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H2O Man Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Dec-12-09 02:21 PM
Original message
Boxing: 12-12-09

December 12
At Bern, Switzerland (HBO, same-day tape): Vitali Klitschko vs. Kevin Johnson, 12 rounds, for Klitschko's WBC heavyweight title.


At Chicago (HBO): Juan Diaz vs. Paulie Malignaggi, rematch, 12 rounds, junior welterweights; Victor Ortiz vs. Antonio Diaz, 10 rounds, welterweights.


At Rancho Mirage, Calif. (Showtime): Timothy Bradley Jr. vs. Lamont Peterson, 12 rounds, for Bradley's WBO junior welterweight title; Vic Darchinyan vs. Tomas Rojas, 12 rounds, for Darchinyan's WBC/WBA junior bantamweight title.


Luckily for boxing fans, a total of five potentially good fights will be featured tonight on HBO and Showtime. Today's fights could prove to be very important in determining some of 2010's “big” matches. Let's take a look at them, starting with the HBO fights.

Vitali Klitschko defends his title against Kevin Johnson, indicating that he plans to be more active than most heavyweight champions or “title-holders” in recent years. He certainly deserves credit for that. I do not think that Johnson hits hard enough to win this fight, but he is relatively fast, and has good defensive skills. He could make it an interesting fight.

On the undercard of the HBO feature, Victor Ortiz is attempting a comeback. He suffered a brutal beating in his last fight, and some journalists questioned his heart when he quit. HBO's Max Kellerman was among the most vocal critics, which provides evidence that while Max has a grasp of boxing statistics and records, he has no concept of what it means to be inside the ring ….other than for a post-fight interview. While Ortiz will never live up to the foolish “next Golden Boy” hype that Oscar de la Hoya and HBO tried to sell the public, the guy has talent.

The Diaz vs Malignaggi rematch is one of the two important fights. Paul was robbed in their first fight, in Juan's native Texas. It remains to be seen if he can outbox Diaz again. In their first fight, Diaz was coming off a serious KO loss. He should be better tonight. Still, I do not think he can make the adjustments he needs to, and expect Paul to take the decision. While neither will win the real championship in their division, the winner will be in a position to either challenge for the title, or to fight one of the top two contenders in 2010.

On the Showtime card, we get to see Vic Darchinyan in a good match-up, defending his title. He is almost always involved in exciting fights, and has enough punching power at this weight to end a fight early. However, now that he has been defeated twice, he does not enjoy the same intimidation factor that always worked to his advantage.

The best fight of the night should be Tim Bradley against Lamont Peterson. Peterson is a very good young fighter, with impressive skills. There may be reason to believe that he has become a bit over-confident about his skill level. For example, he went to Mayweather's gym when Floyd was preparing for his last fight, and challenged Floyd to spar him. Floyd took him up on the challenge, and humiliated him. If you are going to talk trash at that level, as Rubin used to tell me, you must be careful that your mouth doesn't write a check that your ass can't cash. Calling Floyd out in his gym was a foolish mistake. Peterson is young, thugh, and hopefully has learned a lesson.

Timothy Bradley, Jr., is one of the most talented and definitely under-rated fighters today. He should prove to be too good for Peterson, barring something unexpected. When boxing writers suggest that after the Mayweather vs Pacquiao fight in March, that the winner will have few qualified challengers, they are absolutely overlooking Bradley.

Enjoy the fights!
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JonLP24 Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Dec-12-09 02:39 PM
Response to Original message
1. Should be interesting
I'm starting to get a grasp of the world of boxing though of those fighters, only Vitali Klitschko is only one I'm familiar with. I know David Haye recently had a win so will he be challenging him or tonight's winner for the title in 2010?

I recognize the name Max Kellerman but I don't remember anything about him. I know he was the host of 'Around the Horn' show on ESPN years ago but I don't remember the kind of opinions he has(the host usually doesn't express an opinion and just scores the argument of the sports writers).
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H2O Man Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Dec-12-09 07:08 PM
Response to Reply #1
2. Klitschko
took a 12-round decision. It was expected. Johnson did a little better than many thought he would, especially in getting under Vitali's skin in rounds 11 and 12.

Both of the Klitschko brothers have a strong dislike for David Haye. He was scheduled to fight each of them at one (or more) points earlier this year, but the promotions didn't work out. Haye wanted more money, which is understandable. So, Haye fought for the WBA title, and since winning it, has something the Klitschko brothers want. So, Haye is in a good position at the bargaining table for 2010.

Haye would have a good chance against either one. Wladimir, the true champion, is the younger brother; he is more athletic, faster, and punches harder than Vitali. But his chin is weak, and he panics when the going gets tough (making his chin more vulnerable). Haye, if he connects, can take him out.

I don't think Haye could hurt Vitali. And Vitali is physically stronger than Wladimir. Haye would need to rely on his greater speed of hand and foot, and look to outpoint Vitali.

Both Klitschko brothers could beat Haye, too. He makes mistakes, including his lack of defensive skills. This lack is because he is arrogant, and believes his athletic abilities allow him to take chances while he is off balance. In the past, he had issues with insecurities, which made him mentally "weak," and prone to tiring out early in a fight. It can be very hard to get a fighter like him to reach the proper mental state.

