Wow, Organized Religion is losing again (Pluto).... A famous Libra person wrote this in July

[Ricochet21]

Here is an amazing story of how the church is losing to true Spirit (Thank God):

Amazing exodus from the Catholic Religion (source Wikipedia and this person's Facebook page)

"For those who care, and I understand if you don’t: Today I quit being a Christian. I’m out. I remain committed to Christ as always but not to being “Christian” or to being part of Christianity. It’s simply impossible for me to “belong” to this quarrelsome, hostile, disputatious, and deservedly infamous group. For ten years, I’ve tried.
I’ve failed. I’m an outsider. My conscience will allow nothing else."

“In the name of Christ, I refuse to be anti-gay. I refuse to be anti-feminist. I refuse to be anti-artificial birth control. I refuse to be anti-Democrat. I refuse to be anti-secular humanism. I refuse to be anti-science. I refuse to be anti-life. In the name of Christ, I quit Christianity and being Christian. Amen.”

"My faith in Christ is central to my life. My conversion from a pessimistic atheist lost in a world I didn't understand, to an optimistic believer in a universe created and sustained by a loving God is crucial to me. But following Christ does not mean following His followers. Christ is infinitely more important than Christianity and always will be, no matter what Christianity is, has been, or might become."

My commitment to Christ remains at the heart and center of my life. Transformation in Him is radical and ongoing. That I feel now that I am called to be an outsider for Him, to step away from the words, "Christian" and "Christianity" is something that my conscience demands of me. I feel that my faith in Him demands this of me. I know of no other way to express how I must remove myself from those things which seek to separate me from Him.

These are the quotes of one Howard Allen O'Brien...

...otherwise known as the author Anne Rice

edit: spelling

[Fire Walk With Me]

1. Anne Rice?

(eyes bug in disbelief...I mean, I knew that she had found the other side of the coin, so to speak...)

Yes, Authenticity is increasing :rofl: Did you hear Obama's last comment in the press conference this morning, regarding all people being equal, of love and tolerance, of understanding and inclusion...it was truly beautiful, exactly what I expect from a higher-dimensional being, and it is a refreshing blast of cool air into a country acting much like GD! Go Obama, you are beautiful, and I do not say things like that very often at all!

[Ricochet21]

2. Imagine, the gaul

talking like Jesus Christ about equality and loving your neighbor!

:hi:

[Manifestor_of_Light]

9. Enough gaul to be divided in to three parts.

Old joke from the first line of The Memoirs of Marcus Aurelius:
Omnia Gallia divisa est in tres partes.

Translated: All Gaul is divided into three parts. Gaul is France.

And a pun on "gall". A different word.

Yes I took Latin in high school. Two years. :D

[rosesaylavee]

14. Ha.

Sister Helen would be proud I remembered that. Thanks for the laugh. :P

[Fire Walk With Me]

13. Your pun is a bad as my mixed metaphor

;)

[southerncrone]

3. Glad to see someone as celebrated as Anne Rice is speaking out.

Agree with Anne Rice on every reason she gave for leaving.

Guess I was ahead of the curve....I left the Catholic Church at the age of 14 in 1969. After being "indoctrinated" for 5 yrs in Catholic school, I pleaded to go to "regular" school. Being exposed to "other" beliefs for 3 yrs was a good thing for me.....it allowed me to see outside the stained glass windows.
I consider it a paradox....my Catholic school education taught me how to think :think:, which ended up causing me to leave the Church. I will always be thankful for that education....the Catholic Church DOES know how to educate, but it's iced w/the BS of "over-obedience", "supreme guilt", & "men-are-better" teachings (the Virgin Mary adoration is a cover).

I long for the day when everyone sees that we all have our own individual religions & beliefs, & that organized religion is a scam. We seem to be inching closer & closer. O8)

[MorningGlow]

4. Same here, SC

I started Catholic school in 8th grade, and by my sophomore year I had given up the religion entirely. My uber-Catholic aunt always laments, "You went to Catholic school! What happened to your faith?!" and I always answer "I went to Catholic school." :evilgrin:

[Ricochet21]

5. Great response

[Gin]

6. religion is good if it helps and if you need it....I outgrew being

a catholic....once you start questioning the precepts..you have outgrown the religion (IMO)

[southerncrone]

7. Very true.

Looks like we've got 3 grown-ups here.B-)

[JanusAscending]

