Total ignoramus seeks advice on Mac purchase . . . .

[hatrack]

OK, here's the scoop.

I'm currently using a PC and am preparing to go Mac, though no time soon - probably in the next year.

I'm running a 2003 vintage Sony Vaio, which has been pretty reliable. However, scrubbing and C-Cleaner and all of that notwithstanding, using my computer in the past year has become like wading through hip-deep mud and it takes reverse dog years of waiting after startup before it's actually ready to work with. Old, tired hard drive? Could be, but I'm not nearly enough of a geek to know for sure.

Ideally, I'd like to get enough of machine that it will give me more than the nearly-six years of service I've gotten from my existing computer. I'd also like something that's going to be robust enough to be speedy online five or six years from now, and reliable enough to last at least that long.

So, Mini, IMac or Pro? I'd like to keep on using the LCD monitor I'm currently using and cut down on the amount of toxic crap on either the production or disposal end of the process, if that simplifies the suggestion process . . . And believe me, it's not that cost is no object - it is - but with a year or so in hand, I have plenty of time to save for whatever I end up getting.

Any thoughts appreciated!

Thanks and :toast:

[Deja Q]

1. The high-end 27" iMac ($1999, quad core i7, ATi 4850 video, 4GB) would do you nicely.

The iMacs use IPS panels for the monitors -- TOP QUALITY stuff. The off-the-shelf 27" monitor at a big box store costs $500 and uses a crap TN panel. The IPS panel alone more than makes up any claims iMacs are overpriced.


I know you want to keep your current monitor. Dual monitor setups work great on Macs.

The entry-level Mac Pro is $2499. A damn good machine (I have one) and VERY expandable, but the new iMacs are easy windows-killers... This model has a 2.66GHz Xeon processor, 3GB, nVidia GTX120 video. With student discount, I upped to 8GB and had a ATi 4870 put in. (going from 2.66 to 2.93GHz CPU is not worth $500, which BTW is still $100 **less** than what newegg.com would charge for the same CPU upgrade. :D Mac Pro users are upgrading to the 3.33GHz CPU anyway - where the difference in speed will be noticed.)

The Mac Pro's case alone squashes any piddling PC plastic. Only ONE cable, and that's neatly tucked around the edges for the optical drives. Otherwise the design is cable-free. No PC vendor could do the same - probably because it would cost them too much. Apple thinks things through, which is partly why they cost more. (Not to mention, the pre-installed garbage on new PCs help subsidize the cost OF the PC. If the demo programs and other garbage weren't contracted, Windows PCs would cost just about as much...)

By the time, next year, you do buy, both iMac and Mac Pro will have far faster equipment as standard components.

[hatrack]

2. Many thanks!!

I particularly appreciate your take on what is - and isn't - worth the cost of upgrade/ad-ons.

I may have a few more questions, but a couple of glasses of wine late on Friday night is not the time to ask them. Talk to you soon!

[Touchdown]

3. You can take your old computer to an Apple Store and they will

dispose of it in a green way. Check out their website. They got a page on their program. The monitor also.

And I agree with Q. The iMacs are great computers, and they're fast enough for 6 years worth of life.

[Deja Q]

6. Or sell the PC used on ebay, though I'd probably go Apple and recycle...

or gazelle.com, but they typically undervalue (and then lower the value if they see even a speck of dust, remove it, and slightly scratch it in the process. The other trade-up programs, I don't trust them.)

[47of74]

17. What my brother and I did

My brother had an old iBook G4. He was going to wait until sometime this year and replace it with a new MacBook. However about a month before the new uni-body aluminum MacBooks came out the iBook G4 gave up and died on him. He was stuck using an old spare PC laptop for a month. Well finally when the new MacBooks came out he ordered one as soon as the store came back on line. He thought about sending the iBook in for recycling but I went and checked on the Retro MacCast site if anyone was interested in a non-functional G4 for parts. Turns out someone was interested and he got $50 out of the deal.

[Deja Q]

5. Always feel free to ask!

Always glad to venture my opinion! :D (some of it is opinion, some is fact, some is inference... :D )

And I love to study up on the latest, PC and Mac... (I've even read up on people upgrading their single quad Mac Pros to the W3580 CPU. Nice Apple lets us do it if we choose... :D Dual quad Macs can be as well, but the IHS (integrated head spreader) was removed from the CPUs, so replacing those is a dangerous chore (on top of ensuring buying two processors of the identical build...).)

[ChairmanAgnostic]

8. and do NOT waste money on Microsopht Office for the mac.

Neo Office is a robust, superb, truly great program that reads and writes all formats, and as shareware, the cost is around $0.
Spreadsheets, Word processing, Power Pointless, drawing, database, it does everything Office does, and often better.

So right there you save $3-400.

