Hey guys, I'd like to apologize for something

[JohnKleeb]

When I was younger, I used to be a total jerk towards GLBT people. I don't know what my problem was, I guess you could say I was a victim of peer pressure. I just hope you can accept my apology. Thanks, no one deserves intolerance because of their sexual orientation. Thanks again.

[saltpoint]

1. You ain't no total jerk now, John.

You're one of the good guys.

I don't think anyone picks up a negative vibe from you at all.

[JohnKleeb]

3. I know but I had to get that off my back

I was a total jerk then, and well I am sorry for not being so openminded. You know whats great about being an idiot like me and having virtually no gaydar, you find out someone is gay or bi, and youre like oh, well i didnt notice.

[saltpoint]

14. It's clear that you're too modest to say it yourself --

-- but others here notice that if what you say is true about your past views on GLBTs, then you have evolved, which is hard to do, and difficult to do, and rarely accomplished.

But you did it nevertheless.

I think that's the good vibe people pick up from your posts.

[JohnKleeb]

18. I thought most people thought I was a wiseass, but thats the modesty

I can be quite serious and funny, goes with how I am, I am a very compromised person despite being idealogically left.

[saltpoint]

24. Well, look at the posts in this thread, for instance.

They affirm you. That's a pretty good gauge of who you are when people rise to speak in your defense and affirm the things they respect about you.

[bigwillq]

2. I love you Kleeb!

You're the best!

:hi: :yourock:

[JohnKleeb]

6. Thanks, I am glad you accept it

I just god feel like a jerk for how i once was. Why are people so hateful, damnit we need a federal law that prohibits discrimiatnion based on sexual orientationm, isn't that called ENDA?

[bigwillq]

13. Isn't it amazing how we grow and change as we get older?

Plus, unless one associates with or knows people who are gay, bi, transgender, etc. they may feel uncomfortable around these people until they get to know them.
That type of thinking may also be how one is raised or brought up (This is not a knock against your family).

[JohnKleeb]

16. Oh actually, my dad has always been quite tolerant

He worked with a lot of gay people over the years and is pretty tolerant. Hah, his business partner actually when he had one in the late 80's was a transvesite.

[bigwillq]

19. Well that's a good thing about your family

Sorry, if I offended you by assuming that some family members also thought that way.

[JohnKleeb]

20. thats ok

You wont believe me but my very religious 77 year old grandmother is a supporter of a federal civil unions law, shes not for gay marriage because of religious reasons but her and my grandpa both favor that.

[bigwillq]

22. That's cool! So....

why and what made you think that way when you were younger?

[JohnKleeb]

26. oh I know why

Many preteens have bigoted views of GLBT people. Thats why I think.

[bigwillq]

28. That's true

And then so many of them are gay or bi.

It's just the way society is, I guess. To have negative views towards people who are "different" and "not normal"

[JohnKleeb]

29. Yeah

I think I credit my dad most with getting me thinking in the correct direction.

[bigwillq]

31. Well Kudos to Dad!

My Dad took me being gay much better than mom. I thought it was going to be the other way around.

MY Dad is real old school, old Italian guy, so I thought he would react differently. My mom has since turned the corner and has accepted it and she loves my b/f.

[JohnKleeb]

32. My grandma is an old school Slovak and my grandpa a Slovene

Really I used to call her baba when I was a little kid. Good for your dad. You all Italian out of curiousity? because you know I am Irish-German-Slav.

[bigwillq]

34. 3/4 Italian

My mom's mom is from England but I like to believe that I'm all Italian.

My mom's mom, we call her Nonni and she makes the best Italian food. Heck, even she thinks she's Italian!

[JohnKleeb]

35. hah

Italian food is great, dont get too much of it here but it is great.

[bigwillq]

36. Come up to CT and my mom and Nonni will make all

the Italian food that you can eat!:hi:

[JohnKleeb]

37. neat, Ive never been to Connecticut I gotta learn how to drive

too, but hey once I graduate, so much more free and fun time.

[bigwillq]

38. You don't know how to drive?!

What the hell is taking you so long?!

I wanted to drive since I was like 5. My dad use to let me pull the car into the gargage (I was sitting on his lap). Plus, at my Nonni's house, I would mow the grass using a John Deere-type tractor. That made me want to drive really badly and it also taught me how to steer and slow up and go faster.



Learn, Kleeb, it's fun. But it also can be very dangerous. So be careful and follow all road rules.

[JohnKleeb]

39. Lazyness and the fact I wanna live in the city

I have to learn I know.

[Dookus]

4. Thanks Kleeb...

your penance will to spend 5 minutes making out with a guy in a speedo.

[JohnKleeb]

7. sure thing

haha, I dont like guys, sorry, but hey all is good.

[purduejake]

5. Thanks for your apology.

And it is accepted, of course. I'm gay and have made remarks that I regret before I came out. I'm sure you are somehow trying to "undo" past errors and you should be commended. =)

[JohnKleeb]

8. Thanks for accepting it

I am trying to undo it, I stand up whenever I can against intolerance, god at this age and being a southerner, people are just the worst to gays.

