Need some input.. advice.. anything.. please

[Belial]

Here is the situation. My 15 year old stepdaughter has been going through some really rough patches lately. She has a 16 year old female friend that she has been hanging out with for over a year and they are great friends. We could not figure out why they would get so upset with each other and argue all the time about what we felt were petty issues. Long story short, I took her to dinner and we spent about 5 hours just talking. I told her whatever she told me would stay between her and myself and I would only tell her mom if I thought she was in danger, so she really opened up. She explained to me that she thought she was a lesbian because she and her friend have been in a relationship for the last year or so. I didn't ask for specifics nor do I want them. Being the stepfather puts me in an awkward position so I suggested she needed to talk to her mother about this as well. It took her about a week, but she opened up to her mother as well.. so as far as the house is concerned.. its all out in the open.

Now we have a new situation and we are a little perplexed as to how to deal with it. Her friend spends the night over here all the time and they share a room. My wife feels like if she was dating a boy.. we would not let the boy spend the night and she has a point. I was a teenager once and I know that if I want to do something with someone I will find the time and the place. Her mother spoke to her about this and said she felt like she was welcome to stay but in another room. This of course upset my stepdaughter who feels like now that she told us, everything has to change.

I know this sounds kind of silly.. but we want to try and make the right choice here without her feeling like we don't support her. We do support her very much.

Thoughts? Thank You

Edit.. if there are some resources that are available for teens.. it would be appreciated as well.

[rainy]

1. Do you have a den or family room that is somewhat secluded

but not entirely? If so have them sleep in there watching TV or movies etc... knowing that you could come in at anytime. Sleeping apart but in the same room might be ok.

[crikkett]

2. You have my sympathies, your daughter doesn't.

This of course upset my stepdaughter who feels like now that she told us, everything has to change.

Hooray for her that she's honest, and hooray for you because it's a testimony to your parenting. But teenagers hate rules and boundaries.

Maybe you can explain that you wouldn't allow a boy to sleep with her, not (only) because of the chance of pregnancy but because it's inappropriate, period, and you don't condone inappropriate behavior no matter what flavor it may take.

Maybe you can say that even if she didn't confess to you, you would have limited their contact because their behavior was not just concerning but um, telling.

Maybe you can make a gesture to convince her that something positive comes from being honest with you.

Just a thought. Kids withhold information partly because they can't find the words, and partly because they fear consequences.

[Name removed]

11. Deleted message

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[Yes We Did]

13. What the f*ck!

That was really disgusting.

[crikkett]

16. What-ever.

Teens need rules.
This case is actually pretty cut and dry.

It's important to teach a teen that they're accepted for who they are but they still can't game a system.

Kiddo was trying to game a system and got pouty when her folks set limits. Furthermore I wonder if her guilt trip is an attempt to use emotional blackmail to manipulate her parents who are rightly concerned about her emotional health.

So no sympathy from me that she can't have sex in her room just because it's with another girl.

[Belial]

3. Thank You

I like the idea regarding the family room. We should be able to set that up so that they can stay in there while they are here together. I don't want anyone to feel like they have to "hide" in this house. The other issue is her own father.. she is scared to tell him and tried to bring the subject up to him by talking about some girls she "knows".. his response to her was that the "girls" needed therapy. So I think part of her is still worried about her Dad finding out and coming down pretty hard on her or even disowning her. I don't see how anyone could do that.. then again I have been wrong plenty of times before.

Thank You for the responses.. I feel like I am walking a very thin line with her right now.

[dsc]

6. Given what you are saying in this post

it is all the more imperative you don't let them sleep together in a private room. I can see the father going to court and getting a sympathetic ear over this issue. In addition, you are doing the right thing. Under no circumstances should a child of that age being having sex under a parent's roof.

[MineralMan]

4. Definitely an awkward situation.

It will probably take a bit of time for the dust to settle and for the three of you to figure out just what is the best thing to do. In the meantime, there must be some way to compromise with your stepdaughter...some middle ground.

Given the fluidity of teen relationships, it's entirely possible that the immediate problem will vanish in time.

I'm sure you'll figure out some sort of solution, though.

[damntexdem]

5. Whatever they do in her bedroom won't get her pregnant. Ask her what she knows about safe sex.

How mature is she? Is it likely that she can deal with a sexual relationship? Does she understand the laws that apply?