8. Count me among you!

I WAS the ultimate "fundie" Attended Assembly of God Church and raised my kids in that Church. When I moved back to Ct. I couldn't find a Church home that I could feel comfortable in, so I stopped going. This past Spring I felt the need to go to Church again, so I gave the nearest AG Church to me a shot! LARGE congregation, and very integrated group of people (to the eye) Loved the music but as soon as the Preacher opened his mouth and started preaching fear and hate, like we are hearing so prevalent in the news right now, I made a beeline for the exit, and never looked back. I am appalled by what so called Christians are doing "in Jesus name". I will continue to carry Christ and His LOVE in my heart, and worship in my closet as He instructed us to do. I will see Him in the faces of every person I encounter, and shine my light(his light) until my candle flickers out! This is why I love you guys so much, and some of my still "fundie" kids worry about my sanity!!

[Delphinus]

11. Unfortunately,

I had to quit school in my Junior year because my Mom would not allow me to go to a non-Catholic school. It really was the only way out for me. It's hard to be labeled a heretic at the tender age of 15. But there was so much that didn't sound right, feel right, make sense, etc., that I could not stay in the lie.

[I Have A Dream]

21. Oh, my... I'm so sorry, Delphinus.

However, kudos to you for being true to yourself.

:loveya:

[rosesaylavee]

15. Me too!

Great education - even attend Catholic college. And am so grateful they taught me to think critically. I even at one time thought I had 'a calling'. (yikes!) Too many viewings of Song of Bernadette I guess.

[Manifestor_of_Light]

10. I quit Christianity a long time ago.

I was raised Presbyterian. I graduated from a Presbyterian college. I took religion courses taught by well educated men who had gone to Princeton and Harvard. Their understanding of the Bible was through knowing ancient languages (Amharic, Aramaic, Linear B, Greek, Latin, Hebrew) and history that your average bible thumpin' preacher is not smart enough to understand.

I am horrified by fundies. I hate the assumption, at least where I live, that everyone is Christian; that everyone is a certain flavor of Christian and if you don't go to church, something is seriously wrong with you; that you must be convinced of the error of your ways or at least told how you're going to hell if you don't change whatever you doing. And then they get mad at you for correcting their lack of information.

I am sick of hearing about Jesus as the only thing to believe in. It didn't work for me, and god never talked to me, and I never had what I would call a life changing experience that would make me believe my prayers were effective. Nothing.

I think many Christians are clinically depressed because of the anti-life teachings that Christianity starts from -- original sin and substitutionary atonement. These people are souls that are crushed at an early age by adults who think they HAVE to crush a child's spirit. That's evil. I had to leave Christianity because the doctrines made me want to crawl in a hole and die. Christianity is indeed anti-life because of the starting premise which posits a false problem and offers thus an unnecessary solution. I say unnecessary because I don't know what "saved" means and I'm not sure anybody else does either. Everybody has to find their own path.

If Christianity makes somebody act like a better person, that's fine, but I am sick of hearing about it. This goes for the Abrahamic religions. They are all inconsistent, superstitious and bloodthirsty.

I have some respect for Judaism as I have gone to synagogues and known some Jews. I respect them because they revere education and achievement, and for them it's ok to shake your fist at god and get mad.

As for me, I've been studying Hinduism and Mahayana Buddhism for many years. I find in reading the Buddha's words that there is none of that superstitious Bronze Age cultural overlay that makes the Abrahamic religions so ridiculous. There is no angry God playing mass murderer. It's all about what regular people do in life and how they deal with the problems of life whether it was when the Buddha lived, 600 years BCE, or now.

I've corrected several ignorant Christians that know nothing other than what their preacher tells them, and don't want to know anything. They think Buddha is worshiped as a god. I told several of them, wasting my breath, that you don't have to believe in God to be a Buddhist, and that Buddha is revered as an enlightened man, NOT a God. The response I got: "Ohhhh". That was after this idiot told me I wouldn't go to heaven worshiping Buddha and meditating.

I have no idea if Buddhism is the right path for me, but the Eight Fold Path is sensible. I'm a secular humanist Unitarian Universalist.

[I Have A Dream]

22. "I had to leave Christianity because the doctrines made me want to crawl in a hole and die."

I can so relate to this sentiment. The brainwashing is very, very effective, and most people's connection with their higher self is intentionally severed by organized religion. I feel so lucky to have found the courage to take that first step away from it. From that point on, I ran as fast as my legs could carry me.

