm sayignt hat even though peopel have different beleifs than I do I am not offended by them when they offer me solace.

So rather than try to distort what I'm sayign as if I mean somethign uttelry different, try to get he real message fromw hat I'm saying.

That is, peopel shoudl;n't be so easily ofended by these sorts of things.

[laconicsax]

81. Sigh...

Look, you seem sincere in your desire to understand this, so try the following:

Spend a week imagining that you're not Christian. Notice the constant inundation of Christianity that non-Christians have to suffer through, multiply it by a lifetime, and then imagine that someone close to you dies and a well-meaning Christian comes up to you and says "they're with Jesus now" or some other similar line. Think about how now, when the last thing you want to deal with is another reminder of where you stand in society, that's exactly what you get. Then tell me that it wouldn't bother you in the slightest.

[ZAROVE]

82. I Like How Disagreement Means I Can't Understand You...

Lac-


Look, you seem sincere in your desire to understand this, so try the following:

Spend a week imagining that you're not Christian. Notice the constant inundation of Christianity that non-Christians have to suffer through, multiply it by a lifetime, and then imagine that someone close to you dies and a well-meaning Christian comes up to you and says "they're with Jesus now" or some other similar line.


The Irony is, the “Their with Jesus Now” line seems to be more common from Atheists in this thread who critisise it...

that said, I don't really have to Imagine I'm not a Christian. All I have to do is think back to Times when I was in a predominantly non-Christian environment, EG when I spent Time with a lot of Jews in a predominantly Jewish Community.



Think about how now, when the last thing you want to deal with is another reminder of where you stand in society, that's exactly what you get.

Why is this a reminder of where I stand in society, exactly?

I don't take a common platitude such as, in this example ( which I never heard in real life) “their with Jesus now” as an attempt to put someone in a social strata. Just like when Jews prayed the Shiva and I was there I didn't feel particularly alienated.


What your saying is that I should somehow feel alienated from society because I am an Atheist and they are Christians who dare to you know, act like Christians. That's pretty well where I find the offensiveness of this barmy. How do you expect a Christian to act? Must they do he generic “ I am sorry for your loss” and never mention their own beliefs at all? And how exactly is it offensive for them to say something out of a genuine attempt to comfort me even if I don't believe the same thing?


Its not that I don't udnertssnd it becaue Im a Christian and have never been in this situation. I do understand it and think its just people traini themselves to be offended for no other reason than people don't agree with them.


By the way I have the same problem when Christians act this way and become offended if somehow a Muslim offers them traditional Muslim prayers.

I find the reason behind the offence to be really just a sort of arrogancy that somehow everyone has to express their condolences in accordance with how you'd prefer them to be.

But I don't see how they are being actually offensive and having been a Minority in a community its still not really all that offensive to me.



Then tell me that it wouldn't bother you in the slightest.

It didn't when it actually happened to me, so I can.

[laconicsax]

83. Sorry, but you don't understand it.

It's glaringly obvious from your comments that you don't understand the situation.

[ZombieHorde]

84. If a Christian died, I would tell his Christian family he is "in oblivion" now.

If I was a Tibetan Buddhist, I would not tell his family he is in the Bardo, and will be reincarnated in a few days.

If I believed in the ancient Greek theology, I would not say he is in the underworld now.

When I am interacting with people who are grieving in real life, I try to be considerate.

[Manifestor_of_Light]

68. I didn't have a funeral for my mom because my aunt harangued me about jesus.

i called my aunt, mom's little sister, to tell her mom had died. This woman is a staunch Republican Methodist. She gave me a commercial for jesus and said "I urge you to believe". I told her that my mom, my dad and her own mom (My grandmother) were ALL atheists when they died. They said they would not exist after death, and they were down with it. They had made peace with their beliefs.

The aunt was horrified. She said "When you have a funeral, I want to be there". I was so offended by her pushiness that I did not have a memorial service for mom, I just had her cremated as she wished. This was back in 2002.

:banghead:

[LeftishBrit]

72. I do not mind a well-meant remark of this nature from a religious person BUT..

where I live, there is great diversity of belief: Christians, Jews, Muslims, many atheists. I can accept that people are all trying to give me comfort from their different perspectives. If everyone but me believed in God and Heaven, then such remarks would probably make me feel even more isolated in my bereavement.

What I find most upsetting is any exhortation as to how I should act or react, e.g. 'You must be strong for your mother' when my father died, or 'You must accept death as a part of life' or 'You need to express your feelings and not bottle them up', etc. For me, it just adds to the guilt often associated with grief. This would include religious exhortations, but I have never received any - I have heard 'He/she is in a better place' and 'I will pray for you', which I took as well-meaning words of comfort, but never 'You should ask God to comfort you' or 'This is the time for you to turn to God'.