How bad is it?

[RaRa]

I just spoke on the phone with a kindergarten teacher in our school district. I wanted to know if this is an academic or real play kindergarten. It's the former (I guess all are now). She got my drift and tried to downplay it by saying they incorporate play blah blah. But when I heard that they learn math there, I really cringed. It's a ways off for us; my son will be 4 in August, and wouldn't start for a couple of years. But, now I'm wondering if I want him to go at all.

I should add I'm reading "Einstein Never Used Flash Cards" so, I'm really negative on schools right now!

What are your thoughts, those of you with school kids?

[SoCalDem]

1. YOU are your child's best teacher.

Remember this.. he will be in school for probably the next SEVENTEEN years.. Let him savor the last remnants of the pre-school time.

My smarty-pants son (summa cum laude)did NOT attend pre school, and his kindergarten teacher told me that she could always recognize which ones had NOT gone to pre-school.. They were the ones who were excited and eager to learn..and were actually better students..

[wildeyed]

3. My daughter goes to preschool.

But it is purely experiential learning and socialization, no academics. She loves it.

I don't understand why parents want their 4 year old to be able to recite the state capitals. A four year old can't even understand what a state capitol is, so why should they know the names?

My daughter will go to Kindergarten in two years. I am very nervous about it. I think they ask too much from young kids, killing their real joy for learning, and standardized tests are waaaaay too important. I am not known for my acceptance of the status quo, especially if I think it goes against the best interest of my children, so the potential conflict is high.

Oh well, we will jump off that bridge when we come to it. There is always home schooling of things go really bad.

[SoCalDem]

5. Not being sexist here, but I have been told by teachers

that girls do better in pre-school than boys do. And that starting boys later in kindergarten is actually a good thing. Mine were All hit with end of year birthdays, and had to start as 5 yr olds who turned 6 a few months after school started. Seeing those rambunctious 4 yr olds that they were, I could understand the teacher's concerns:evilgrin:.. By the time they went, they were eager and really enjoyed school..

Of course that was many years ago, so who knows? These days they may have SATs for kindergartners:P

[wildeyed]

7. My daughter seemed more mature

and had a longer attention span than my son at the same age. Of course she has a longer attention span than most 20 year olds that I know, so no surprise there.

My son is much more physically active and far more advanced in that area than my daughter was at the same age.

But against the stereotypes, my son is much more emotional and affectionate than my daughter and my daughter is extremely interested in building toys. I guess everyone is an individual and it all evens out in the end. :shrug:

I started my daughter in the 3's class at 2-1/2, but I am starting my son in the 2's at the same age. He is just not ready to be with the older kids.

[TrogL]

2. I almost flunked kindergarten

It's supposed to be a year to learn the socialization skills used in the classroom - not mathematics.

[abelenkpe]

4. Can't speak for public schools

but I used to teach at a Montessori school and feel that it's a great environment for kids. My son is already attending one at 9 months because I have to work. I think he is doing very well. He is very happy and we get plenty of time to play. No one ever forces information on a child in a Montessori situation. Each child learns at their own pace and choses their own activities each day. Now, that said, at the school I taught at there were seven year olds that were doing algebra. Five year olds that were reading well and knew their times tables. And all the kids were so well behaved and interacted with one another well. The cool thing about Montessori is that kids learn to enjoy learning. (Schools go up to 6th grade.) I guess I'm pretty sold on the technique. Even if you decide to do homeschooling there is a lot of benefit in reading Marie Montessori's work and incorporating some of her ideas into your plans. Just an idea. Ultimately you need to do what is right for your situation and I'm sure you will make the right decision for your son.

I do remember my kindergarten and first grade teachers always letting me paint when I didn't want to interact with the group. Which was nice. At least they recognized that all I wanted to do was art. So it's not so bad. I think it's better to go to school than be home schooled because there is a lot that kids learn outside of academics, like social skills and how to get along in a group. But everyone is different. Children can gain these skills through other group activities like sports or music. Or being part of a large family. Everyone is different.

edited fer spelling. :)

[wildeyed]

6. There are several Montessori magnets in my city.

Very popular choice with families from our preschool. Problem is, they are popular with everyone and hence difficult to get into. Also, they start with pre-K which means I needed to enroll my daughter for the upcoming year. It is almost impossible to get in at the 1st grade level. But I was not ready and I don't think she was either.

