Homeopathy Is 'Dangerous and Wasteful,' Bioethics Expert Argues

[Liberal Veteran]

A bioethics expert from the University of Abertay Dundee has denounced the public funding of homeopathy at a time where Scotland's health budget is under unprecedented pressure. Writing in the journal Bioethics, Dr Kevin Smith says that Homeopathy is 'ethically unacceptable' and should be 'actively rejected' by healthcare and education providers.

...snip...

Dr Smith argues that in addition wasting valuable resources, government funding gives credibility to homeopathy, which puts patients at risk. "NHS funding for homeopathy legitimises it and suggests a scientific basis, the risk is then that people will avoid effective medicine, potentially damaging their health. The same applies to education providers running homeopathy courses," he said.


http://www.sciencedaily.com/releases/2011/05/110509065749.htm?utm_source=feedburner&utm_medium=feed&utm_campaign=Feed%3A+sciencedaily+%28ScienceDaily%3A+Latest+Science+News%29&utm_content=Google+Feedfetcher

I couldn't agree with Doctor Kevin Smith more.

[Ian David]

1. Homeopathy is SO STUPID that it amazes me we still have to discuss it anywhere.

We may as well be arguing over whether to give bloodlettings to release foul humours.

[Melissa G]

2. I use it much of the time.

Best Flu remedy I have found. When my children were little it resolved many late nights when drugs would not have helped. Have all you avid denouncers actually used homeopathy?

[provis99]

3. you forgot the sarcasm tag.

[Melissa G]

10. None intended.

[MineralMan]

4. Well, I drink water daily. I figure I'm taking every homeopathetic

remedy in the armamentarium every time I drink a glass of water. My glass of water contains as much of the active ingredients in every homeopathetic "remedy" ever foisted off on the unsuspecting public. I figure I'll never die.

[Lisa0825]

5. The only way homeopathy works is by the placebo effect.

Do you really believe in water with memory? Or are you among the many many people who confuse natural remedies with homeopathy? There are many natural remedies that have proven benefits, but NONE in homeopathy.

[Liberal Veteran]

7. If water has memory, then every drop is homeopathic urine.

:rofl:

[NickB79]

32. Not just urine, DINOSAUR urine!

Just imagine the ass-kicking a glassful of T-rex piss would give out to those pesky tumors and cold viruses! It can't fail!

[Melissa G]

11. Have you ever actually used it?

[HERVEPA]

13. Have you ever heard of unverifiable anecdotal information versus scientific method

[Melissa G]

15. Sure...

The Queen of England sponsors a royal hospital. Before Americans got into the world wars we used to use it more actively here in the states. Europeans have lots of homeopaths.
http://www.wholehealthnow.com/homeopathy_pro/england.html

Edit to add The physician to Her Royal Highness is a homeopathic physician.

Not that it particularly natters but Both My Vet and my Pharmacist use homeopathy.

[HERVEPA]

18. Then your pharmacist, if he is actually a licensed pharmacist, should lose his/her license

[Melissa G]

19. She is a licensed pharmacist and has no reason to lose her license

and neither does my favorite vet. People use things that work well for them and abandon those that don't.

My first husband, 30 years ago was an acupuncturist. I had to listen to endless noise about how that could not work either, because it did not fit into the paradigm of the person who was making the various assertions. "How could a pin in your hand affect your head and mouth? Preposterous!" and that was just from my family.

Meanwhile, I had dental surgery done using acupuncture for anesthesia and it was my primary form of heath care for many years.My ex husband had a thriving practice and now, of course, there are acupuncturists everywhere.

[HERVEPA]

21. Well, facilitating the use of snake oil should cause her to lose her license

How about showing some reputable, scientific, peer-reviewed studies on its efficacy.
Or, for that matter, for acupuncture.