[Rowdyboy]

9. You must have been MUCH younger because I've never

seen anything remotely like that from you here.

In fact, John :yourock:

[JohnKleeb]

10. I was much younger

It doesn't make it any right that I was younger. This was like when I was uhh I dunno how old but I wanna make amends.

[Siyahamba]

11. Thank you.

It was really touching to read that. It would mean a lot to me if people who harassed me before (especially during high school) would just apologize. I know a lot of people think it's better to just try and forget about it than admit they made a mistake, and you deserve a lot of credit for your statement. I frequent a group here where I see you post a lot, and I know you're doing lots of good for the world now.

[JohnKleeb]

12. Thanks, I really do try my best

A lot of people high school age are intolerant, Ive gotten really ticked off when people giggle at the ad for the school gay tolerance club which a teacher of mine actually sposnors, he's a good guy, I would belong to it but my schedule conflicts because I have a club I go to on the same day.

[Moloch]

15. Apology Accepted...

and now you are a Democrat and fight against that kind of intolerance. It's always good to see things work out for the better.

[JohnKleeb]

17. Ive always been a democrat, family upbringing but I was once intolerant to

[libnnc]

21. Sincere post and a Steelers fan to boot...

Good on ya! I wish more straight folks could get to where you are. Thanks for your good thoughts.


:toast:

I Love my Panthers, but I'm a Steelers fan from a-way back.

[JohnKleeb]

23. thanks heh yeah go steelers

[terrya]

25. You and I have talked about this the other day, John.

You're a class act, guy.

T

[JohnKleeb]

27. I appreciate that, thanks guys, I am glad to admit this

and be forgiven.

[LDS Jock]

30. I KNEW there was something shady about you

it's not a problem Kleeby. I think I need to give you another noogie, but its all good. We all do stuff when we are too young to know better. It is to your credit you have grown past it. :hug: :pals:

[JohnKleeb]

33. haha very funny man

hey its honesty.

[Cuban_Liberal]

40. Apology accepted, John!

:hug:

[JohnKleeb]

41. Thank ya

[Langley85]

42. Don't worry about it, John

I used to be a total jerk towards GLBT people too, until that is I came to terms with the fact that I am GAY myself! Just be proud of yourself for having moved beyond the ignorance which grips so much of the population.

[JohnKleeb]

43. I didnt know too many GLBT people when I Was younger

I just wish I had been more tolerant. I know, its just to me, always good to make amends with your past sins. Hell if I ever get my lazy ass to confession, this will be one of the first sins I confess.

[jonnyblitz]

44. why thank you. just for that I wont accuse you of being 16 yrs old

anymore. Actually you told me this before in pvt, this is cool of you to do it here in this forum. :hi:

[JohnKleeb]

45. hah thanks Jonny

Yeah Ive told you that in private, I really wanted to get it off my back. Anyone wanna join the heterosexual agenda :D. kidding.

[Meldread]

46. Apology accepted.

We've all made mistakes in the past, things that we've said or done and wish we could have taken back. Even I, during High School, made anti-gay jokes or at the very least laughed at them. It was an effort to fit in, and an effort to keep who I was hidden from everyone around me. After all, the kid laughing at the anti-gay jokes can't be gay, right? ;)

I once thought back and wondered if there was another closeted gay person listening in, and wonder if they think I'm a bigot. I'd hope not, and if I ever found out that I hurt someone that way I could offer them nothing but a million apologies. I suppose the sad part is that I was hurting myself most of all.

Oh well, no worries. You've evolved and that's a good thing. If you really want to make it up then just stand up to people who do the same, and teach your children (if or when you have any) that it's wrong. That'd be more than enough to make up for anything you've ever said.

[JohnKleeb]

47. Too young to have any kids at 17

but I will teach my kids tolerance and understanding. God, the things these right wing politicans say about gay folk are like things the klan would say about blacks, catholics, jews, etc back in the day.

[Meldread]

49. Many of them would fit right in with the Klan.

I didn't realize you were so young. Really, you have nothing to apologize for then. The fact that you've come to the realization that you've had, and the fact that you had the courage (something most people 50 years your senior wouldn't do) to apologize... well... it goes without words. I made the mistake of thinking you were in your late to mid 20's. (That's meant to be a compliment, you seem far more mature than most people your age now-a-days.)

I am glad you will teach your future children such things as tolerance and understanding. There isn't enough of it taught. That is the way to bring about change in the Country, by teaching the children tolerance and understanding. They will grow up and teach their children those same values, and soon enough it will have spread all throughout the country. Until those who act as they do today toward gays are viewed in the same light as those who are members of the Klan. They really are no different both are groups of bigots. The Klan uses the Bible and their "religion" to back up their bigoted claims as well.

[JohnKleeb]

55. Ahh I can be very immature but thanks anyhow

I am lucky to have been brought up by good parents honestly.