On edit: In some ways, I still consider myself to be a "Christian", but it is not even close to what most people would call Christianity. I certainly don't believe that anyone died for my "sins". I really just like using Jesus as an example of how to live a good, responsible life; after all, he was the ultimate liberal! However, there's so much more to my spiritual beliefs than that. I do believe that it's possible that Jesus was an ascended being -- but no different than any other ascended being. I also believe that it's possible that he never even existed. It doesn't really matter to me. What really stood out for me was that every atom of my body rebelled against the Paulian teachings from the first moment that I heard them as a small child. I knew immediately that they were very wrong for humanity. They actually felt "evil" to me.

[Ricochet21]

12. I watched it destroy my mother, ended up as cancer

ate her insides out. Catholic guilt. Very sad. Original sin.

[southerncrone]

16. Sorry to hear that Rick.

:cry:
Controlling others has to be one of the greatest sins perpetrated on this planet.
No one can live up to those ridiculous expectations.
I want no part of that karma.

[Ricochet21]

17. I'm not joking either

she had no chance after years of brainwash
I guess that's why I'm so vocal about this n that

:hi:

[southerncrone]

18. Brainwashing is the correct term.

I know you aren't joking....I've seen it happen many times. People lead to believe they are not "good enough" & that just being human is wrong. How can anyone live up to those expectations? If you are convinced "they" are right, then you are murdered by your own faith & belief system. So sad & despicable.

Maybe why WE are doing what WE do.:hug:

[Ricochet21]

19. You got that right

Keep doing it

[japple]

20. My mother too, only it was Baptist guilt. They focus so much on sin

and sinners, and the need to be "washed in the blood of the lamb." I left the Baptist faith and churches behind in 1968 when our (large, downtown) southern Baptist church voted not to allow "negroes" to become members. The only time I go to church now is for weddings or funerals. I haven't missed a thing.

[JanusAscending]

23. There ya go!

"nuff said!

[Manifestor_of_Light]

24. They are losing more and more people.

Christianity is not sufficient for the 21st century.
It can't deal with changing times. The people of the Bronze Age knew nothing of science or technology. They were not intellectually curious.

They don't have good answers, only simple and unsatisfying ones, so they will continue to lose members.

I don't know if Jesus existed either. There is nothing new and original in Christianity. It is a syncretic religion from older ones. Mithra, Apollo, Osiris and Tammuz and Jesus all have the same characteristics of a messiah.

I've read "Jesus: The Evidence" and "The Lost Years of Jesus Revealed". They are quite interesting.

Start reading books about the Gnostic Gospels and such and the standard mythology is shot down quickly. Christianity was adopted by Constantine as a political unifier, and he told the Council of Nicaea what the doctrines would be. It was all political.

And yet, many xtians don't know the Bible was translated through four or five languages, sliced, diced, edited, mistranslated and shuffled around for political reasons. They don't want to know, either. One asshole told me my "problem" was that I took religion courses from those educated professors. Facts are bad. :banghead:

I got in his face and said "NO. KNOWLEDGE AND FACTS ARE ALWAYS GOOD."

This idiot could not have passed those course I made Bs in.

[Ricochet21]

25. We are coming out of another Dark Ages

and many brainwashed people are trying to drag us back to the old.
It's their perception. It's how they see the world. Let's pray for their fast awakening. The whole world depends on it.

[southerncrone]

26. Yikes!! BIG job for us!

[Ricochet21]

27. "They" are all changing faster than we think

It's all collective, right? The power of consensus. Blogs are leading the way. :hi:

churches are closing
they need to be community centers
workshiping "God"
with NO LEADERS
that'll work

[OneGrassRoot]

28. If only.....

If only I could tap into those with resources, just enough to start a community fund type of idea in an organized way (to avoid fragmentation and depletion of energy/effort) around the country, so that community members -- regular people like us -- could invest in purchasing some of these empty buildings and create what they/we need: community centers, low-income housing.

The community garden/farmer's market ideas are moving along nicely, even in urban areas. :thumbsup:

I met with people who work for the City of Raleigh about using their community centers for a teen project I'm working on.

Lord have mercy....the red tape is astronomical.

I'm contacting my last resort about this project in a few minutes, but I think this last resort is really for the best now: Unitarian Universalist.

They'll GET what I'm trying to do. Since it involves public school kids I wanted to keep religion out of it altogether for obvious reasons, but UU is as non-religious as I can get, I do believe. ;)

I realize what follows is a generalization, but I'm seeing it firsthand and noticing others saying the same thing.

Again, it's a generalization, but so many of those who are in positions of service are so burnt out that they end up (maybe even subconsciously?) resenting those they serve. Since they can't take out their frustration on those who employ them, the people they engage with the most are the ones who bear the brunt of their frustration and exhaustion, perhaps even despair.

