Out of the Labyrinth (Of evidence based nonsense)

[HysteryDiagnosis]

Dr. Abram Hoffer: Mask of Madness http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=dMMzS6tLnOE

http://orthomolecular.org/library/stories/index.shtml

In that moment, my story somehow escaped its sad ending and headed off in the direction of a new and brighter future with its storyteller running to catch up. I'm still running, but I've long since caught up and now I'm in the lead. I still take large doses of vitamin B3 and C along with an assortment of other nutrients added to a sensible diet. This year I attended the 35th Annual Conference on Nutritional Medicine Today and was able again to shake the hand of the man who had changed my life and shown me the way out of the labyrinth of mental illness.

Thanks again Dr. Hoffer. I'll be sending you a copy of my latest album through the mail. On it you will find a song entitled "Little Green Pills", co-written by myself and Carlene Hope, criticizing current psychiatric practice and lamenting the sad fact that after more than fifty years since your discovery, too many of us still haven't had the good fortune to encounter orthomolecular medicine as I did.

That song was written for and is dedicated to you Dr. Hoffer, and in fact most probably would not exist without your pioneering work and steadfast spirit. Someday, the whole human family will know and appreciate what you have done for it, and medicine will have another hero to honour. Until then I salute you as the man who put me on the path you discovered way back in 1952; the path that led me out of the labyrinth.

[xchrom]

1. What? Nt

[HuckleB]

3. He doesn't know either.

Just laugh, and let it go.

:rofl:

[EvolveOrConvolve]

2. "Evidence based nonsense"?

You've gotta be shitting me. If I wasn't educated in the ways of the quack, I'd have thought this a story from the onion.

http://www.quackwatch.org/01QuackeryRelatedTopics/ortho.html

[HysteryDiagnosis]

5. No shit here. Quackwatch is an extreme site, be careful there.

http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed?term=omega%20three%20schizophrenia

BMC Psychiatry. 2010 May 26;10:38.
Dietary intake of fish, omega-3, omega-6 polyunsaturated fatty acids and vitamin D and the prevalence of psychotic-like symptoms in a cohort of 33,000 women from the general population.
Hedelin M, Löf M, Olsson M, Lewander T, Nilsson B, Hultman CM, Weiderpass E.
Source

Department of Neuroscience, Psychiatry, Ulleråker, Uppsala University, Uppsala, Sweden. [e-mail]
Abstract
BACKGROUND:

Low intake of fish, polyunsaturated fatty acids (PUFA) and vitamin D deficiency has been suggested to play a role in the development of schizophrenia. Our aim was to evaluate the association between the intake of different fish species, PUFA and vitamin D and the prevalence of psychotic-like symptoms in a population-based study among Swedish women.
METHODS:

Dietary intake was estimated using a food frequency questionnaire among 33,623 women aged 30-49 years at enrollment (1991/92). Information on psychotic-like symptoms was derived from a follow-up questionnaire in the years 2002/03. Participants were classified into three predefined levels: low, middle and high frequency of symptoms. The association between diet and psychotic-like symptoms was summarized in terms of relative risks (RR) and corresponding 95% confidence intervals and was evaluated by energy-adjusted multinomial logistic regression.
RESULTS:

18,411 women were classified as having a low level of psychotic-like symptoms, 14 395 as middle and 817 as having a high level. The risk of high level symptoms was 53% (95% CI, 30-69%) lower among women who ate fish 3-4 times per week compared to women who never ate fish. The risk was also lower for women with a high intake of omega-3 and omega-6 PUFA compared to women with a lower intake of these fatty acids. The effect was most pronounced for omega-6 PUFAs. The RR comparing the highest to the lowest quartile of omega-6 PUFAs intake was 0.78 (95% CI, 0.64-0.97).

The associations were J-shaped with the strongest reduced risk for an intermediate intake of fish or PUFA. For fatty fish (herring/mackerel, salmon-type fish), the strongest inverse association was found for an intermediate intake (RR: 0.81, 95% CI, 0.66-0.98), whereas a high intake of fatty fish was associated with an increased risk of psychotic-like symptoms (RR: 1.90, 95% CI, 1.34-2.70). Women in the highest compared with the lowest quartile of vitamin D consumption experienced a 37% (95% CI, 22-50%) lower risk of psychotic-like symptoms.


CONCLUSION:

Our findings raise a possibility that adult women with a high intake of fish, omega-3 or omega-6 PUFA and vitamin D have a lower rate of psychotic-like symptoms.

PMID:
20504323

PMCID: PMC2889879

[laconicsax]

7. I thought evidence was bad--yet you just posted some.

:shrug:

[EvolveOrConvolve]

10. "Extreme"? LOL, okay

If by "extreme", you mean "doesn't agree with HysteryDiagnosis' worldview", then yea, they're extreme all right.

[HysteryDiagnosis]

11. It doesn't agree with the CAM division of the NIH, it doesn't agree with the German Commision

E Monographs, it Doesn't agree with half of the papers published in Pubmed. Yes I'd say they are extreme in their lack of reading comprehension.

[EvolveOrConvolve]

12. Of course they don't agree with most CAM

They're called Quackwatch for a reason. They watch quacks, many of whom find a tidy, profitable home in the world of CAM.

