Why can't Planned Parenthood...

[Quist]

...be privately funded? Surely, since most of the people in America are for it, it would be easy to hold some rallies and do some fundraising!

[CBGLuthier]

1. why can't the air force

be privately funded?

[Quist]

4. Because...

...their protection serves all the people--not just individual clients.

[Curmudgeoness]

19. I am wondering if that is true. I keep trying to come up with

something that they have done to protect me. All I see is them protecting business interests overseas. Seems to me that the suggestion to make the air force private isn't so far-fetched.

[Justitia]

Why do we give Liberty Univ half a billion $$$? Isn't that gov't funding of religion?

Liberty Univ gets 7 times the amt of $$$ that PP receives

[Quist]

30. So...

You don't want us to privately fund PP because you don't like other things that are publically funded? Huh? That's a lousy reason to not fund something so important. It's better we fund it ourselves and have complete control over it so that it's ALWAYS AVAILABLE. That trumps everything!

[Justitia]

31. willfully obtuse. Public $ is used for many things that some people may not like.

Why aren't you addressing that?

And are YOU fine with giving Liberty Univ 7 times the amt of federal funding that PP receives for healthcare?

[Quist]

34. I can't justify...

..giving money to Liberty Uni. or not--that's not my issue. I'm saying that if we pay for PP we'll have COMPLETE control over it so that women will ALWAYS have their care and the GOPers won't ever be able to cancel it. I'm saying that it is important enough an issue that it's worth it to do it that way--unless you don't think it is.

[Justitia]

37. well, I'm glad it's not YOUR issue, but this is critical for millions of women

PP exists to provide care, where without the federal funding - WOULD NO LONGER EXIST

Sorry, we aren't throwing the healthcare clients of PP under the train

Why doesn't Liberty University pay their own private money to indoctrinate their students with fundamentalist religion?

Why the fuck am I paying for that?????

[Quist]

40. No, discussing Liberty U.

...isn't my issue. Why would privately funding PP make it cease to exist?

[Justitia]

42. Then, you are completely disingenuous in your intent

[Quist]

45. Nonsense

Why would privately funding PP make it cease to exist?

[Justitia]

48. because clinics would close. Would religion stop if we quit funding evangelicals?

[Quist]

50. Why would clinics close???

Not if we fund them ourselves!

[Justitia]

52. Then get out your checkbook & write a fucking check already. Do you need a stamp?

[Quist]

54. No

But you need to answer my question. One person writing one check doesn't address the issue of private funding for something important.

[Justitia]

55. Do you donate to PP?

[Quist]

57. I donate what I can to what I can.

One person writing one check doesn't address the issue of private funding for something important.

[Justitia]

58. So, the answer is NO. So when you said "WE" can fund PP "ourselves" - not you?

[Quist]

61. Not at all!

I think we should fund PP publically. I'd be happy to send more money that way if we could have complete operational control. But I'm not going to give more just so John Boehner can stop the services!

[MichiganVote]

63. But "YOU" have not sent any money whereas "WE" Democrats have.

[Quist]

80. Of course I have!

I have a revolving bunch of charities we give to every month. Of course PP gets theirs, but they have to stand in line like our animal rescue, veterans groups, and environmentalist groups do. Then, we often give to selected authors and blogsites etc. We don't have endless funds or very many. Besides, my lone check is not the point (it's just a 'gotcha-gimmee' to even bring it up). True private funding would involve a lot more than just my little payment every month. After I pay for all my seizure meds, 8 ambulance bills from last fall, and the huge increase in our health insurance rates, there's not as much left over as we'd wish.

It's really just a nasty distraction to try and pry all this out of me; I know all the misdirection we've been taught to do heh he he--esp. by folks who're not posing any type of good faith argument.

[Klukie]

47. Privately funding it would make it cease to exist because

If it doesn't turn a profit then all of the short sighted, greedy ass republicans won't be interested in funding it. Seeing how the bulk of our nations money resides in the hands of these greedy bastards....well it doesn't take a genius to see how that would end.

[Quist]

53. What akes you think...

..that they're richer than the Dems, the Progressives, the Independents that vote with us, the Greens, and everyone else on the left? The GOPers who don't want abortion is a small group of fanatics; I've been told by progressives on lots of message boards that we're in the majority on this. I mean, look at Hollywood, Bill Gates, Europe etc. You can't tell me all those people who want to stop abortions or med. care for women!