[Melissa G]

33. Correction I just called down there..

My favorite Homeopath at the Pharmacy is just a homeopath who is very knowledgeable about prescription drugs, but the owner/ pharmacist of the Pharmacy who hires the homeopath and most of the pharmacists there are also able to discuss the full line of homeopathics they carry. I can tell this group hates homeopathics, mostly having never used them, so I will just wander back to the alternative health forum and save my breath.
Love to all.

[laconicsax]

34. Your observation is incorrect.

This group doesn't "hate" homeopathy, it recognizes that it's all sugar pills, water, and placebo effect rather than actual medicine. This has nothing to do with "having never used" it and everything to do with reality.

[cleanhippie]

22. Interesting. The UK recently REMOVED all homeopathy from the NHS as a viable service.

Because after a 10 year study, they concluded that it worked no better than placebo and was simply a sham.

[HERVEPA]

28. I'm shocked. Shocked!

[muriel_volestrangler]

43. Are you sure? The quacks claim they still get £4 million per year from the NHS

http://www.britishhomeopathic.org/media_centre/facts_about_homeopathy/nhs_referrals.html (page last updated 8/8/11)

A parliamentary committee recommended, last year, that all funding be withdrawn, but that hasn't yet happened, as far as I can tell (perhaps because of the influence of the ultra-gullible Queen and Prince of Wales). If there has been an announcement that the money has been cut off, I'd be jubilant - any link gratefully received.

[muriel_volestrangler]

42. The Queen of England is an uneducated ignoramus

who was home-schooled. Her recommendation of homoeopathy, or anything scientific, is about as much good as Glenn Beck's would be (I have no idea if he's a fan, but it's the kind of generally ignorant thing he'd do).

[LeftishBrit]

45. The Queen of England is not a medical expert, or indeed a highly educated individual

She is fortunate to have good genes for longevity from her mother, and unlike some other royals, she leads a fairly healthy lifestyle. So it's 'long to reign over us'; but not through the homeopathy.

[SidDithers]

16. Do you actually know what it is?...

Are you confusing homeopathy with naturopathic?

Sid

[Melissa G]

20. Yes, I know what it is and No, I am not confusing the two.

There were four major forms of medicine in the US before the wars gave allopathic medicine the edge by having it subsidized by the government. Allopathic medicine primarily works by cutting it out, drugging it out, or burning it out, making it very well suited to wars and emergency medical work.

Homeopathic, Naturopathic, Allopathic and one other which I think was osteopathic, (but I have to confirm that last) were the 4 types of medical schools at the the beginning of the last century.

Essentially, the AMA, which was pretty barbaric at the time, kicked out all the other forms of medicine and the government who needed allopathic physicians for their wars supported this financially. If you want, I'll find you some historical links later. This all the roots of Big Pharma BTW...Have to go to work now...

[HuckleB]

24. Nice story.

Have you ever heard of the scientific method? Well, that's where we should be focused now. Homeopathy is implausible, baseless and ridiculous. It is a scam. It is faith healing at best.

Cut the nonsense.

[Melissa G]

25. When I was in grad school taking statistics

I learned to look at who funds studies and how they are framed. You can fund a study to get a particular answer and you can frame a study to fail. Did you notice all the problems with the nutrition studies that were funded by the cattle companies and the dairy industry. That can make for a lot of nonsense.

If you are doing a study on a different set of assumptions and asking why does homeopathy not work the same as allopathy, there is an inherent problem in the question. If allopathy and Big Pharma are doing the studies, I am not surprised at the various results. I believe there are still 40% of studies in the face of the bias with favorable results.

I don't expect to move anyone who is on the "nonsense" end of the spectrum to the agreement end especially if they have no actual experience of what they are discussing. I only suggest a more open mind.
Best,
Melissa

[HuckleB]

26. Apparenlty you didn't learn anything about basic scientific plausibility in your statistics class.

http://www.sciencebasedmedicine.org/?p=604

This isn't about experience, as experience is not as helpful as you might think: http://www.sciencebasedmedicine.org/?p=729 . (I admit that I fell for the nonsense at one point in my life, btw.) This is about the real world, and homeopathy is a fictional treatment. No statistics, nor any discussion of funding will change that.