[HysteryDiagnosis]

13. Love your sig btw, reminds me of another quack so to speak.

http://www.thunderbolts.info/EU%20Intro%20and%20Chap1.p...

On the issue of redshift, Sagan wrote: “There is nevertheless a
nagging suspicion among some astronomers, that all may not be right
with the deduction, from the redshift of galaxies via the Doppler effect,
that the universe is expanding. The astronomer Halton Arp has found
enigmatic and disturbing cases where a galaxy and a quasar, or a pair
of galaxies, that are in apparent physical association have very
different redshifts....”31

Sagan’s acknowledgment here shows a candor almost never
found in standard treatments of astronomy for the general public today.
“If Arp is right,” he wrote, “the exotic mechanisms proposed to ex-
plain the energy source of distant quasars—supernova chain reactions,
super massive black holes and the like—would prove unnecessary.
Quasars need not then be very distant. But some other exotic mecha-
nism will be required to explain the redshift. In either case, something
very strange is going on in the depths of space.”

At the time of Sagan’s Cosmos, evidence contradicting the Doppler
interpretation of redshift could be discussed in popular presentations.
The paradox is that the intervening years have seen an avalanche of
evidence against Big Bang assumptions, even as public relations an-
nouncements have ‘confirmed’ them and NASA refuses to fund any
project questioning the Big Bang.32

[EvolveOrConvolve]

14. What reasons do you have for believing Sagan a quack?

I mean other than some Googlearrehea you found.

And thunderbolts.info? You have the balls to call Sagan a quack at the same time you're quoting that "site"?

[HysteryDiagnosis]

15. The only reason I don't consider it a quack site is because I have read it for more than

five minutes and have weighed the evidence. They are correct, you lose.

[EvolveOrConvolve]

16. But wait, didn't you say you're against "evidence based nonsense"?

I'm confused. You can't have it both ways.

[laconicsax]

17. You can have it both ways in...

¡¡¡The Electric Universe!!!

[HysteryDiagnosis]

18. Yes, it was quite possibly the most confusing OP ever posted on DU. Sorry for that. n/t

[EvolveOrConvolve]

20. I'm still confused...

Are you for or against evidence based science and medicine?

[HysteryDiagnosis]

21. I am all for evidence based science and medicine as long as it doesn't do more harm

than good, as long as the cure isn't worse than the illness and as long as there isn't something cheap and readily available in the natural world that works better with little or no side effects. I consider most pharmaceutical drugs to be alternative medicine. Many of them create drug induced nutrient deficiencies and we don't need that now do we.


http://www.amazon.com/Drug-Induced-Nutrient-Depletion-Handbook-Pelton/dp/1930598459
This work contains a complete and up-to-date listing of all drugs known to deplete the body of nutritional compounds. Alphabetically organized, 150 drugs that cause nutrient depletion are identified and cross-referenced to more detailed descriptions of the nutrients depleted and their actions. Symptoms of depletion and sources of repletion are also included. The appendices include a quick reference drug-induced nutrient depletion table, along with details on food/drug interactions and herb/nutrient depletions.

[EvolveOrConvolve]

22. So how do you make the determination

that, for example, a drug does "more harm than good"? Do you use all the evidence available when making your decision?

[HysteryDiagnosis]

6. Something else you may like:

http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/21457901

Complement Ther Clin Pract. 2011 May;17(2):107-12.
Food as medicine in psychiatric care: which profession should be responsible for imparting knowledge and use of omega-3 fatty acids in psychiatry.
Johannessen B, Skagestad I, Bergkaasa AM.
Source

University of Agder, Faculty of Health and Sports, Institute of Health and Nursing Science, Norway. [e-mail]
Abstract

The effect of omega-3 fatty acids on depression is well documented. The purpose of this study was to determine if and how food is used as medicine in psychiatric care, especially how omega-3 fatty acids are used as a supplement in the treatment of depression. This is a pilot study with a qualitative design using questionnaires and interviews among nursing students, tutor nurses and psychiatrists. Three main categories emerged: 1. Nutrition is considered important but few evaluations are made. 2. There was a lack of knowledge of the effects of Omega 3. 3. There was an unclear division of responsibility among health personnel.

A change in knowledge paradigms and clarification of responsibility is called for if food-as-medicine is to take its true place in psychiatric care. It is also necessary to include CAM and holistic perspectives. Further research is needed to determine why health education and health workers do not focus on nutrition therapy in psychiatric care. Further research is also needed to reveal both the patients, the GPs and the CAM practitioners' knowledge and attitude to the use of dietary supplements.

Copyright © 2010 Elsevier Ltd. All rights reserved.

[laconicsax]

4. Wait...what?

Aren't you constantly posting advertisements full of evidence for supplements? Is evidence a bad thing now? If it's a bad thing, why do you keep making posts that rely on it?

[Posteritatis]

19. The quack community has used "evidence-based" as a synonym for "bad" for years. (nt)

[uppityperson]

8. I'm confused. Isn't what you usually post, vits/supplements, based on evidence?

[HysteryDiagnosis]

9. Yup, poor choice of words there, however those who cannot connect nutritional

deficiencies, imbalances, allergies and so forth with mental health are a bit lacking imho.