[Klukie]

60. Who the hell do think you are fooling...you don't vote with us

and I would love to see the breakdown of who holds the wealth and which way they vote. I would bet my left tit that the short sighted republicans would be in the lead. I wonder how much the population would increase if this program goes down? I also wonder if those who wanted to defund it are willing to financially adopt all of the children born into poverty because their mothers couldn't get protection. One thing I know to be true ...the poor might not know how to screw someone on wallstreet but they surely know how to screw!!!

[Quist]

62. You don't know who I vote for!

And that's not the issue--privately funding PP IS the issue. I'm not going to dragged off message.

[Klukie]

77. You don't need to be dragged off message...

your message is already way off.....and I am quite sure of your voting record.

[uppityperson]

83. So does PP. Letting people chose when to reproduce gives them a lot more

options about their lives, gives them the opportunity to be contributing citizens having education and jobs at livable wages. This serves our society positively and directly at least as well as the military does.

[luvspeas]

2. Why don't you get the ball rolling and pony up?...n/t

[Quist]

I think...

...they'd need more than the little I could give.

[luvspeas]

26. well if everybody felt like you, then there would not be a planned parenthood...

first off, PP gets a great deal of private support. I, for one, have given them money to support the important work they do. Second, their services help poor women and adolescents, primarily, women who do not have resources to give. I can tell you for a fact, that there are women that they helped as teens give a great deal of money to them because they were alive and successful later on. Lastly, there are many important services that PP provides that no one else can do as well...in addition to the things that have been illustrated so far, they also provide non-judgmental, science-based consultation to schools, youth programs, sexual health programs, safe sex, sexual orientation, teen pregnancy and STD prevention programs in the US and around the world.

Do you really want to see this organization hobbled by a bunch of neocons that want women like those in "A Handmaid's Tale"?

[Quist]

29. No!

I want us to fund it ourselves so they can never stop it!

[appleannie1]

3. It goes beyond Planned Parenthood. Next will be EPA, Food and Drug Admin, Medicare, Medicaid,

Disability, etc. etc. They refuse to give on any of them. It is their way or the highway. The best way to stop it is not let it start in the first place.

[ChazII]

6. +1 n/t

[Quist]

9. But...

...that's a different issue than whether America could privately fund Planned Parenthood. Assuming we'd have to fund everything isn't a good enough reason to not fund PP. Especially if it's as important to people as all these rallies and protests show that it is.

[elleng]

5. It is, significantly.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Planned_Parenthood

[Quist]

13. Not enough...

...for us to have complete control over it.

[elleng]

43. 'us' who? What kind of 'control' does 'us' want???

[Quist]

49. Control

I mean so that a bunch of Repubs couldn't decide to take it away.

[elleng]

56. I don't understand.

You first asked why can't it be 'privately' funded, and it is both privately and publicly funded. A bunch of repugs are trying now to take away its public funding now, but they probably won't be able to 'take away' their private funding.

[Quist]

59. Right

And if it was 100% privately funded, the GOP couldn't touch PP, so my question is, why not do that?

[MichiganVote]

65. Simply--because those of us who support PP want it publicly and privately funded.

So you have difference of opinion. So What? You're not here asking for a discussion. You're hear to endorse half baked ideas that people here do not support. And for good reason.

[elleng]

72. Because it provides significant public benefits.

'Planned Parenthood has received federal funding since 1970, when President Richard Nixon signed into law the Family Planning Services and Population Research Act, amending the Public Health Service Act. Title X of that law provides funding for family planning services, including contraception and family planning information. The law enjoyed bipartisan support from liberals who saw contraception access as increasing families' control over their lives, and conservatives who saw it as a way to keep people off welfare.<32>'

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Planned_Parenthood

[uppityperson]

84. +1000

[MichiganVote]

7. Because I'm part of the damned public who pays taxes because I WANT it publicly funded.

But you are certainly welcome to organize fundraising. No one's stopping you dear.

[Quist]

11. Well, 'honey'...

...if we fund it privately, then the Boehners of the America can't tell us what to do with it--they'll never be able to cancel it! Wouldn't that make it worth it?

[MichiganVote]

17. Gee honey you could be onto something. So go get your coat hangers out ,bake some muffins,

and try reading some history on women and reproductive rights. I think you'll find that your strategy was used, abused and millions of women already won reproductive rights through their decades long tireless efforts. And you solution is to give way to the crybaby?

No fucking way. You wanna bake brownies, go ahead. Exactly how have you donated to Planned Parenthood this year?

