Update on us....

[Debbi801]

Thank you all again for your suggestions and kind words. I've been sick and haven't been online much, but I wanted to post an update.

Things seem to be looking up, at least for now. He stood up to the one bully at school and the kid backed down. He also notified several administrators and the other kid was reprimanded. My son was called "snitch" for a day or so, but my son refused to apologize for letting the teachers know and told the kid he was not going to allow himself to be bullied any longer.

Interestingly enough, shortly after this happened, there was a school-wide assembly at his school on bullying and that it won't be tolerated.

My son's friends have been sticking close by him in the halls and I think there is security in numbers. We've been in touch with the local PFLAG group and also a local youth group. He's also been talking online on a gay-straight alliance support site with other teens.

Spring break starts on Friday and we're also getting a puppy that day. Between that and the fact that lacrosse season has started, he's very distracted. Between lacrosse practices and games, he's busy almost every day after school and definitely getting into better physical shape as well.

Thank you all again. I'll continue to keep updating.
Debbi

[Debbi801]

1. Hogging my own thread to ask another question.....

Those of you who've seen Brokeback Mountain, what are your thoughts on allowing my 13 yr old to watch it? He's been asking to on a pretty regular basis.

Thanks again!

[meegbear]

6. While I have not seen the movie myself ...

I say yes, let him see it and watch it with him. He sounds mature enough to view it.

And remember when you were 13? If you wanted something bad enough, you'd find a way to get it.

[TechBear_Seattle]

8. It probably would not be a problem

There is one scene, the first time they have sex (and the only time it is even alluded to on the screen), which is brutal and might be a bit much for someone that young, but I didn't think it was overtly graphic. The language is often coarse, but then the two main characters are rural high school drop-outs and it never comes off as being gratuitous; many people probably hear conversations like that every day.

There probably would not be a problem with your child seeing the movie. It's been released to DVD, so you might want to either watch it first and decide for yourself, or watch it together.

And I'm glad things are working out at school :hi:

[GodlessBiker]

10. I think Brokeback may be dicey for a 13-year-old.

As you may know, two people are killed for being gay (Jack and the dead man in the ditch (the true hero in the movie, as he was unafraid to build a life with his partner but got killed for it - too bad we never got to meet him other than seeing his dead body)) Ennis' father showed him. The sex scenes are brief but, by and large, not graphic.

I wouldn't want your son to think that gay people either end up dead or living their lives out in some god-forsaken trailer in the middle of nowhere after failing to gather the courage to be with the only person who ever really meant anything to you. On the other hand, perhaps if he sees how Ennis ruined his life by being such a wimp, he will himself have the courage to let love be his guide.

[TechBear_Seattle]

11. You never see Jack actually being killed

All you see is Ennis' fear of what might have happened, that is what makes that particular scene so tragic.

As for the violence you are referring to, it is actually a lot less graphic than stuff you see on television every day. It is important to realize that, in the 80s when Jack died, it was still very common for gay men to be assaulted just as Ennis feared. (Heck, in many rural areas of the US, it is still common, but I digress.) It is a part of history that should not be ignored, and I personally don't think 13 is too young to learn those lessons. YMMV, of course.

And as for Ennis being such a wimp, I would have agreed with you but I have since changed my mind. There is a bit of dialog towards the end, the last time Jack and Ennis are together, when Ennis says that he can not just quit his jobs any more to be with Jack. In other words, the reason Ennis had gone nowhere, the reason why he was living in a trailer in the middle of nowhere working manure cowboy jobs and with no prospects was that he was repeatedly upturning his stability to be with Jack. Now in his 40s, during the recession of the early 80s when even manure cowboy jobs were difficult to find and with a reputation as someone who quits during calfing season or branding season with no explanation... it took him 20 years to think of his own future past his time with Jack. I really don't think that makes him a wimp.

[GodlessBiker]

13. I agree that the scene is ambiguous.

When Ennis is talking to Jack's widow over the telephone, and you see the scenes of Jack being beaten interspersed with the conversation, it is unclear whether that is what Ennis thought happened to Jack or whether that is what actually happened to Jack.

I draw the conclusion that it was what actually happened to Jack because of his widow's obvious formulaic telling of the story (regarding the tire blowing up in his face) such that she was just saying it to cover up for her embarrassment of having married a gay man. She was giving the party line that her control-freak father told her to give.

But, the conclusion that it was just Ennis' fear is not unfounded.

