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groovedaddy Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Nov-06-08 12:56 PM
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Equality’s Winding Path
Amid the soaring oratory about the presidential election, it was Barack Obama who put it best late Tuesday night. “That’s the genius of America, that America can change,” he said. “Our union can be perfected.”

But as Mr. Obama’s victory showed, the path to change is arduous. Even as the nation shattered one barrier of intolerance, we were disappointed that voters in four states chose to reinforce another. Ballot measures were approved in Arkansas, Arizona, Florida and California that discriminate against couples of the same sex.

We do not view these results as reason for despair. Struggles over civil rights never follow a straight trajectory, and the ugly outcome of these ballot fights should not obscure the building momentum for full equality for gay people, including acceptance of marriage between gay men and women. But the votes remind us of how much remains to be done before this bigotry is finally erased.

In Arkansas, voters approved a backward measure destined to hurt children by barring unmarried couples from becoming adoptive or foster parents. In Arizona, voters approved a state constitutional amendment to forbid same-sex couples from marrying. Florida voters approved a more sweeping amendment intended to bar marriage, civil unions and other family protections.

http://www.nytimes.com/2008/11/06/opinion/06thu1.html?th&emc=th
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sui generis Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Nov-06-08 01:34 PM
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1. you are right. It doesn't arrive without justifying its arrival
and ideas can only do that when they are perfected through struggle, and through evolutionary challenge.

The killer is, we are individuals as well as a nation, with finite lifespans, and families who don't want to struggle or be discounted or legally challenged every day to be as American as everyone else.

so it IS appropriate to struggle, and also to struggle with some sense of urgency. I don't want my kids to have to deal with this at home in their lives when they will already be struggling with the other messes we have left them on the global stage.

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sinkingfeeling Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Nov-06-08 02:19 PM
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2. When I said basically the same thing in another thread, I was called offensive and
that I should just shut up. Pointing out that civil rights struggles sometimes take decades and decades is taboo.
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groovedaddy Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Nov-06-08 02:36 PM
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3. I don't think anyone has the right to tell someone whether or not to struggle
There were people in the civil rights movement who were told the same thing...not only that, when MLK jr. started speaking out against the Vietnam war (and war in general), many in the civil rights movement turned their backs on him, telling him he had no right to try to take the movement there.

The U.S. Constitution and the Bill of Rights can only be amended as stated in the Constitution, and that IS NOT by a simple vote of the majority. The bill of rights is the legal protection for every INDIVIDUAL's God given rights (Declaration of Independence). The majority can be tyrannical in this sense. Bush made a mockery of the Constitution.

It comes down to a question of strategy, which all movements must deal with. It is possible that the courts will, once again, decide the issue of marriage and civil unions. Beyond that, any movement must win the hearts and minds of enough people to make basic rights unassailable. It is a difficult path to follow, running up against ingrained attitudes and stereotypes. It is preferable, in my mind, that those who have chosen a particular strategy have consensus about that stategy. Many movements die out from the lack of this. Note: you can have different strategies operating at the same time, though this can create contention between the various types. Identify your potential allies and reach out to them.
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sinkingfeeling Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Nov-06-08 02:41 PM
Response to Reply #3
4. I don't think anybody is telling somebody else to struggle, just that all past gains in civil rights
did not happen overnight.
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