[BuddhaGirl]

27. +1

Thanks for the history! :thumbsup:

Sad to see the demise of the Eclectics and others :-(

[Name removed]

6. Deleted message

Message removed by moderator. Click here to review the message board rules.

[SidDithers]

17. If you're so poor, why are you wasting your money on snake oil?...nt

Sid

[ZombieHorde]

30. Fair accusation. I will try it on myself next time I get sick. What brand do you use?

If you use several brands, please list them so I can have an easier time finding them.

[HuckleB]

31. Municipal is usually the cheapest, and it works as well as any of the other brands.

[ProfessionalLeftist]

8. Yea we don't want to cut into big pharma's profits

What the hell do people think many of our "FDA approved" drugs are made from?

[Liberal Veteran]

9. Certainly not from water, which is all homeopathy is.

[ProfessorPlum]

12. thanks for a breath of fresh air on this site - reason and rationality

are sometimes in a bit of short supply here. As you say, it is just water. The fact that people charge for it is criminal.

[laconicsax]

14. You do realize that if homeopathy actually worked, "big pharma" would be making selling it.

Too bad for them, the FDA requires that things actually work to be sold as medicine.

[eShirl]

36. let me guess: you mistakenly think homeopathic is another word for herbal or natural?

[LeftishBrit]

46. Probably not from pure water.

I wonder if you are thinking of herbal medicines rather than homeopathy? Because a lot of drugs do come from plants.

[cleanhippie]

23. I have unlimited access to free homeopathic "medicine", as much as I want, and its FREE!!

It dispenses in several places throughout my home. I think its such a waste though to have to use all that "medicine" to flush my toilets....

[SidDithers]

29. I bathe in my homeopathic medicine...

I believe in total immersion homeopathy.

Sid

[semillama]

35. I find homeopathic remedies work well

when the solution includes hops, barley, and comes in a six-pack.

[laconicsax]

39. One drop or two?

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=HMGIbOGu8q0#t=2m18s

[LeftishBrit]

41. Where I live...

more homeopathic medicine than you could ever need frequently falls from the sky!

[vim876]

37. I'm pretty sure...

that vaccinations are based on homeopathic principles. So I guess that polio vaccine was worthless, then.

[laconicsax]

38. You're grossly mistaken.

Homeopathy is based on two ridiculous and unscientific ideas:
1) Law of similars: Something that gives you a fever will cure a fever, something that gives you a headache will cure a headache.
2) Succession: The more a substance is diluted, the more potent it becomes.

Basically, the inventor of homeopathy tried treating patients using the law of similars. He found that the patients that received the higher dilutions (less active ingredient) did better than those given more active ingredient. His conclusion was that dilution increases potentcy rather than realizing that the law of similars was garbage. The typical diutions in homeopathic 'remedies' are such that not even a single molecule of the original substance remains.

Vaccines on the other hand, contain a weakened or killed virus to allow the immune system to make antibodies. When an immunized person contracts a disease they've been immunized against, their body is able to immediately begin fighting the infection. The similarity to the law of similars in homeopathy is coincidental and superficial. Homeopathy played no role in the development of immunization just as astrology played no role in the discovery of Neptune.

So you see, homeopathy is nonsense based on further nonsense that's been thoroughly discredited while vaccines are based on actual medical science and biology and are one of the greatest successes of the 20th century.

[Confusious]

44. Vaccines got started about 50 to 100 years

before waterpathy, so you're wrong

As far as them being connected to anything waterpathy, it's long gone.

Vaccines are based on science. proven in use where the placebo effect has no control.

waterpathy, Fantasy thinking.

[HuckleB]

40. Hilarious UK Homeopath Squirms When Confronted By Simon Singh

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=s1UJ_qGZ24k&feature=related

[LeftishBrit]

47. kick!