Question--helping a friend with a novel he's going to self-publish

[MorningGlow]

Hi everyone--interesting corner of DU you have here! This is my first post--hope y'all have some advice.

I'm helping a friend who is going to self-publish a novel. He just sent it to me and wants me to edit it. Time is relatively short because he has a slot with the publisher early in March.

Here's the issue: The book is not very good. There are a lot of suggestions I would make to improve it, but it would require quite a bit of rewriting, which he doesn't have time to do if he wants to make his publishing slot. Should I tell him anyway? Or should I just help him cross the T's and dot the I's and look the other way with pacing, tone, even dialect (he's trying a regional dialect with which he's not very well acquainted)?

I am truly torn--I want his book to do well, but I don't want to rain on his parade. Thanks in advance! :hi:

[CaliforniaPeggy]

1. My dear MorningGlow...

I'd lay it out for him...

Tell him what you want to do, and let him decide...

But really, you should fix what's wrong. If the book's not very good, then he needs to know.

I'd still give him the two options, though...

He'll learn, even though this will be painful.

Better to learn it from you, his friend, than from some stranger...

Just my two cents!

[MorningGlow]

3. Peggy!

I think this is the first time we've chatted outside of the Lounge! Hee.

Anyway, I would like to fix everything that's wrong; it's only the time constraint that makes me hesitate. I guess I will have to make a list, or maybe a series of lists: 1) Definitely change these things; 2) You really should change these things; 3) If you have time, please change these things. Or something like that.

Thanks! :hi:

[petgoat]

2. What's the time pressure with a self-publishing gig?

Sounds like the printer is trying to make him feel grateful--
maybe he should question the entire deal. Has he investigated
lulu.com?

On the other score, most writers who ask for criticism don't
really want criticism. They want adulation. So it may cost you
a friendship if you insist on providing critical help.

If you really want to help, maybe you could offer the suggestion
that "just for the hell of it" the writer get a professional
editor to look over the first fifty pages, or take some classes
in the local community college to get feedback.

[MorningGlow]

4. I don't know what kind of arrangement he's got with the printer

As far as I can tell, it's a timeslot thing--he wants to get his book published as soon as possible, so he doesn't want to miss this scheduled date with the printer.

You're right that most writers want praise--been there, T-shirt obtained, etc.--and certain elements of his work do deserve some kudos. It's such a fine line to walk, offering the criticism he says he wants and yet being honest that he should really change major portions of the novel.

The hitch is, I AM a professional editor. I hope he knows if he took it to an editor who was a complete stranger, that editor would rip it to shreds far worse than I ever could bring myself to do.

Uggghhhh... :banghead:

[DavidDvorkin]

5. The awful truth is that the novel is DOA no matter what you do

No matter how much you improve it, a self-published novel will disappear without a trace.

I hope your friend isn't getting his hopes up.

[MorningGlow]

6. That's not for me to say

I do believe my friend is well aware of the potential for a self-published novel's success (or lack thereof), and so I leave that to him and just correct bad grammar, inconsistent voice, weak story structure, and incorrectly placed commas. :hi:

[valerief]

7. Tell him to go to lulu.com. No time limit. He can print and update

and print and update and print and update as many times as he wants. He can keep his manuscript private until he wants to make it public. He can pay $100 when he wants to have the book distributed on the big online booksellers.

Oh, yeah, and if he wants hard-cover, he can have that, too, at lulu.com.

There's no better deal anywhere!

[MorningGlow]

9. That was the first thing I suggested

But apparently he got a deal he really liked from another publisher (I keep forgetting to ask who it is). Meh--that's up to him. I just wish he were more flexible on the pub date of 3/8. I think he could probably shift it if he wanted to, but he wants to get this thing printed as quickly as possible. Puts me in a tight spot, I must admit.

[OneGrassRoot]

8. I had to do this very think last week.

The really bad thing is that this business acquaintance is actually getting PAID to ghostwrite a novel, and I was hired to edit it.

It's horrible - in every sense of the word...structure, style, no plot or character development, typos and grammatical errors galore. Oy vey. Honestly, there isn't one redeeming quality to it (it's also this person's first attempt at writing fiction. 'Nuf said). Fortunately, it's only the first three chapters; submitted for approval (if the client approves it, she's insane, IMHO).

I was very honest, and left it up to her as to how she wanted to handle it. There is a deadline, so a rewrite is out of the question. Based on her response to simply do my best, basically proofing and doing what I can to edit without rewriting, that's what I'm getting ready to do now. And I dread it like a root canal.

:-(

[MorningGlow]

10. Yep, that sounds familiar

But I have to do the ENTIRE book--luckily it's of like a novella, but still...we're talking a LOT of problems here, quite like what you're describing. It's also this person's first novel.