Our neighborhood school is a magnet, too. Something called International Baccalaureate. Sound very serious for a Kindergartner. I don't actually know much about the curriculum. I will need to do some research.

[abelenkpe]

10. We were actually

very surprised that our son got in as fast as he did. We were just lucky I think. When we signed up the wait on the list was about one and a half years. (Versus the wait at my hubby's company daycare which was three years. Yikes!) So we arranged to go somewhere else, but called the montessori school when he was seven months old and were told there was an opening and he could start.

The school I taught at, long ago and on the other side of the country, did accept a few kids that were older, 5 and 6 year olds. They adapted very well so sometimes it doesn't hurt to ask and see if the school is willing to accept older kids. However your neighborhood school sounds very interesting. I hope all goes well for your daughter. I'm sure she will be very happy at whatever school you find best.

[trotsky]

14. We have been very disappointed with Montessori schools.

I think it's because there is really no enforcing agency - just about any school can call itself "Montessori" no matter how true they are to Maria Montessori's methods.

The impression I had of Montessori before we tried our first was that it was open, relaxed, kids choose the activity they wanted, etc.

Unbelievably, we went through two Montessori schools with our son (who is probably somewhere on the ADD/Asperger scale), both of which were EXTREMELY rigid in stucturing the day. Such as, "This is the time to pour beans from one container to another. OK, that's done, now is the time for everyone to sit in a circle and listen to a story." Etc., etc.

Our son, who has always had his own agenda, was miserable and constantly causing trouble. In fact, both Montessori schools basically kicked him out. Finally, this past year he started Kindergarten and his public school teacher in a more academically-focused Kindergarten was possibly the most flexible and caring person we've encountered during his educational experience to date. She learned when to recognize that he needed a break, she engaged him to help others when he finished his work, she helped set up a rewards system, so many things. I hope his first grade teacher is even half as good.

[oregonjen]

15. I was an assistant for a Montessori school

Only for one year and boy, that was challenging. We had some difficult children and I had a hard time understanding what was okay to do and not okay to do. The hardest part for me was stopping the children from interrupting one another as they were working. I was taught by the guide that when a child was working, no one was to interrupt them, especially their classmates. However, what happens when a child creates something and wants to share? A child's desire to share their work is natural and I had to shut off their excitement and tell them to walk away from others. I hated that. The excitement of saying, "Joey, look what I did!" changed to "Why can't I show Joey this?" That was painful to see. I think for some kids, Montessori is great, but for the average child, public pre-school and elementary school is just great. JMHO.

[fortyfeetunder]

8. NCLB has spoiled it all

My kid was in K last year, in a full day class. And unfortunately, the teaching to the test has already begun that early. Definitely an academic bent.

The real testing doesn't happen until 3rd grade and I am worried when he gets there, this will kill his love for learning.

Sigh.

[OnionPatch]

9. My daughter

Will be starting kindergarten this fall. Yes, they have academics. The preschool she's in now has academics and I always thought it was a bit much. Come on....HOMEWORK for a four-year-old? Granted it's only coloring and such but geez. This ticked me off but I didn't want to move her once she was used to the school and other kids.

Montessori...I would have loved to send my daughter there but the tuition was about three times more than any other preschool around. Three times more than we could afford.

[abelenkpe]

11. Out of Control

Pre-school shouldn't cost so much. The owner of the school I taught at also had a Montessori school closer in the city that was quite affordable. Her school in the burbs was more expensive. When we were looking for places for Connor to go my hubby's company daycare was 100 dollars more a month than the Montessori school he is currently attending. We looked at many different daycare and pre-school facilities here and they were all around the same price. A nanny was out of the question, far too expensive.

Coloring? For homework? Gee I hope that doesn't make art seem like a chore to your little girl. Art should always be fun. Even when it is work. :)

[Telly Savalas]

16. Damn straight it shouldn't cost so much.

Quebec has a child care program which charges $5 a day.

