The Male Condition

[Dover]

The Male Condition

By SIMON BARON-COHEN
Published: August 8, 2005
Cambridge, England

TWO big scientific debates have attracted a lot of attention over the past year. One concerns the causes of autism, while the other addresses differences in scientific aptitude between the sexes. At the risk of adding fuel to both fires, I submit that these two lines of inquiry have a great deal in common. By studying the differences between male and female brains, we can generate significant insights into the mystery of autism...cont'd

http://www.nytimes.com/2005/08/08/opinion/08baron-cohen.html?incamp=article_popular

[Mr_Spock]

1. I agree with the basic premise - though I wasn't able to read the article

I don't have time to type up why, but since autism is kind of a "boy" thing, it seems obvious to me that the differences in the brains ought to help sort out some of the perplexing issues associated with autism. Even my daughter with Aspergers is described as having "boy-like" behavior - whatever that means - but I agree.

[Liberty Belle]

2. This part's really fascinating:

"According to what I have called the "extreme male brain" theory of autism, people with autism simply match an extreme of the male profile, with a particularly intense drive to systemize and an unusually low drive to empathize."

[omega minimo]

3. Is autism why

men won't ask for directions?

[Igel]

4. No, it's why

women can say, "You're a man. You just don't get it."

[omega minimo]

5. Same thing, eh?

A lot of frustration/confusion is caused by what women experience as men who WON'T get it, when the truth may by they CAN'T get it.

[Desertrose]

6. so in a way....men really are

from Mars while women are from Venus...another way of saying that our brains truly function differently.....

Hmmm...that s'plains a lot!

[greyl]

7. Desertrose, humans are from earth.

We can't save the world if we're living in another one. :)

[omega minimo]

8. Could help some women understand

that some men are not necessarily willfully obstinate and obtuse-- may be something else going on....

[Desertrose]

9. Thank you omega minimo

I think that point was just made by the post above
:evilgrin:

But I do agree that if we understand that humans actually think differently and their brains function differently it might solve some problems or at least answer some questions.

I've been saying for years that there is a difference in the way "male" & "female" brains (not necessarily a strict gender division either) process and deal with information, just from observation.



typo

[HuckleB]

18. On average, that may be true.

As individuals it's another story.

[Igel]

14. My wife and I sometimes talk completely past each other.

She's busy empathizing or wanting empathy, I'm trying to figure out what the situation is and how to navigate through it.

They should *tell* us these things in high school! Quadratic equation or stoichiometry versus male/female psychological differences. Gee ... which do people use more often?

[phantom power]

10. Somebody floated a theory that engineers are mildly autistic.

Or, more generically, "geeks". We all know the symptoms. A lack of social skills, ability to focus on certain problems, to the exclusion of all else, etc. In moderation, those are useful traits, but turned up too far, you get a serious mental disorder.

[Dogmudgeon]

11. The REAL difference between the sexes

It requires nudity. And a good sense of humor.

--p!

[Meldread]

12. This is very interesting -- but I have a question.

What about gay people? It's really a question tacked on to the above discussion of men to women communication and the opposite sex "not getting it."

What about gay people? I sometimes have a lot of those moments where I am communicating with someone (could be male or female) and it's like I just began speaking Latin or Greek. No matter how simple I try and make it they just won't get it. I've found that it typically involves issues dealing with emotion and inner expression or creativity/ability to vision something not yet in existence.

Emotionally, I am different from a lot of men that I know. I'd say the majority. My emotions tend to almost mirror the emotions of people around me. I can watch something happen, watch someone experience something, and even though I may not KNOW that person or have any special connection with the event it feels like it happened to me as well. I can feel sad, heart broken, happy... whatever. It's very strange. Yet I can look around (especially if the room is full of men) and notice that they are all stone faced. No expression. No emotion. The only reason I notice that I am slightly different in that aspect is because their response has forced me to learn to hide my reactions and emotions in such situations. Like in intense drama movies I may see a really sad moment and if the acting is good and believable I may feel the strong urge to cry and/or feel horribly sad and heartbroken. It's really strange.

[Desertrose]

13. I'd call that being empathic...

when you pick up and "take on" what is happening around you. I've had that all my life...took me a long t ime to learn that I didn't have to be the sponge for other people's stuff.

I do feel that there clearly are differences in the way people think...don't want to cut it along gender lines cause there are degrees within each....some are more "emotion" based and some not emotion based at all.

Too bad anyone has to hide who they are just to be accepted.

It would be an interesting study to compare any differences between gay and lesbians way of perceiving/thinking with straight people. My guess is there would be a variation but perhaps just not as wide as within the straight community....just a hunch.

I also wonder if there are not more men who hide that they sometimes respond emotionally...especially if they are within a group of men....

[omega minimo]

15. Are you

an artist?

[Meldread]

16. Unfortunately, no.

I sucked horribly in art. It was never a problem visualizing WHAT I wanted to paint or draw, because I could picture exactly what I wanted painted or drawn perfectly in my mind. The problem was translating that to paper/canvas.

My art teacher used to call them "Hoovers" (the nice way of saying they sucked).

It always irked me to no end that I could picture something hundreds of times more beautiful than anyone else could paint but never could actually articulate it onto a canvas.

[Desertrose]

17. IMO that is what makes an artist....that they can visualize

the picture or finished piece in the first palce. Just because you didn't have the technical skills to actually create it, doesn't make you any less of an artist.

The difference between a good artist and a not so good one is their vision.
(speaking as an artist :) )

"Hoovers"...funny and yet kinda sad...where was the encouragement there? great way to make someone feel like crap about their artistic talents. I say if you want to paint, don't let someone else stop you from trying. Like anything, I lot of the technical skills come with doing.