Just came from the belly of the beast: UCLA Pharmacology lab

[Coventina]

Hi all, I've been in California the last couple of days. Just got back in last night, made one quick post and went to bed.

I don't know if you guys are interested or not, but I went to the UCLA Pharmacology lab, as a guest. A relative of mine works there. I knew she worked there in pharmacology and I knew she worked with mice but I never quite had all the details. Until Thursday when I was there.

I have come away from the experience with a lot of mixed emotions, but with a good deal of shock and horror.

Maybe all of you who are knowledgeable about this stuff already know everything about what goes on there. I also have a feeling like I need to protect my relative, so I hesitate to just come out and post everything I learned, unless you are really interested.

I also have to admit that I said nothing to anyone, although my stance was acknowledged at one point when another relative suggested, "Coventina, cover your ears." when they were talking about what ultimately happens to the mice.

I feel ashamed, yet, I don't know really what I could have said or done, without causing a family drama during what was meant to be a happy time.

What do you guys do about family conflicts in the AR area? Do any of you have close relatives that do something that is (according to your values) horrific? And if so, how do you handle it?

[flvegan]

1. That sucks, but I can understand.

My brother is my polar opposite, practically. Though he'll never walk me through an animal research facility, I understand your point. I do my best to not discuss those things that I find "horrific" as he already knows how I feel. If he asks, I'll educate him. He once asked what the difference between eating veal and eating a hamburger was. I try to let my actions speak louder than my voice.

That said, I'm sorry you had to witness what must've been an awesome display of thoughtlessness and cruelty. Be thankful that you didn't see UCLA's primate lab, but I doubt they allow guests.

[Coventina]

2. Security is very tight, the only mice we saw were behind glass.

Besides the security concerns, the mice are specially bred to have NO, absolutely NO immune system. The smallest germ getting access to them would kill them quickly, so they have to be handled very carefully. In our street clothes and as unauthorized personnel there was no chance of us getting direct contact.

Interestingly, the scientist who gave us the tour (not my relative) talked about the dog & primate lab. She expressed her horror at what is done to the dogs and primates and said she is glad to be working "just" with mice.

*sigh*

I see where she does see a difference, given the choice I'd "rather" experiment on a mouse than a dog or primate. But jeez....what a "choice"!
But I acknowledge that most people don't see it that way, as mice are considered "vermin".

*sigh*

[flvegan]

3. Not surprised

At least they're keeping a strict environment around them, keeping even more needless waste of life at a minimum. I actually thought that UCLA had done away with it's dog lab. I know UCSD still has one.

The disconnect with mice is much easier to have, I'm sure.

[LeftyMom]

4. Honestly we don't talk about it.

I have a relative who is very very very very anti-AR. Very. I suppose her position is not suprising since she made her substantial pile of cash from an animal exploitation business.

Her mind isn't gong to be changed and mine sure as hell isn't so the only point in bringing it up would be to amuse or mortify the rest of the family.

[Coventina]

5. I'm glad you guys don't fault me for having done/said nothing

I was pondering all this in the shower this morning (where I do a lot of my serious thinking for whatever reason).

I was feeling sort of bad because I thought, "Well, what if she were running a puppy mill? Would I press for anti-puppy mill legislation? Try to shut down her operation in any way I could? But because what she does is "cancer research" at a prestigious institution that makes it okay?"

I have to say.....I don't have a definitive answer....and I don't know if I am a hypocrite or not.

:-(

:shrug:

[LeftyMom]

6. You can always say somthing later

Since you weren't comfortable with saying something on the spot that doesn't mean you have to be quiet forever. You could even send an email or a letter if you don't want to say something aloud.

Thankfully I don't find myself in that dillemma, as my realtive's exploitation business is long gone. Through no virtue of hers mind, it was *ahem* outside influences.