Christianity and Socialism

[DemOhio]

The rule is that the culture changes the religion, the religion doesn't change the culture. The God worshiped in the high-end suburbs of Connecticut is very different from that of the Appalachian mountains. With this understanding, is the capitalist culture of this country changing religion to one that favors the rich and wealthy at the expense of everyone else?

The right wing meme, especially since 2008, is that socialism (or any taxes for that matter) is most assuredly anti-christian. We have heard that there is NO WAY the two are compatible. Is that the reality? Or, is that just the capitalist class stating it in order to make socialism (or anything close to it) seem undesirable? After all, these are the people who tell you that your very soul is tried into supporting a political party.

Christianity and Socialism were not always separate, competing entities. During the Gilded Age, when poverty was seen as a sin and churches left the poor parts of town in favor of the rich, social justice started to become popular with the urban poor. Christianity and socialism worked together.

Many Christians believed that socialism was a way to bring the social gospel of God to the country. The popular saying was, "Follow the golden rule and not the rule of gold."

What do you think: will there be a revival of this philosophy as we are approaching a new Gilded Age?

If you are interested in learning more, here are a couple of amazing books on the topic. Both written by Professor Jacob Dorn.

Washington Gladden: Prophet of the Social Gospel (1968)

Socialism and Christianity in Early 20th Century America (1998)

[Name removed]

1. Deleted message

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[beam me up scottie]

4. And what does history prove about christians when they come to power?

Do you think your guys stopped torturing and killing non-christians (or even the wrong kind of christians) because it was the right thing to do?

[DemOhio]

6. People kill

and torture regardless of religion.

[beam me up scottie]

7. That's not what I asked. n/t

[Name removed]

8. Deleted message

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[RZM]

2. I think what you are actaully getting at

Are the enormously different ways people can interpret ANY religion.

Of course the 'prosperity gospel' etc. is an attempt to co-opt religion, but 'liberation theology' and the emphasis of the 'social gospel' aren't so different either (witness the Soviet-backed 'Living Church' in the 1920s, which in many ways presaged the later liberation theologists in Latin America). And so on and so forth. Truth is, just about everybody believes that God is on their side. And even when they don't (such as the Soviets and the Nazis), they at least try to convince believers of that fact or at the very least shoehorn their own perspectives into a religious context.

Also, I take issue with the first line of your post. Religion not only changes culture, in many cases it is the foundation of culture. To stick with the Russian example, imagine if Russia had become Catholic in the 10th century instead of Orthodox. Think how radically different Russian culture would be, let alone world history. Or if Iran hadn't become Shi'a in the 16th century? Or if the US founding fathers had all converted to Islam?

[DaveJ]

3. I do not see how to two are related

I could read the book and learn what Jocob Dorn thinks.

Socialism was attacked by robber barons in order to weaken our ability to think for ourselves. Robber barons depend on cheap labor unquestioningly doing their bidding, and socialism is a threat to that. In a socialist environment, people can believe in whatever they want, and are not required to believe what robber barons want. Bashing socialism is just another scam performed by scoundrels who know that people are easy to control, if they press the right buttons.

Christianity does not control people, like many non-Christians contend. One must have an open mind to believe in their faith. Anti-socialists want to close our minds, what might actually explain the decline in Christianity recently, and the rise of fake Christians. But robber barons don't care, they just want money.

It is unfortunate that some socialists are anti-Christian, but I do not think that is a reflection socialism.

[provis99]

5. meh. You can use Christianity to justify Nazism.

frankly, you can use religion to justify every conceivable opinion there is, because religion is totally useless for guiding people.

[NMMNG]

9. Christianity can be used to support anything

And it has been. It's whatever an individual believer or group wants it to be. It can be adapted to defend any agenda from far-left to far-right. Pro-slavery to abolitionist, pro-equality to "kill the gays", equality of the sexes to keeping women subservient to men, coexist to "convert or die"--it's all there within the Bible and Christianity. It all depends on how it's interpreted and spun.

[laconicsax]

10. Win. n/t

[beam me up scottie]

11. Yep. They've got the instruction manual.

Unfortunately for them we can read it too.

[NMMNG]

12. Oh, but you're reading it wrong

And so are those Wrong Christians.

[beam me up scottie]

14. If it was up to them none of us would be able to read the damned thing.

People were supposed to trust them.

Why would they lie, after all?

[DemOhio]

13. Great, thanks

That doesnt answer the question though. I was asking whether left wing christianity will become popular again since there is a recession. thats all I asked.

[classysassy]

15. Using Christianity to get elected

and doing just the opposite of what Christianity teaches is sinful,too many of our politician use it to get elected and most of them are republicans especially those from the south.

[struggle4progress]

16. The liberation theologians are interesting, I think

Jose Porfirio Miranda's Marx and the Bible is interesting, as is his Marx Against the Marxists

Ernesto Cardenal's Gospel in Solentiname is also interesting

[Taverner]

17. I have more in common with Social Justice Christians than Ayn Rand Atheists

And I, am an Atheist

Christianity, even in it's fundamentalist and evangelical flavors, was very socialist at the turn of the century. Look up William Jennings Bryan. Yeah, the one who argued in favor of Creationism in the Scopes Trial. He was (gasp!) a Socialist.

[Lydia Leftcoast]

18. If you had to make a choice, you'd find more support for socialism in the Bible

than in laissez-faire capitalism, especially in the teachings of Jesus, but also in the words of the later Hebrew prophets (which is why I hate it when people act as if the Old Testament is all wrath of God all the time.

The last time I was scheduled to read a lesson during the service, it was a Hebrew scriptures reading about social justice, condemning people who are smug and think they're virtuous just because they're rich and who exploit the poor. After the service, a couple of people commented that I really seemed to be getting into that passage. :-)