"Thinking" she has a sexual orientation after a one-year relationship could suggest that her thoughts are right on. The issue is whether she's mature enough to deal with her identity, and with a sexual relationship, and with legal consequences. But if she's not 'ready,' after a year is a bit late to find that out.

But if you really cannot accept a sexual relationship of someone that young in your house, tell her that -- knowing that even if she abides by your wishes in your home, she and her friend can likely find another place to meet.

The important things are: her confidence in her identity, her readiness for a sexual relationship, and her ability to deal with the legalities of an under-age relationship.

[TheWraith]

7. To be honest, I think your wife needs to reconsider her first impulse.

They've been hanging out together for over a year, as you said. Chances are that anything they wanted to do, they've done already, so trying to seperate them at this point will come off to her as being punishment in exchange for being honest. That, in turn, might push her into retaliating against your rules, trying to sneak her relationship under the radar, and maybe going farther because of it.

My best advice would be to make it clear to her that while you don't think it's appropriate for the girlfriend to be staying over, you recognize that she didn't have to tell you squat, and that if she hadn't done so things would be continuing on as they were. The only real grounds you'd have for seperating them, in my opinion, is if you had reason to think that the older girl was pressuring or manipulating her.

You really can't afford to alienate her in any way, because you need her to be as open as possible with you to help her through her rough patches. Any sense that she's going to get reprimanded for being truthful shuts that down completely and hurts her.

[Ioo]

20. I think this is a valid point that needs to be thought about more.

I can see the sticky situation you are in... but I also think that if you do a 180 on everything she is going to regret telling you in the first place... I think it is time for another heart to heart with her, you need to voice your concerns to her. Also, as much as you do not want to know, you need to know to what depth they have explored this... you said, "She thinks she's a lesbian" that is SO HARD to kinda deal with all of this emotion she may be having. So as much as it pains you, it is time for a safe sex chat...

I think that the issue NEEDS to be addressed, but I think how you address it can be a start of a happy period, or a sneeky one... I do not have the answer here, but I want you to be careful.

THAT SAID!!!! It would be real sweet of you to make sure that your house is a safe place for her, and that you will DEFEND her as she grows into herself. MANY people here did not have parents that were even 1% receptive to the idea... you have a real chance here of allowing her to grow up a well adjusted young women who can take care of herself, or you can put her into years of therapy... Just PLEASE know how ALONE she may feel on the inside... and do not be afraid to ask her how she is doing, and such...

Please make her proud by showing her that your love really is unconditional...

[TheWraith]

24. Emphasis on the unconditional love.

Being a teenager and in a relationship is hard enough without her thinking that her parents are punishing her for being truthful. If you're going to err, err on the side of being supportive and letting her find things out for herself rather than trying to impose your experiences on her. It'll help her a lot if she feels that her family is always behind her, no matter what happens.

Not to put too fine a point on it, these girls have been in a relationship for awhile--if they wanted to have sex, then they've done it already. And if they haven't, then rebelling against parental interference is just the sort of trigger that could make her jump into something faster that could end up getting her hurt. It's not like you're stopping something before it starts. The horse is out of the barn.

[Lyric]

25. I never thought I'd say this, but I agree with The Wraith.

If they wanted to be sexually active, then they already are. The last thing you want to do is to make her regret telling you--and more bluntly, if any other gay teens are lurking and reading this, I'd hate to think that it might put *them* off of telling *their* otherwise-safe parents for fear of what they will inevitably see as a punishment, even if it isn't meant that way.

It comes down to this--do you feel that, if you told her "No sex," you could trust her to keep her word? If you can, then great--it shouldn't be a big deal where the girlfriend sleeps. If you think that level of trust isn't something you believe she is capable of being given, then maybe the girlfriend shouldn't be staying the night at all. Honestly, even if you put them in separate bedrooms, you're not going to be awake and aware all night. It's not so difficult to leave one room and go into another, ya know?