The Bradley vs Peterson fight features two boxers who have not lost in the professional ranks. I wish that you could see it. Both are, obviously, very talented. Bradley has a mindset that I admire. I like guys who train hard, and are ready to set a fast pace for anywhere between 1 and 12 rounds. Bradley never enters the ring unprepared or over-confident. I'm sure that he has prepared for a tough fight tonight. I think that style-wise, he might be one of the few fighters who matches up well with Mayweather. In 2010, he'll be closer in weight, and will have the experience needed to make Floyd reach a higher level.
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H2O Man Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Dec-13-09 07:05 PM
Response to Original message
3. Good fights.
Klitschko's win was not the most impressive of his recent fights, but I would bet a dollar to a doughnut that he has an injured right shoulder. By the second round, he was not able to throw the right cross in the same manner as he usually delivers it. I noted that several times, when he tried, his right foot lifted from the canvas. That's a sure sign that a good fighter has something keeping him from extending the punch a full arm's length. Still, he won all 12 rounds. (The lone judge who gave his opponent a single round needs to have his credentials suspended, and his driver's license revoked.)

Paul Malignaggi won a decision, as expected. And, also as expected, he made the fight much harder than it had to be, by playing to the crowd during several rounds, rather than focusing on the task at hand. I confess to having "been there, done that" myself, many years ago. So, while I was shaking my head, I understood what his misguided thought processes were.

Paul hurt Juan a few times in the fight. At one point, the three of us watching the fights here were discussing what a relatively light puncher like Paul could do to increase his power in this fight. I said he should use the uppercut, because with a guy crouching, and ducking, a well-timed uppercut is the most likely punch to actually hurt him. Sure enough, moments later, Paul wobbled Juan with an uppercut. He was surprised that he had hurt him, and missed the opportunity to end the fight.

Diaz was clearly too heavy, and not in condition to go about the business of fighting his fight. Though he is young, he has become old in the ring. He needs to evaluate what his future should be. He wants to become a lawyer, which seems a better option than becoming a trial horse for young fighters looking to put his name on their record.

Rojas showed no fear of Darchinyan, and the two put on an intense fight, starting from the opening bell. Rojas was able to outbox and out-punch Vic for a round and a half. His mistake was to call Vic back in to slug it out, after Darchinyan had clipped him with a hard shot near the ropes. One 6-inch punch later, Rojas was being counted out, lying almost entirely outside the ropes.

Vic Darchinyan does not strike me as a particularly nice fellow, but he has my respect as a boxer. And while his power isn't great enough to allow him to beat larger opponents, it is solid enough to render any fighter his size unconscious. Hence, inviting him to come within his range would seem a poor choice.

Tim Bradley beat Peterson by decision in one of the very best fights of the year. The two fought 12 hard, fast-paced rounds. Bradley has the speed of foot that allows him to move side-to-side so fast, that he is hard to hit with more than one punch at a time. More, it allows him to deliver his fast combinations. He does not throw every punch with power, and it is his "mixing" in a very hard punch every so often that catches his opponents off guard. He hurt Peterson in the opening round, and decked him a couple of rounds later. However, Lamont proved to be a serious challenge, and the fight was far closer than the final score suggested.
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TroubleMan Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Dec-14-09 07:42 PM
Response to Reply #3
4. I was watching the Malignaggi fight thinking along the same lines.

I was thinking with speed like that he should be able to develop power as they often go hand in hand. I know he's had hand injuries, but still.

I don't know if he needs to sit down on them more or what.
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H2O Man Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Dec-15-09 01:03 PM
Response to Reply #4
6. Right.
On one hand, you can't "teach" power, in the sense of a Sonny Liston or George Foreman. But, you can teach proper delivery. And because speed + timing = impact/power, one can improve in that area.

Paul became convinced, as a result of the damaged hands and the 5 KOs, that he can't bang in there. Baloney. He staggered Cotto, late in their fight. And that was when the cut (30 seconds into the 1st round) and the fractured cheek made him stand and fight -- which is odd, because it would make most guys run like hell!

He needs a trainer who can help him accept and believe that while every punch isn't going to be powerful -- and indeed, does not have to be -- that there are times when he can slug and hurt his opponent.

(When I fought shorter guys who were aggressive, using a bob-and-weave style, I'd put a lot of jabs in their face. Then, I'd throw a jab high on purpose. It was like fishing: if they bit, I'd welcome them with an uppercut, followed with a left hook. That lifted their head, and then slammed it back. Even guys with good chins feel that. Sometimes, it might have taken a few minutes before they woke up, but they felt it! Paul could use that same combination; like you said, it requires sitting down on the punches.)
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joeybee12 Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Dec-14-09 08:51 PM
Response to Original message
5. Hey H2O Man! How are you doing?
BTW, I still have the Spankmes!
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H2O Man Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Dec-15-09 01:08 PM
Response to Reply #5
7. Hello
Other than feeling old, weak, tired, and sore, I'm doing pretty darned good. JV girls' basketball season is upon us. And, come January, modified (7th & 8th) girls' b-ball starts. I have a lot of fun watching my daughters play sports.

It sounds like the world champion NY Yankees will repeat, for several more years. This should result in world peace.
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joeybee12 Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Dec-15-09 01:31 PM
Response to Reply #7
8. You forgot to put this...
:sarcasm:

at the end of your post! Still enough time to edit it!
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H2O Man Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Dec-15-09 02:24 PM
Response to Reply #8
9. No, really .....
I really AM sore, tired, weak, and old. Why do you think this is snarkcasm?
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joeybee12 Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Dec-15-09 02:34 PM
Response to Reply #9
10. So, is that why you think the world will blossom into wonderfulness
if the Spankmes win??????
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H2O Man Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Tue Dec-15-09 02:49 PM
Response to Reply #10
11. No,
but it does not keep me from recognizing this essential truth.

On the other NY hand, I far prefer high school b-ball to watching the Knicks or the Giants.
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