The Pope Is Elected "Pope-For-Life"... But, It's My Understanding...

[arwalden]

... that a Pope can resign if he wants to. (Is that correct?)

What happens if a Pope has a stroke or lapses into an vegetative state where he's "alive" but unable to convey his desires to resign. Can he be forcibly removed from his position because he's incapacitated or incapable of performing his duties?

If a Pope were to become surprisingly progressive (say... on something like condom use for men with AIDS) does he risk being "fired" by some sort of no-confidence vote? Or is he pretty much assured the position as long as he wants it?

[arcos]

1. John Paul I was surprisingly progressive...

It is rumored he was more liberal regarding condoms, and shortly after his election, he ordered investigations on several would-be money scandals.

When they realized that, they "fired" him with poison.

[Warpy]

2. I don't think this has ever been the case.

There has been more than one case of removal by assassination, but no Pope has ever been ill enough to resign. The only way they leave the office is in a box.

The last progressive pope was John XXIII, and his reign was a short one, and the rumors of poisoning are rife.

My guess is that the present pope will probably be relieved of office by death, natural or unnatural, and the college of cardinals will elect a successor who makes him seem liberal.

[ablbodyed]

4. Hope you're wrong >>>>

about the new poope. The holy spirit (if there is one) moves in mysterious ways, very often the opposite of that which is intended.
And, yes, I have little doubt that John Paul I met an unnatural end.

[maxudargo]

5. Ok, I'm not catholic

But I'm thinking that "poisoning the Pope" has got to be considered a big, big, big sin. Seems to me if you care enough about who is Pope to murder somebody, you're going to have to be religious enough to be scared shitless of the idea of murdering the Pope. I mean, Pope-murdering has to put you in a special after-life class worthy of special attention.

[forgethell]

8. You know, I was

thinking pretty much the same thing. Not that fear of hell stops some people. Even if they believe in it. I'm noot Catholic either, but if I were, I'd go to confession immediately afterwards.

[htuttle]

9. Well, it's always seemed to me that the Roman Catholic Church was 2 things

It's the Catholic Church, but it's also the last vestige of the Holy Roman Empire. What I mean is that on a certain level, the Church is also a massive business, with vast holdings spanning the globe.

In short, there's other reasons to be concerned about who the Pope is than purely spiritual ones.

[Dookus]

11. well

the Church was never the Holy Roman Empire. As the Kawfee Tawk Lady would say, the Holy Roman Empire was never Holy, nor Roman, nor an Empire. Discuss.

Of course, the Vatican WAS the head of a huge European empire for centuries. And it remains to this day a very powerful political force throughout much of the world.

As to the original post, yes, the Pope can resign. But it's almost never done, and this pope seems determined not to. In fact, so much has been made of his determination to show the spiritual face of human decay that it can't be coincidence. The church itself is putting this out - the pope wants to show the humanity of advanced age to make a spiritual point. I don't think he'll ever resign.

There are plenty of lieutenants who can run the church if he becomes incapacitated. The catholic church doesn't think in week-to-week time-frames. It can withstand a prolonged incapacitation of a pope.

[trotsky]

10. Oh I dunno.

Seems to me that if you became convinced that something was for the "good of the church," it would probably trump everything else.

[MikeG]

3. If the Pope goes into a coma - no cardinals can be appointed.

[NC_Nurse]

6. It would be amusing if he

ended up on endless life support in a vegetative state and they had to wait 10-20 years for him to pass on without anyone to run the place. I wonder if they would consider removing a feeding tube or a ventilator...I hope not. Gotta stick with the program, right?

[catbert836]

7. They would have the camerlengo run things

The pope's assisstant, keeps everything going while he's away.

[tjwmason]

12. Remember what the Pope's position is.

He is the Vicar of Christ, and therefore rules the Catholic Church as an absolute monarch (being the deputy of Christ whilst He is in heaven).

Nobody can depose a Pope. To depose somebody one has to be superior to that person, the only person superior to the Pope is God, and therefore only God can depose the Pope (by death).

Some Theologians has postulated that a Pope could depose himself. The first qualification to be Pope is that you are a Catholic Christian, if you cease to be a Catholic you could not continue to occupy S. Peter's Throne. It should be noted that those who have speculated in this area tend to be ultra ultra ultra conservative types; and should generally be considered only with the utmost caution.

No regulations has been provided for a vegitative state, the rules are derived from centuries ago when such things were not under consideration. It has been suggested that John Paul II has given secret instructions (making them public would arouse suspicions), but we can only speculate.

As to Popes resigning, that is a very difficult point. Because the position that they occupy is unique, every case where a man has ceased to be Pope has involved trouble. For example, if John Paul II were to resign, and his successor were to propose relaxing the restrictions on birth-control, J.P.II might well speak out - the result being potential schism. Being Pope is not like being a manager, it is an issue of ontology; when a Bishop resigns from his post he does not cease to be a Bishop, he merely ceases to rule a diocese; what would happen if a Pope resigned? A more difficult question.

[moobu2]

13. Here's some info out today from the Vatican

ROME, Italy (AP) -- A top Vatican official responded to a sensitive question that many Roman Catholics have been asking for a while: Would ailing Pope John Paul II ever consider stepping down?

"Let's leave that hypothesis up to the pope's conscience," said the Holy See's No. 2, Cardinal Angelo Sodano, in answer to a reporter's query Monday.

Sodano expressed hope that John Paul -- hospitalized for a week with flu and breathing troubles -- would surpass Pius IX's 32 years in office, the longest papacy.

Still, he surprised some observers by not ruling out a resignation, which could indicate there is debate within the Vatican on the issue. Popes may resign but cannot be forced to do so.

Click here for more on the poop from CNN

[RUDUing2]

14. yes the pope can resign..it has happened 4 times in the history of the

church...but the last time was in 1415....

and yes the pope can be *fired*...(again very rare and would not occur due to disagreements of the type liste...severe mental illness would be an occurance)..

a good articles on this is http://www.thesoutherncross.co.za/features/presign.htm

http://www.pbs.org/wnet/religionandethics/week518/perspectives.html

http://news.bbc.co.uk/2/hi/europe/3190558.stm

[arwalden]

15. You're A Google God...

thanks for the info.

[dryan]

16. I can't remember...

the Pope's name, but there was one that had what we now call a "nervous breakdown". The College of Cardinals elected a new Pope. The first Pope recovered and went into exile. This was sometime back just before the Orthodox church broke off and in fact was one of the causes of it.