Either way, I would *definitely* go out and buy a box of dental dams, some silicone gloves, and even some condoms for her, just in case. Teens have sex, and even though pregnancy is not a fear for her with this relationship, disease is still a risk. At risk of embarrassing you, I would recommend the flavored dental dams...not because you want to encourage her to have sex, but because personal experience has taught me that the flavored ones are like ice-breakers. It's easier to convince a potentially weirded-out partner who's never seen one before to *use* them if there's a jokey little gimmick involved to ease the tension in an intimate moment, like "I know they're a little odd, but look, they're strawberry! Let's use them and see if they're any good." TMI, I know, but it usually elicits a tension-easing giggle and then acceptance without weirdness. Preventing unsafe sex is the key, and that is accomplished more easily when you can reduce the embarrassment factor that adolescents hate so much.

[TheWraith]

41. Thanks, I think.

Another point that I thought of--what exactly is the rationale for telling her that she shouldn't be having sex? As has been pointed out, there's no risk of pregnancy, and biologically there's little to no risk of STDs. If it's about emotional maturity, well, that ship has sailed. Teenagers unsupervised equals sex--any gender, any orientation. Probably more likely for two girls than for any other pairing. Thus, the only remaining option is trying to support her so that if her relationship goes bad she doesn't get MORE hurt than is automatic, and so that she doesn't blame her parents for trashing it. A heartbroken young girl can be a source of formidable hate: should the parents want that directed at them for interfering?

[sailor65]

8. Just like in any other aspect of life,

it should be exactly the same as in a hetero relationship. You have the perfect opportunity to show her that there isn't any difference. I hope you and your wife stick to your guns.

[LostinVA]

37. Except it isn't the same and isn't treated the same

And, that includes the whole,"Sex is wrong because of pregnancy/STDs/virginity/marriage/societal and gender role BS."

There's tension, stress, guilt, etc. The whole coming out stuff is very, very traumatic. If the girl was straight, her parents would KNOW she was dating someone. How about sleepovers? Guess they ALL have to be banned.

Read Readmoreoften's excellent post downthread.

I'd just leave it alone. At the most, I'd get an adult she feels very comfortable with (ie a n aunt) to talk to her about general relationship and sex stuff.

[notadmblnd]

9. You didn't mention whether or not they are sexually active with each other

Seems to me that this would make a big difference where her friend sleeps when she stays. If they are having sex, you might want to remind her that it is unlawful for a 15 year old to be having sex. If her friend is 16, she could be charged with rape and be prosecuted. If her partner is younger than her, your step daughter could have charges pressed against her. What are her friends and her friends parents feeling in regard to this?

My son who is 15, just had his first sexual experience with an older girl (16). When it was found out, the girl, to cover her butt, told school officials that my son had raped her. This certainly was not the case. It was reported to child protective services and a detective came visiting at my house. I explained to him that this girl showed up on my door step, came in my house without my knowledge and had sex with my son. Not once, but twice. I then explained to the officer that my son was the minor in this case and that perhaps I should be the one pressing charges since the girl had attained the age of consent and my son had not. This changed the entire attitude of the girl, her parents and the police.

Yes, our children are going to do what they are going to do despite what we tell them. So perhaps you could remind them of the legal ramifications in regards to minors having sex? Maybe this would slow them down a bit.

[Ms. Toad]

27. Whether or not it is unlawful

depends on the state law. Each state defines statutory rape, and what constitutes statutory rape varies considerably from state to state. Generally, if the participants are within a couple of years of the same age it is not statutory rape.

[readmoreoften]

30. 16 and 15? There no legal grounds for a rape charge whatsoever in any state.

18 and 17, unfortunately yes but in most places is a prohibition on male-male or older male. I've never seen a 16/15 heterosexual split. Anywhere. In most places it's a 4-5 year age gap allowance.

[LostinVA]

32. What? They are legally allowed to have sex with one another

Statutory rape doesn't work like that, nor age of consent laws.

[notadmblnd]

38. This happened not 6 weeks ago

No, they are not legally allowed to have sex. It is against the law for anyone to have sex with another person under the age of 16 in my state.

[LostinVA]

39. I would like to see a link for that

Beacuse I thought all 50 states had "Romeo and Juliet" laws.

[notadmblnd]

40. it was a personal experience

[La Lioness Priyanka]

10. i think you have the right to treat them as you would if they were straight

though as far as being abstinent you will probably be as useful as other parents are. which is to say not very.

teenagers who want to have sex with each other will. whether w.your approval or not. that being said, you should treat them as you would if he were a boy.

[Yes We Did]

14. Exactly.

We all know that "abstinence works" is complete bullshit.