[Stepup2]

48. It is people like you

that give me hope.

Your apology makes more room in your own life for more love and self acceptance. :*

[JohnKleeb]

52. Thanks, I feel its best to make atones

[ropi]

50. ::Hugs::

JohnKleeb

you're forgiven. now, do you forgive yourself? that's the most important step toward healing! <smile>

[JohnKleeb]

53. Yeah I do, thanks again

[Bouncy Ball]

51. You're a sweet guy.

It comes out in your posts. We all did stupid things when we were a kid. The important thing is that you aren't that way now.

I'm not gay, but I, too, really appreciate what you said here.

[JohnKleeb]

54. yep you got that

I know yer not gay heh, but thanks anyhow. Thanks, I really do try to be the nicest person I can be despite having an explosive temper.

[Rockholm]

56. Funny, I did the SAME thing at one time.

Starting at age 5 is was called gay, fag, queer, you name it. All I did was kiss my best friend Borden at school one day. I was probably a peck or something, that I don't remember. Some upper classmen at my school saw it and I was forever branded.

I went to college, joined a big, popular fraternity and then did something that I am ashamed of. In the University Student Center, the Greeks used to hang out in one section. We used to make fun of the gay kids as they went to their offices in the student center. We were behind glass and I doubt that they could hear us. Funny thing was that MOST of us who did the mocking and taunting WERE gay, we just had not accepted it yet. Since graduating, I would say that 30-50 percent of my fraternity brothers have come out. Some are still closeted and are married with kids. I did not come out until after college.

To this day, I have been ashamed of how mean and cruel I was to those kids who had the courage to be out and proud in the mid 80's. I am sorry for my actions and I am proud of you.

[JohnKleeb]

58. Thanks

Kids can be hateful, its just tough if you're different in any way.

[Lisaben2619]

57. Do us a favor, John...

get out in the community and tell your story. There's nothing like a reformed gay-hater (for lack of a better word) to help bigoted straight people change their minds. You "get" what they are thinking and feeling more than we do and this is a chance to really make a difference.

[JohnKleeb]

59. I wouldn't say I was a hater but intolerant yes

I did an editoral for my journalism class today actually on why GLBT folk should have the same rights as straights in marriage.

[Zhade]

60. John, you are really a good guy.

I've read your posts for a while now, and you've got CLASS, my friend.

:yourock:

[JohnKleeb]

61. Thanks I really do try

You know I think it would be a great idea if we could get a federal ban on discrimination based on sexuality honest.

[davidinalameda]

62. thank you

we'll talk about punishment later

:bounce:

[JohnKleeb]

63. punishment? eh?

[Duncan Grant]

64. How can you not like a guy...

who offers an apology and also supported Dennis Kucinich?! You're a good man, Kleeb - for all the right reasons. :thumbsup: :hi:

[JohnKleeb]

65. hah thanks

I try.

[Dark]

66. It's okay. I was too. And I'm actually gay. n/t

[JohnKleeb]

68. seems like a lot of people were

God I hate how hateful people are.

[dsc]

67. frankly more than a few of us

have to admit to having done the same thing. I remember once when some of my friends and I threw tomatos at house across the street from mine which was owned by a gay man. I still am very ashamed of that day. My dad whipped me but good, and he had only done that one other time. But as painful as that whipping was the guilt I felt was even worse. I of all people should have known better. But, like most kids, I didn't want to look like a wuss.

[JohnKleeb]

69. I never did anything like that

just said some stupid shit that I regret.

[dsc]

70. We all do things we regret

I was like 10 at the time.

[JohnKleeb]

71. it just astounds me how hateful people can be

My dad told me a story about when he was little, his father caught him saying a racist slur, and my dad's dad gave him hell and punished him for it.

[dsc]

72. fear can be a powerful things

as can recognizing things in other people that you don't like in yourself.

[khashka]

73. John

If you messed up and disliked us when you were younger. Well, most of us did the same thing. If we can't hold ourselves responsible for that, then how could we hold you responsible?

As we age we have the capability to become wise. Well, maybe not. Just, insight or understanding. But even though that capability is there it often never comes to fruition. With you it did John.

Often we GLBT people seem preoccupied with ourselves, but never forget that we value people like you. And consider you our friends and compatriots. Our brothers and sisters.

We grow up with the same ideas that you did. The same peer pressure. We have to reject that in order to be true to ourselves. It's a hard, hard journey. We have to travel that journey to survive. You don't. So when you do do it. Well, it's quite amazing.

So you have nothing to apologize for and everything to be proud of. I don't want your apology, I want your friendship. Apparently I have that.

So quit apologizing for how you used to be - you aren't that person anymore. You're bigger, stronger, and better. And so, I don't know you and you don't know me, but now we have a possibility, a great one, a wonderful one, a possibility of friendship of understanding.

You learned to dislike GLBT people, I learned to dislike straight people. We've both grown past that. Let's go on together from here.

Ok, my friend?

Khash.