[TechBear_Seattle]

15. It's much clearer in the story

In fact, after visiting the Twist home, Ennis becomes convinced not only that it was murder but that Jack's father had some role in it. But again, he never knows.

[kevinbgoode]

14. Ohh...I'd say...not yet.

I agree with the remarks that it might be a little dicey for a 13-year-old, and it's really more of an adult romance. I will make another suggestion, if you don't mind. . .though I'll tell you that this film has same-sex kissing, but absolutely no nudity/sex/bed scenes that I can remember - and yet I found it a really nice feel-good film:

"Big Eden - A small miracle". . .there are lots of smalltown characters in this, both gay and straight, and it might be more enjoyable. Here are the liner notes from the DVD:

"Big Eden is a tiny town tucked away in the timberland of northwestern Montana, where cowboys lounge on the porch of the general store to pass the time away. It's also the childhood home of Henry Hart (Arye Gross) a successful but lonely New York artist who returns after years away to care for his ailing grandfather.
Back home, Henry confronts his unrequited passion for his high school best-friend and his feelings about being gay in a small town. Warmed by the openness and affection of old friends, in time Henry finds new possibilities for friendship and romance. Big Eden is a unigquely American fabel about home and family. It hits upon the universal longing and hope we each have for finding a place where we are loved, and the unconditional desire to see those that we love find happiness. Ensemble cast includes, Eric Schweig, Louise Fletcher."

It's a little heavy on the romance (and a love triangle) but I like the way all characters interact and such a general air of normalcy that exists in the way people treat each other in the town. He might enjoy watching this one, and at the same time he won't really be exposed to anything more than kissing that is in any sort of heterosexual movie. I like it because it emphasizes the romance and has some light parts to the story.

At the time of release, it was rated PG-13.

[GodlessBiker]

16. And my favorite gay themed movie - My Beautiful Laundrette.

Beautiful life-affirming and gay-affirming movie.

[Meldread]

19. The best advise:

Watch it yourself first. Once you see it, you can decide if you think it is something that is suitable for him to view. You're his mother and you know him better than anyone else. He may or may not be ready to see something like Brokeback Mountain, but I think ultimately you should watch it first and make that choice. There's nothing wrong with telling him no if you don't think it's appropriate. That's what being a good parent is all about.

[nothingshocksmeanymore]

2. I am not finding your original thread

but given that he has gone to the school administrators, you may wish to also consider not having him walk home alone.

[Debbi801]

5. I'm sorry. Link to original post inside....

http://www.democraticunderground.com/discuss/duboard.php?az=show_mesg&forum=221&topic_id=30122&mesg_id=30122

[nothingshocksmeanymore]

9. I don't know what state you are in and didn't read the entire thread

http://www.lambdalegal.org/cgi-bin/iowa/index.html

But this is a wonderful legal organization that can probably give you some advice on how better to protect him.

As far as Brokeback Mountain...discuss this with a psychologist and see what input they may have...

[MuseRider]

3. Thank you for the update.

Sounds like things are much better than they were. Your son sounds like a remarkable kid but then he has remarkable parents and friends too.

Good for you and good for him. Let's hope things continue to improve and understanding is reached everywhere he touches.

Give him a serious hug from me, I love a person who has the kind of courage it takes to confront the bullies of the world. Good things are in store for him.

[meegbear]

4. Excellent news!

I wish I was that strong growing up (and had parents I thought would be as supportive as you are).

[ayeshahaqqiqa]

7. Tell him he is a very strong young man

Strong to have told you his sexual identity.
Strong to have stood up to the bully.

Be very proud of him.

[greekspeak]

12. I wish I had half the guts your son does

I was 22 before I came out. Fear motivated it. I was already one of the most marginalized kids in middle school and high school. But seeing what happened to others even more unpopular than me kept me quiet about my homosexuality. I saw one kid get pushed into the path of an on-coming bus. He suffered severe burns and a badly broken arm for having learning difficulties and being socially akward. I was fun to torment until one day in music class, being smacked in the head from behind several times during each class period resulted in my uncontrolable crying. The bullies got in some serious trouble and I was left alone more after that. Still not heaven. So I can honestly say, I look at your son with awe, for being so brave. And for you for making home a safe and open place for him to live! Please give your son my best wishes as he matures into a laudable young man, and thank him from me for breaking down walls of prejudice by confronting it head on!

[Rowdyboy]

17. I was 25 before I came out-your kid has some serious guts! I admire him..

As for Brokeback, I've seen the movie twice and I really can't think of anything particularly shocking for a mature 12/13 year old. Watch it first and use your own judgment, but I really think it would be okay.

And tell him that many people are very proud of him and hope he stays strong.

[dsc]

18. I am glad things are going well

Your son is so brave. I am utterly impressed with him being able to be out like this. I wouldn't have dreamed of doing that in high school let alone middle school.

As to your second question. I am of two minds. Knowing ones history is important and Brokeback is a part of our history. That said, I really have some fears about how the deaths in the film may affect him. That era is likely to be close to alien to him and it would be nice if it stayed that way until he was an adult. I also wonder how he will find the first half hour of the film. It is a very slow moving film and he may well get bored. I loved the set up sequences but for a 13 year old they may seem like forever.

[Maat]

20. This PFLAGer is so proud of both you and your son.

I'm a retired social worker. I think that your son could handle Brokeback Mountain, if you were around to discuss it with him, and if he saw it at home. Am I wrong?

[kevinbgoode]

22. I was wondering. . .

as a PFLAG member, has the organization developed things like film lists for gay teens and their parents that can help serve as a guide? Seems like that would be a helpful list for parents trying to meet their children's needs . . .

[Maat]

23. Yes, I believe each chapter has a library.

And we have books, articles and pamphlets in it.

AND, I believe there is material on the national site, www.pflag.org .

On edit:

http://www.pflag.org/index.php?id=297 .

Click on any one of them, and the pamphlet comes up in 'pdf' format.

[Ayesha]

21. Movies

I think Brokeback would be ok as long as it's preceded and followed by a discussion about how things were back then, and still are in some places, but that it's very possible to live one's life freely today.

Another excellent and age-appropriate film I'd recommend for him is "But I'm A Cheerleader". It's a comedy about a high school girl who gets sent to "ex-gay" camp and the other teens she meets there. It pokes fun at gender stereotypes and is funny, romantic and warm-hearted. The central character is a lesbian but there are many gay male characters as well. It's contemporary and reflects his generation's experience more than Brokeback does. I'm sure others here can recommend more great films for kids his age.

You are such a wonderful, understanding parent - we need more like you! I too did not come out to my father until I was in my 20's, mostly because my mother died when I was 22 and I had a lot of other issues I was working through. Thankfully my father and stepmother are supportive and love my partner.

[Uncle Zoloft]

24. Before Brokeback

get a copy of "Beautiful Thing." It is about a young man in high school dealing with many of the issues your son has gone through, but - big BUT here - the movie ends on a positive note. One of hope and love and school boy dreams. It is a positive portrayal of young love. Watch it with him. Then on to Brokeback.

[monarch]

25. I just clicked on your homepage

what a wonderful website! Have you posted that Brokeback video in this forum. I don't check in here every day but you should keep posting it every chance you get. Everyone on this forum should have the chance to see it. It is THAT good!

On edit: my editing skills only seem to come to the fore when I read it online.

[Uncle Zoloft]

26. Thanks

B-) That Brokeback video just rocks!

[monarch]

27. You have to promote your site more

It's a great site and I see lots of other bloggers promoting their sites by posting stuff in other places. That video should be on every gay blog you can find so that more people get to see the video and you get more visitors to comment on your stuff. And, aside from the altruistic motive of conveying information, aren't the comments the real reason people post things online--sort of to validate one's ideas?
In any case, I think that you have something worth sharing.

[Uncle Zoloft]

28. after the night we had last evening

your words are comforting.

Short version: cocktail hr at home, wking up a hot night of makin' sweet love - stop - screams from outside - flash - partner runs to the door and seems to be watching a rehearsal of Lord of the Flys <8 teenage boys chasing down and capturing a 7 yr old and heading off on a scooter with the kid. Partner goes to house where small kid was dragged, knocks, 10 yr old answers door says mom and dad aren't there, in a wide eyed scared sh!t sort of way. Kid closes blinds while watching my man walk home. My man sees said father sitting in kitchen. Proper action call 911. Police arrive partner talks with police while I sit on the porch rocking chair smoking a cig and keeping on eye on what was happening. Upshot: waiting on Police report. Kids live in home with flaming GOP supporters. We now are using our alarm system at night, oh - yea and we've got a crowbar and pepper spray by the door. Have posted a notice to the neighborhood that our "village" needs to have a meeting about this craziness[br />
Sometimes my partner and I feel like we're anywhere from 3 days to 3 years ahead in instinctive knowledge of our surroundings. It is one of the reasons we have been together for 15 years. Only problem now is we have no idea whether to stay, and if not - where to go.