[donco6]

28. I agree. n/t

[Belial]

12. Thoughts

A couple of people have posted regarding sexual relations. That part I leave between her and her mother. I am already in a somewhat awkward position as I have only been the stepfather for the last 4 years. It's not that I am uncomfortable with the situation, but at the same time that is a more private matter. I guess what I am saying is that I am not a prude, but at the same time I don't want to pry and I respect her very much. She is very mature and I have expressed to her time and time again in one form or fashion how much I appreciate that she feels like she can trust me. That being said, I think it is safe to assume it has moved far past the hand holding stage.

Here is the really strange and difficult part for me to express. When it comes to the rules of the house I am the enforcer and the decision maker. My belief has always been one of keeping it simple. I don't raise my voice, they have never heard me yell and they know what will get them grounded or in trouble. When I do ground one.. it is a very simple statement.. you are grounded and you have lost the following privileges. Someone once told me.. once you begin to argue with a child, you have already lost the argument. I am troubled with how to lay down the ground rules in this situation without making her withdraw from the bond we have developed over the last few years.

[Yes We Did]

17. I hate to tell you this...

But you can't help that. You aren't her friend, you are her step father. Don't make the mistake of trying to be her friend above all else.

Yes, she is going to be pissed off at you right now, but in the long run she will come around. Like others have said, treat it like a straight relationship. Let the girlfriend come over, hang out, eat.... all the typical things kids do. Don't treat it any different.

That also means not treating it any different than if she was dating a boy, and explain it that way to her.

That being said... not every "girl" "friend" she has is going to be a "girlfriend." So don't make the same mistake my mother made with my sister in assuming that.

She was honest with you this time. She'll be honest with you again.

[crikkett]

19. ...and she deserves HEAPS of praise for being honest. I mean really lay it on.

When my folks were overtly kind to me I couldn't be mad at them.

[TEmperorHasNoClothes]

15. being lesbian is more than sex

and being male is far different hormonally than being female. You can support your stepdaughter's relationship while not supporting that relationship being sexual. You can trust that you've help to raise someone who trusts you enough with the truth. She is not hurting herself or anyone else. Would it be a problem if they were sleeping in the same bed and holding each other, they way sometimes even heterosexuals do? I wouldn't assume she's having sex just because she's lesbian and has sleepovers. If I were you and your wife, I wouldn't give her a negative consequence for having told you, such as trying to separate them. I'd focus on the emotional ramifications of being sexually active, whether that be hetero or homosexual sex. I'd let them continue sleeping in the same room. If anything they're going to be less likely to engage in sexual activity knowing you know what's possibly going on behind closed doors. You don't want to give meaningless boundaries that are going to push her into the very activity you're trying to prevent.

[Yes We Did]

18. So... When you going to offer him an apology?

And by the way... that's a crock of shit.

"If anything they're going to be less likely to engage in sexual activity knowing you know what's possibly going on behind closed doors."

You don't know anything about teenagers... do you? Do you really think it matters to them if he knows? Come on. They are going to do what they want to do. That's how kids are.

And it's not "meaningless boundaries" It's called having respect for your parents. And if your parents tell you no sleeping with your girlfriend, that's it. It's not an unreasonable request.

And you smart ass "suicide" post above was completely over the line.

[TEmperorHasNoClothes]

31. actually

I probably know much more about teenagers than you ever could practically and academically. And I forgive your smart ass response to me.

[Yes We Did]

43. I owe you no apology.

So don't forgive me.

You owe the OP an apology for your suicide crack. That was over the line... And the mods agreed with me.

[HarukaTheTrophyWife]

44. You also more about being gay than that poster even could

Practically and academically.

[LostinVA]

33. I agree with you

[bluedawg12]

21. It's my opinion that as the parents you have the right to set standards for conduct in your home.

Being gay is like being str8, in that, if as gays we expect rights, we should also expect responsibilities.

[Belial]

22. Simple.. yet very well put. Thank You..

[bluedawg12]

23. Best of luck, Belial.

Being a teen is hard, being the parent of a teen...well, I am thinking, it's harder. ;-)

You and your wife have done a remarkable job of being understanding and communicative.

BTW, I pulled the same thing on my parents and even though we never spoke about being gay, I got the same response about sleeping in the same bed under their roof.

Now, a few million years later, my partner of 23 years and I are the ones who care for my aged mom, provide for all of her needs, physical, medical and legal and my mom adores my partner.