Right now I'm slogging through the first quarter of it (it's taken more more than a week for a first pass) using the "track changes" and "comment" features in Word. The entire right margin is filled with "deleted" and "comment" bubbles! I sent him a few pages, and I think the number of changes rocked his socks--I don't think he was expecting so many. But he hasn't put up too much of a fight about them.

The best part--the person has never set foot in America, yet he decided the story HAD to be set in a major U.S. city. So I'm also playing Tracy Tour Guide, explaining--and fixing!--American idioms, customs, and other nuances. (He's learned about American culture from reading John Grisham novels and watching American TV shows. OY!)

Sigh. He's a dear, dear man. I like him a lot. Good thing too, I've gotta say.

[OneGrassRoot]

11. OMG, that is another similarity...

I told you this is a paid assignment that my acquaintance has undertaken. My acquaintance is in Canada, and the client is in England, and it's a story that takes place in the US! Neither of them have a clue about the intricacies...lol. So, I expected to have to do a shitload of proofing for typos and grammar (my acquaintance is visually impaired, so I give her a lot of credit), and to have to do a lot of research and editing for factual info/local, etc., but then when the actual writing style was not even up to a fifth grader's ability (my 14 y/o's observation), it threw me for a loop.

Oy. I have to get more coffee and get back to it. This is possibly the worst project I've committed myself to.

[MorningGlow]

12. LOL have we got the same guy?

My client is in England too. It's definitely a double whammy with the whomp of cultural stuff in addition to the usual editing travails. My biggest challenge: explaining to him that we no longer have rollicking, drunken office parties at Christmastime due to fear of DWI and sexual harassment lawsuits. He was boggled. I had to get creative to replace a few lines about that!

[OneGrassRoot]

13. LOL...

Don't think it's the same person given the office party aspect.

This novel involves four women on death row! What the client didn't realize, is that not all of our states have the death penalty; actually, she had no knowledge of our legal system whatsoever, so it's quite a challenge...lol.

Hey, good luck! We need it. :toast:

[MorningGlow]

14. Nope, I guess not

But I've got a thriller on my hands, too. Zoinks! Issues with the legal system is also bothersome for me--I'm pretty sure lots of details are incorrect, although I'm no expert in the field. However, my brother is a criminal defense attorney--PHEW! Time for an e-mail. He can consider this my payment for redoing his Web site for free. :D

Yeah, we DEFINITELY need all the luck we can get! And plenty of booze--er, coffee--too. :beer:

[Blue_Roses]

15. Damn

I sure do miss those Christmas parties :D

I remember one with homemade eggnog spiked with Southern Comfort:9

[MorningGlow]

16. I sure am envious

Quite a few years ago I visited a friend of mine who was spending a year in London ushering a college exchange program through the paces, and I met her and her coworkers for lunch in a pub. I was so envious that they could have several beers in the middle of the work day and nobody cared!

[hermetic]

17. Well, hi girls

(and guys). What a small world this DU place is. I'm doing the same thing, editing a first-time novel for a friend. I'm not having the problems you are facing, yet. But I've only just started. :scared:

I came to this Group to see if anyone was talking about grammar checkers. I use Open Office so I don't have one. Have to rely on the old memory. :dunce:

I wish you all the best of luck with your projects and I expect to be hanging out in this Group a good bit, for tips and stuff. So, see ya around. :hi:

[MorningGlow]

18. Hee--hiya, enufalready!

Yeah, occasionally some of us wander away from the ASAH forum...but then we scoot right back for the warm fuzzy atmosphere!
:rofl:

I've found that I'm not just an editor, I'm an ego stroker and a psychiatrist as well. Plus I'm using my master's degree in teaching for the first time in more than a decade--I'm giving novel-writing lessons on a daily basis.

And I'm only on chapter 3...aaaaauuuugghhhh...

[hermetic]

19. Hi, MG

Hmm, I used to have an MG. Fun, and so are you, my dear.

Yeah, what is it with writers, they can't grasp the simplicity of writing dialog punctuation? The comma goes here, the quotes go there... aiyeee. Of course it gives one something to do, like we don't have enufalready.

Me, chapter one! Hours and days. At least I'm working with a good (so far) story. And yes, I already know about the stroking. Just think of them as your kitties.

See ya then, here and there.

enuf

[MorningGlow]

20. Gee whiz

You'd never think MorningGlow would be such a common name, would you?

I keed, I keed. :evilgrin:

And ugh--punctuation, spelling, grammar, the difference between homonyms, possessives--some novels just have it all!

I'm just thinking I'm making a poor story better--well, as good as it's going to get, what with the author clinging desperately to his oddly chosen words and plotlines, going "NnnnoooOOOoooo...don't CHANGE it!!!"
:rofl: