Baptists Face Schism Over Gays

[kweerwolf]

(Los Angeles, California) Delegates representing congregations of the American Baptist Churches of the Pacific Southwest voted overwhelmingly Saturday to recommend severing ties with the national denomination in a dispute over homosexuality.

The matter now goes to the board of directors, which has already recommended withdrawal from American Baptist Churches, USA, citing ''deep differences of theological convictions and values.''

The board is scheduled to meet May 11.

On Saturday, delegates from the region's 300 churches voted 1,125 to 209 to withdraw from American Baptist Churches, USA. The delegates met in seven locations across the West, including First Baptist Church in Pomona.

http://www.365gay.com/Newscon06/04/043006baptists.htm

I thought the only "schism" the Baptists had over LGBT folks was whether the stone 'em or burn 'em at the stake.
:sarcasm:

[saltpoint]

1. Many Baptist congregations, not all, have been historically cruel to

any dissent within their ranks generally and as regards sex particularly.

The water used for baptisms, seems to me, ought to be unconditional.

[dsc]

2. In my neck of the woods the American Baptist Churches

are pretty liberal and some are on the verge of getting thrown out. They originally left the Southern Baptists over race and now may get thrown out over gays. It really is a shame but these churches won't back down.

[Ian David]

3. They had a schism over slavery, too. How "christian" of them. n/t

[dsc]

4. No they didn't

American Bapitists left the Southern Baptist church over slavery.

[Ian David]

5. That's what I meant. The Baptists split over slavery.

That's where The Southern Baptists come from.

[dsc]

6. The Raleigh area American Baptists have been wonderful

for ages. Sadly they are soon to get thrown out of the church over gays themselves. On edit I thought you were referring specificly to American Baptists.

[Ian David]

7. Schisms within denominations are not sad. It's market forces at their best

Churches are finding their niche in the marketplace of religion, differentiating their various versions of the god-product.

People shouldn't have to walk into a church and fight with the minister over gay rights versus gay persecution any more than they should have to walk into a fast-food restaurant and argue with the counter help over Big Mac versus Whopper.

People should know who their church says that Jesus hates as soon as they walk in the door, and they should have a broad range of choices in religion franchises to choose from.

Christians are waging a two-front battle right now. The war within their own denominations, and their war against The Wall Between Church and State.

The sooner they finish this market correction within their own denominations, the sooner they will be free to fight between denominations, to determine which will control the ground on the other side of Jefferson's Wall.

Which of these many churches will knock-down Jefferson's wall and claim the right to control the government?

It'll be fun!

Just like Bosnia!

[dsc]

8. The problem there is that then religious views stay static

the anti gay religious people will stay anti gay if they never get challenged within their churches.

[Ian David]

9. That's a good point. But they'll still be challenged elsewhere...

They'll still be part of the same community.

The friends and acquaintances they met in church will still share the same supermarkets and train stations and Laundromats and schools.

Maybe in order to be "challenged" they need to start losing valued friends?

It's the difference between a protest and a walk-out.

It carries a stronger message when people start walking away from intolerance.

Or, I guess, when people start walking away to intolerance.

[dsc]

10. It is a hard line to know

I would love to know what would happen either way. Without perfect knowledge it is impossible to know.

[Ian David]

11. Just trust in The Flying Spaghetti Monster and all will be clear. n/t

[Ian David]

12. Think of religion as another commodity most closely related to media

Now, don't look at it in terms of media ownership, but in terms of consumer choice.

People are using TiVo and iPods to create their own, personal media channels. They're "Ego-Casting," finding information that both pleases them and confirms their own biases.

People will begin "Ego-casting" for churches that most conform to their own beliefs and biases.

And belonging to a church that schisms will make that process seem easier and more natural.


"My daddy was a baptist. My granddaddy was a baptist. My great-granddaddy was a baptist, and I'm a Baptist and will stay a baptist... what? They're schisming? Baptist and Southern Baptist? We have to decide? Aw, heck... I guess I'll be a Southern Baptist. Anyway... what? Southern Baptists are schisming? I have to choose again? You know, I chose once already... maybe I'll see what the Lutheran church is like..."


With churches, people can't shut-out all the other churches competing for their share of the marketplace, or for control over the instruments of government.

Churches are constantly fighting one another in the court room, the classroom, on the sidewalks, and in the halls of government. They will not let themselves be tuned-out the same way we can tune-out a TV channel.

Welcome to The Balkanized States of America.

[dsc]

13. Many of the gay and lesbian members of my church

are starting to thing about what to do. The nearest open and affirming church is about an hour away. We aren't sure what to do.

[Ian David]

14. Start a new church. It's cheaper and easier than you think

In my city, there are churches all over the place opening up in storefronts in marginal neighborhoods.

Thanks to the Republican Economy, there are plenty of commercial-zoned properties that can be snatched-up for a song and a prayer.

Find yourself a boarded-up Quickie-Mart and declare, "upon this squishy-machine I build my church."

[dsc]

15. That is one option we are considering

not the only one, but one. We would be a house church for awhile and then later move into building.

[Ian David]

16. What state are you in? n/t

[dsc]

17. north carolina

about an hour away from both raleigh and greenville.

[Ian David]

18. I may have property for you, believe it or not in Beaufort County

It's right on the Pitt/Beaufort border.

And it's directly across the street from a guy with an anti-gay-marriage bumper-sticker.

[dsc]

19. that would be hilarious

though sadly about a hour to hour and a half away. I didn't realize we were so close in location. I live in Wilson.

[Ian David]

20. I live in Boston, but I've inherited some property down there

And I hate to say it, but that part of North Carolina is a scary, scary place.

[dsc]

21. ECU is a pocket of liberalism in a see of radical nutjobs

Wilson is a bit better and could really turn the corner if it becomes a full fledged suburb of Raleigh.