[Quist]

27. What on earth are you talking about?

I'm not anti-choice--and it certainly doesn't mean we have to do it in back alleys with hangers. Private funding means all the rich progressives--there's plenty in Hollywood, in business, all over, George Soros (our patron saint) Oprah, NOW, Bill Gates etc.--could privately fund it so the GOP would never have the chance to stop it again. I mean at the rally last fall, there was about a million people at Jon Stewart's rally. At a measely $5 a head--that's 5 million dollars in a few hours... unless you don't think it's worth it.

[MichiganVote]

33. Be my guest. But I still want it PUBLICLY funded. Safe reproduction is as

important as safe food. We should all pay for it and we will all pay for it. And for the record, each and everyone of the names you have mentioned has countless charitable interests, some of which overlap with other female health centers. There is no indication these donors will solely support Planned Parenthood.

[Quist]

38. Why 'should' we all pay for it?

There's enough wealthy progressives, even middle class progressives etc. that could give something that would insure state-of-the-art treatment completely under the control of good progressives--all of us who believe in it and want it--and going to the women who need it on a sliding scale. There's no sense forcing everyone to pay for with the gov when the GOP can get control over it and cancel it on a whim.

[Justitia]

39. Why 'should' I pay for Jerry Falwell's crazy religious institution??? Because we are - 7 times more

You keep dodging this freaking question!

[Quist]

44. My original post...

...mentioned NOTHING about Jerry Falwell and Liberty U. You insist on dragging that non sequitur in.

[Justitia]

46. You want to take a tiny amt of fed $$$ from healthcare, but not a boatload from religion

I totally get where you are coming from

[Quist]

64. You don't get anything.

[Justitia]

66. LOL, oh I do. I just can't believe I wasted so much time on this thread today.

I don't usually fall for these kinds of things.

[MichiganVote]

67. Ditto Justitia--let's live to fight another day.

[Justitia]

69. Amen, sister. I usually am smarter than this - it was a weak moment - ha!

[MichiganVote]

74. :)

[Quist]

82. It's more important to you...

...to play 'gotcha' than engage in an intellectual discussion.

[Quist]

73. I can't...

...believe you did either.

[MichiganVote]

51. Your assumption that the GOP will "get control" over PP is superflous.

The parties have the same right and responsibility to determine levels of funding on any entity that the gov't supplies grant money to. The government can always choose to fund or not. That will not stop what is now a very influential international organization.

No one is forcing you or me to fund PP. If you agree to be a good citizen and pay your taxes, you agree to fund many things that you both support or not as the case may be.

Truth? There is not one male politician in Washington who gives a rats ass about abortion. The only reason they bring this dead horse out is to wet the appetites of the 'control women' crowd---mainly men.

[Quist]

70. No

I talked about US getting control over it--the Dems.

[Klukie]

36. Cut the crap

We fund it publicly precisely so one faction of society doesn't have to bear the burden of carrying all the cheap greedy assholes who are blind to the long term poverty stricken population problems that would exist by not funding a this necessary program.

[Quist]

32. ???

My strategy has never been used. People might've gotten abortions on their own, but I'm not talking about that. I'm talking about running PP and funding PP the way you would any other business on earth. Instead of gov funds (and thus gov interferance and control) surely we could get together enough money to give the people who need the care the treatment they want. It's a win-win.

[MichiganVote]

41. Well you're in luck! It is run as a business--a Not For Profit business

Planned Parenthood, is the U.S. affiliate of the International Planned Parenthood Federation (IPPF) The US affiliate is one of the larger members. PPFA provides reproductive health and maternal and child health services. Planned Parenthood Action Fund, Inc. (PPAF) is a related organization that lobbies the U.S. political system for pro-choice legislation, comprehensive sex education, and access to affordable health care.

Too tuff' for you to understand? People already DO make private contributions to PP. And the US gov't, in contrast to other countries already does interfere. As do the people who murder Doctors in the name of goodness.

[arcane1]

8. P.P. fulfills the constitutional mandate to "promote the general welfare"

and its services are a benefit to all of society, not just the specific people who use their services.

[Quist]

15. If that were true..

...then it would make it even more imperative to insure it could operate with being cancelled by some politician. Like food production--it enhances gen welfare, so it's doubly important we control it.

[MichiganVote]

20. Every aspect of food production in the US is also publicly funded.

[Quist]

23. Yes

But it didn't start out that way and people ate okay. It's not a 'have to' to happen.