[struggle4progress]

4. Before you buy, think about what you really need and whether you can get there

by upgrading yourself, rather than by having apple add everything you want at time of purchase. Some of these machines are more easily upgraded than others. Spend some time googling before you buy: you'll find that manufacturer sometimes does odd things, like using a faster processor but a slower bus

People do upgrade minis, but it looks tricky to me; on the other hand, they are unobtrusive and entirely decent machines; I have a 2009 with 4gb ram and a 2ghz duo processor that was quite affordable. The small size of the mini brings with it a human-error danger: it really shouldn't be moved while turned on, lest gyro forces gimp the hard drive, but it's so small and so easy to pick up that one could forget this hazard

Replacing the hard drive or upgrading memory in a white macbook is very easy. I don't know how tricky this is in an imac

Adding memory (up to 32gb) and/or extra drives to a pro is very easy. One set of specs I saw erroneously claimed no drive could be more than 1tb, but apple told me there was no limit, and I have a 1.5tb in one of the bays. There are four pcie slots that are accessible, too, though only one of mine is double-spaced; moreover, there are only two little (barely accessible) power plugs on the mother board -- so for space reasons, you can't use more than two double-wide video cards, and I'm limited to one because the one I use requires power from both plugs. It seems likely to me that a pcie ssd might speed the machine substantially for some uses. Upgrading the processor may not be easy or even possible

Be forewarned that apple loves to use nonstandard connectors that may require you to buy special adaptors from apple to connect to nonapple equipment. I currently access my mini through screensharing since I've never shelled out the $20 I'd need to connect the mini to a nonapple monitor

http://eshop.macsales.com/shop/memory/iMac/DDR3_2009
http://discussions.apple.com/thread.jspa?threadID=2180431&tstart=60

[Deja Q]

7. Excellent point. I sold my 24" iMac for Mac Pro due to expandability... BTW: some imac pics:

Firewire is nice, but internal drives are always faster. As is upgrading the video card if/when I need to.

iMacs typically use notebook-grade components. Fast, yes, especially when compared to Vista with a far greater-horsepower CPU, but not as nimble as the Xeon line. (OS X ties to the hardware far more efficiently than Windows EVER will, so one doesn't need to biggest wham-bam hardware just so the OS can crawl faster...)

And I need to verify the newest iMacs, but earlier generations used notebook RAM. Going to 8GB (two 4GB notebook DDR3-1066 modules) would be $700 after shipping - too much; better to sell the iMac and take the difference and go with the Pro (Xeon).

I thankfully got 78% of the iMac w/best buy warranty's value by selling it on amazon.com, but I only recently bought the machine -- otherwise I might have gotten 56% if I went through the other vendor...

I did look up hard drive replacement. Yeah, on an iMac it's virtual hell:

[hatrack]

10. That's another element that crossed my mind - max out at point of purchase . . .

Or upgrade later in a quasi-DIY fashion?

Thanks, too, for the word of warning on connectors for non-OEM monitors. As Deja Q pointed out above, a multi-monitor setup would be copacetic, while cutting down on e-waste, but little things like "How do I plug it in?" might pose problems.

Many thanks for the many responses, BTW!!

:toast:

[struggle4progress]

11. The current mac minis apparently support dual monitors, but the two ports

used for this on the back of the machine seem to be different -- so using non-apple monitors probably means buying two adaptors from apple. But apple changes what they do year to year: the connectors on the back of the 2008 mini aren't the same as those on the back of the 2009 mini, for example

I don't really know about the imac, but here's what apple says (and it sounds similar to the above): "Mini DisplayPort output port with support for DVI, VGA, and dual-link DVI (adapters sold separately). 27-inch models also support input from external DisplayPort sources (adapters sold separately)" -- http://www.apple.com/imac/specs.html

The situation with the mac pro might depend on your graphics card: but I'd guess standard cards support standard connectors. I had no trouble plugging an apple monitor and a non-apple monitor into the card I bought with my pro, and when I upgraded to a gtx it still had standard connectors, so I had no trouble. But IIRC, people using two apple monitors have sometimes complained the mac version of the standard connector is too wide to connect two to some graphics cards; then they have to use some extension cable to connect one

[RebelOne]

15. I had to buy an adapter for my Mac Mini to use

with the Sony monitor. An adapter is included with the Mac Mini, but it does not work with all monitors.

[nadinbrzezinski]

9. What do you need the computer for and CHECK your memory

might be RAM going bad... Seen it... the laptop that my BIL is currently using is older than yours... and it got revived though new RAM.

Yes it sounds like your memory might be going and if you change the SMM cards you might be able to extend the life of that machine.

[Tesha]

12. I'm of the opinion that most people shouldn't even consider a "desktop" computer these days.

Buy a laptop, and if you want to work at a desk, hook up
an LCD display (no problem, right? ;) ) and use a keyboard
and mouse, wireless if you wish, otherwise, USB.

My setup (almost two years old now) is a MacBook/Pro and
at my desk, a 30" LCD, Bluetooth keyboard and mouse, and
nice powered stereo speakers. The beauty of this is that
I have a very powerful, very ergonomic setup at my desk
but can take my entire environment with me when calling
on clients or just relaxing on the couch at night.

Tesha

[Lydia Leftcoast]

13. Yes, my main computer is a MacBook with the option of attaching it

to a set up in my office that has a 19" monitor and the keyboard and mouse from my old iMac.

It's really handy when I'm translating a document with small print. I just put the Japanese text up on the 19" monitor and keep the English translation on the screen of the MacBook.

On the other hand, if I want to relax and watch a Netflix streamed movie in the living room, I just unplug the computer and settle down in the recliner.

[PinkTiger]

16. I don't agree and here's why

I have a Iaptop mac, my third. They are aIways needing serious work done. I have it backed up, but I need a computer because I'm a student and a teacher and I can't do without it.
I reaIIy need a Iaptop AND and desk top.

I'm considering the 27 inch or a refurbished 24 inch imac, and then getting the eI key fixed on my stupid Iaptop so I can stop using the capitaI i to creat the Ietter.

[RebelOne]

14. I have a Mac Mini and love it.

I especially love the compactness of it. Just a little box that takes up no room at all.