There are a lot of other great child care initiatives in other jurisdictions. Bernie Sander's website has a great collection of articles on these:

http://www.bernie.house.gov/childcare/reports.asp

[FourStarDemocrat]

12. Learning math in kindergarten is not so bad...

I've taught kindergarten a number of times and the kindergarten-style math is usually fun and interesting for the kids. It usually involves learning a little about the calender, learning about patterns and creating your own, counting with numbers, objects, pictures etc. Most kids can handle kindergarten mathematics, and kindergarten academics in general and actually enjoy them. And there's still plenty of time left during the kindergarten day for play, making crafts, baking cookies, singing songs, etc.

[bleedingheart]

13. My children have always been hungry for knowledge.

they both loved kindergarten and in fact were very happy to bring home "homework" which consisted of circling the picture that didn't belong with the group or color by number stuff...all very simple. Math was introduced at the very end and it was all very simplistic stuff...and pictorial oriented to see if the child can count. So envision two oranges + three oranges (pictures with each) and they ask the child to draw how many would be in the basket if you add them all together...

If anything my husband and I have introduced very advanced things to our children because they have asked for information. In fact I had a very involved conversation with my son about ancient Egypt and the whole Cleopatra-Caesar-Marc Antony love affair issue. He understood a suprising amount and of course probably ignored some of it.

I just attended Kindergarten graduation last week and it was wonderful!!!!!!! My little gal was so proud and she came home with her math workbook and told me that she wants to play school at home..
and no I am not joking...

[SmokingJacket]

17. They're not all like that.

My kids go to a public school that isn't anything like that -- lots and lots of play and free time and recess.

Go visit and see how it feels before you send your kid there.

[Ilsa]

18. Yep, NCLB has ruined Kinder.

The kids have to be tested. So the teach has to take each one aside so they aren't doing it in front of the other kids. And so the kids have no supervision while this is going on because there isn't enough money to hire aides.

[nonconformist]

19. We held our youngest son back a year

He went to an extra year of preschool (K-4) and started Kindergarten at 6. His birthday is in March, so he turned 7 before the school year was over. He'll start 1st grade this year.

I honestly couldn't be happier with our decision. He's bigger than most of the other kids and more socially mature, but that's not necessarily a bad thing. He'll turn 19 a couple of months before he graduates from high school... but again, that's not necessarily a bad thing.

He went to an absolutely wonderful preschool. It was conversations with his teachers there that convinced me that holding him back was the right thing to do. They told me that years ago, he would have been absolutely fine. Even now, the pointed out, he would have probably managed. But he would have struggled a bit with the structure and expectations of today's Kindergarten. He just wasn't READY yet, and I didn't feel it was a good idea to push him into being ready and subject him to that type of pressure. I didn't want him to be limited to mediocrity, end up resenting school or get "lost in the shuffle". Two of his teachers themselves even held back one of their children for an extra year of preschool post-NCLB - one for social concerns, one for academic ones. Academic ones were our concerns too, since socially he's quite advanced. He's just one of those "you can't rush me, I'll do it in my own time" kind of kids... always has been. Pushing him before he's ready just leads to failure. As it turns out, he flourished in Kindergarten.

Picture it this way - Kindergarten today is comparable to 1st/2nd grade when we were kids. Some of them simply aren't ready for that full day structure and those academic expectations at 5. My Kindergartener had MATH HOMEWORK for cripes sake.

Holding them back a year is a very personal, individual decision. Just remember that it IS an option if you feel your child isn't ready.

[SoCalDem]

20. Old school kindergartens were about "socialization" and

getting used to structure. Those are hardly lacking these days , with 2 yr olds in "school" from 6 am to 6 pm while Mommy works..

My K memories are vague, at my age, but I remember it being about having a teacher read to us, milk & graham crackers, a nap, and coooring..and then going home .

Poor little stressed out babies these days.. math homework:wtf:

[SW FL Dem]

21. My son was born in March, my nephew in July 1991

My son started kindergarten at 5 and has struggled in school. He was emotionally ready, but not academically ready. My son is a great kid, very sociable and well behaved but an average student. My nephew was academically ready for kindergarten, but his teachers said he wasn't emotionally ready so his parents held him back. He is a straight A student who is still behind emotionally. He is much older than most kids in his class but he still is shy and awkward. I think the bottom line is that it is a personal decision for each kid. If I held my kid back, he may have done better academically. If my brother didn't hold his kid back, he may not feel so awkward being the oldest in the class. I wish you the best, there is no easy answer.