Moral of the story: be nice to your kids, they may end up having to pick your nursing home someday! :evilgrin:

[insleeforprez]

46. +1

If you disapprove of your daughter having sex, or your daughter having sex in your home, or your daughter having sex in your home while you are present, you have every right to enforce that regardless of the gender of the partner.

[Eryemil]

26. I do not understand what the fuss...

...is about.
Teenagers have sex. The average age teens become sexually active in the US is 15 years old.
What's the use of these hypocritical rules? The ability to claim some sort of moral highground?

It doesn't make sense, specially considering the fact that they're 1) Not likely to get pregnant 2) About as safe from serious STDs as biologically possible between a couple.

Just make sure they're being as safe as possible and soundproof the walls if need be. That's my two €.

[readmoreoften]

29. My take? Drop it. And a few other suggestions.

This may sound harsh, but It's really none of your business what your daughter is doing with her girlfriend. Show her you trust her. My parents did at that age and it stopped me from really resenting them. The idea of my parents commenting on my sex life would've been so gross I would have been very upset. With boys it's expected because of pregnancy and the possibly of marriage, but other girls are allowed to have their girlfriend sleep over. Also if her girlfriend isn't allowed to sleep over, you might as well ban sleepovers all together. How are you going to tell the difference from her straight sleepover friends and gay sleepover friends?

They've already been in your home having sex for a year most likely. I seriously doubt they've been "waiting" because there's no narrative of "giving it up too soon" for lesbians. There is no "will you respect me in the morning." What would they be waiting for? The marriage they're not allowed to have? If they're waiting it's because they feel too young--and that's good (but unlikely.) If they're ready and having sex, well, that's good too--although it may be hard for you to hear.

It's your house, but know that whenever you pull that "my house" stuff with your kid when it comes to their friends and their love life, you're telling them that there is no place that is their own, that they literally have no place in the world, and you are pushing them right out of your life. Once she finds a "home of her own" outside your house, you're not in good territory.

give her her space

Three questions:

1. What makes you think they'd only have sex in the nighttime? Are you going to make them keep the door open in the afternoon?
2. Where do you expect them to go if they are having sex? Do you want them to have sex in unsafe places? In the woods? In bathrooms? I'm serious here--when it's heterosexual sex, it's assumed that the male party will physically protect the female from other males. Many adults won't bat an eye if they get caught. Two young girls caught having sex in the woods? That's not a safe scenario. In fact, that's REALLY not a safe scenario. Unfortunately, it's a common one.
3. If you're going to say "no" now, at what age will she be able to sleep with her partner under your roof? 18? After college? During college? When gay marriage is legal?

*Note: I am treating this question as if she were an only child. If she's not and she has a female sibling near her age, it's a far more complicated question.

*Note two: One of the only resentments I have against my parents that angers me to this dayand I'm 38 (And I still talk to the girl...)

[LostinVA]

35. I totally agree with you here

I should have read your post first -- I repeated alot of things!

[TheWraith]

42. Your tone is rather harsh, but you make excellent points.

Any instinctive or cultural reaction towards teenagers having sex is so much wasted energy at this point. Protect them, support her, and accept the fact that these are the facts on the ground.

[HarukaTheTrophyWife]

45. I 100% agree with this post

[LostinVA]

34. I see nothing wrong with letting them sleep in the same room -- and, it isn't the same thing

It really isn't in many ways. The girl won't get pregnant, and lets face it, THAT and STDs are THE main concern with kids sleeping together unless it's a moral issue with someone. Along with the "ick" factor re: your kids being sexually active. Girls are also mainly friends with girl, regardless of sexual orientation, which DOES make a difference. Are you going to never let her have a female friend sleep over? If you say, of course, if they are just friends, I guarantee your SD will NEVER admit to having a GF again. If it makes you feel better, set up a cot in her room for her GF, just for appearances sake.

I agree with Readmoreoften: drop it.

[xchrom]

36. i wouldn't say anything right now.

i'd listen and watch.

being gay -- isn't the same as being straight.

there are high tension wires of guilt and shame. as with every child -- but more so with gay kids.

and you've been offered the rare opportunity to help a young lady develop her emotional base in a healthy way.

i'm sure it was hard for her to tell you -- just watch and listen for now.