[MichiganVote]

25. People ate OK???? Why do you think regulations were introduced?

People did not eat ok. They ate bad food, they ate unbalanced meals, they ate meat that was not inspected, they ate food that was routinely tainted with e coli.

Like I said, read some history. You sound ill informed.

[Quist]

81. You're making the perfect the enemy of the good.

I didn't say their eating was perfect--or even optimal. I'm saying, by virtue of their being able to survive, they ate. Don't be needlessly picky here--you miss the point.

[uppityperson]

85. Many didn't survive, many died from food borne diseases.

I guess they don't count.

[Klukie]

22. The " we" you refer to is the public..not the private

I don't trust the funding of a crucial service in the hands of a few...I prefer many hands. After all...we all stand to benefit.

[Klukie]

10. Because as we progressed as a society

and picked our knuckles up off the ground, we decided collectively that funding a system that will help to educate the populace on reproductive health and even provide services that will help to maintain that reproductive health, might provide for a better society .....and so it was.

[Quist]

18. Yes

And by privatly funding it, we could make sure this kind of shut down could never happen again! Yes, it's that important--don't you think so?

[Klukie]

24. What part of "We the people" don't you understand

[TomClash]

12. Why do you only want it to be privately funded?

Surely you like public funding of worthwhile public endeavors, right?

[jdlh8894]

28. public endeavors? Please explain.

Where I live, we have volunteer police,firemen,emts
Co-ops for Electric ,gas,food ,etc
Let's argue "public endeavors" --- Please!!!

[TomClash]

71. We are discussing federal funding

Not your local policy choices.

I don't think the health of women is a "private" matter. It's important to me and many others.

Volunteer fireman? May I suggest increasing your local political participation - or consider moving?

[uppityperson]

86. schools and roads for instance.

[Curmudgeoness]

14. Why can't the Republicans kiss my ass. Already,

there is NO federal money used for abortions. They did that a while back. Now they are intent on destroying Planned Parenthood just because. Just because they provide abortions, advocate a woman's rights, and help the poor with "women's health". They just want it gone. And I say NO...this is a line in the sand.

[Quist]

21. That's what I mean.

If we funded it privately, we'd never have to deal with those that could shut it down!

[Curmudgeoness]

35. I can see by all your posts that there is no reasoning with you on this, but

I will just say that there are so many worthy government endeavors that "could" be privately funded, but the cost of doing all the good things that they do is prohibitive with private funding.

The way you are phrasing your argument, everything that the government does could be privatized. And we can see what stands and what folds. But I will say this much----your taxes WILL STILL NOT GO DOWN. Your government will continue to take your money, and give you less and less, and expect you to decide what gets funded and what doesn't by your giving donations from your take home pay.

[Quist]

68. Well, I can agree with that.

So far, yours is the most logical rationale; everyone else just doesn't get it, or they're too angry to make themselves understood. It's true--by what I said, everything could conceivably be privately funded and we have to pick and choose what we can afford. And, I suppose our taxes wouldn't go down--they never do...

[Curmudgeoness]

76. You see, my big argument with RWers regarding privatization

of everything that government does is that there are some things that we need in a civil society, but that could never provide a profit. It must be government money used to do some things---food inspections for example. How would you make a profit from that? Or the Center for Disease Control? There are charities that provide many of the same things that government agencies provide, but they struggle a great deal. Spread the money thinner for charities, and none of them will be able to survive. Sometimes, we just need the government to do some things that are beneficial to society and will not produce profits.

[Quist]

78. Now

That's an argument I can actually buy. Everyone else was just talking with their emotions, talking out of their hat, not listening, not understanding--you actually considered the matter and provided logical feedback. Thanks!

[Curmudgeoness]

79. Well, gee whiz, I am usually in the hot seat when I post.

This feels good. :hi:

[Rhiannon12866]

16. The abortion services part of it already is

Since passage of a 1976 law that prohibited federal funding for abortion services. The other 97% of the services Planned Parenthood offers are basic heath care services that keep people alive, cancer screenings, pap tests, breast exams, and family planning counseling, which results in fewer abortions, the thing that Republicans want to eliminate. And this is often for lower income women who depend on Planned Parenthood for their health care. But Planned Parenthood has been demonized by the right wing, and average citizens have come to believe their lies. x(

[TomClash]

75. It is also the will of the people

http://www.docstoc.com/docs/document-preview.aspx?doc_id=75731915