Teachers, healthcare professionals, social workers.

I'm not judging them. Bless them, theirs is not an easy job at all.

Yet the people I met with who are in charge of teen programs had a blatant negative attitude toward teens.

That's just one of many examples I'm personally witnessing of late. :(

We regular people need to truly come together to create our communities somehow...work outside the system...."starve the beast."

All the systems need to be rebuilt, on a foundation of integrity, love and respect.

*sighs*

:hug: to you, Dear Rick! :hi:

[Ricochet21]

29. Did you take that walk that you promised me you'd take?

Pant pant pant, just like me... slow down girl... save the world... pant pant pant

:rofl:

[OneGrassRoot]

30. Why is everyone saying that?

:shrug:

Seriously...:rofl:

I'm breathing...I'm doing...I'm allowing...I'm fine.

I just like to talk with others about all these ideas?

I'll start shutting up more. I get it...no worries. I'm wearing people out/down.

Yes, Sir. I did walk. And I'm even doing foot soaks at night!!! ;)

Not trying to save the world. Just trying to do something.

It feels like the time is now, in whatever parallel universe I happen to inhabit at present...lol.

:grouphug:

[I Have A Dream]

31. Oh, OGR, my guess is that everyone is absolutely amazed...

that anyone is able to keep up the pace that you do and stay sane and healthy. I watch what you do with my mouth hanging open wondering what kind of fuel you have inside because I want some of it too! :D

We all love you so much that we just want you to also take care of you as well as you take care of everyone else. You are such an amazing gift to the world!

That's the way I feel, and I bet many others do. We mere mortals (;)) are in awe that you can do what you do.

(I don't mean to speak for Rick, but you said that others are saying it also, and I thought that I might be able to give you my perspective.)

:loveya:

[OneGrassRoot]

32. Thank you for that, IHAD....

I appreciate that. :loveya:

I can't bear the thought of being obnoxious without meaning to or being aware of it, and I was afraid that's what I had done with my ramblings. (I mean, I can be obnoxious intentionally but I NEVER want to be that way here.) ;)

I'm taking steps to find help where I can, to remove some of the tasks. I know I'm doing a lot, but I thrive on doing so long as there's forward movement, and there is, thank goodness. Fortunately, I'm old enough to be mindful of balance as well; I fully recognize that if I crumble, I can't help anyone then.

Thank you for caring. That means the world. And thanks for enabling me to see it another way, that it's not because I'm being obnoxious but that you guys are simply concerned about my well-being. ;)

Love you muchly...love you all...

:grouphug:

[I Have A Dream]

33. Obnoxious?

Not even close.

:hug:

[Ricochet21]

34. That's what happens when your Neptune is too strong

Normal tones of voice coming thru us feels like we're on a loudspeaker.
It's not true. You couldn't be obnoxious if you were possessed.

Keep on bring it girl.... all I'm asking for is that you take a breath now and then.

Then again, you have all this powerful Sagittarian stuff toooooooo..... :hug:

[OneGrassRoot]

35. Yes, Sir, I am...I promise

(Interesting about Neptune....hmmmmm)

This is my new favorite emoticon.

It's all good.




:hug:

[Ricochet21]

36. You ARE 80% Neptune/Pisces

and 20% Virgo

[eilen]

37. Those people are overwhelmed, they need help

I see it at work and can hardly blame the healthcare workers I engage with. One RN had charge of 14 patients overnight---14! On a very acute floor. That is insane. That is like a nursing home assignment, not a cardiac surgery floor assignment.

TPTB are starting to panic, worried they will lose some of their higher profile designations d/t some paperwork not getting done by the overworked overwhelmed HC workers. Here's a news flash-- we need less chiefs and more indians.

Personally, I think the planets/universe are aligning to create more indians.

Can you do a group that is more informal, a little underground? The red tape always seems to have something to do with insurance or grants or government/school involvement.

Have you ever looked at an organization called Teen Institute? My son participated in one of their retreats and really loved it.

[OneGrassRoot]

38. I hear you...

about people in those positions being overwhelmed. Absolutely, I can see that, and I recall you sharing stories about it, like the one RN in charge of 14 patients on an acute floor. Unbelievable!!!

We've seen this for a long time (because of too many chiefs and not enough indians) but it's growing.

Yeah, this program is informal; just trying to find a venue and the City of Raleigh heard and wanted to be involved, but the red tape is too much and takes away from the original relaxed intent of the program (it's an open mic night type of set up for teens in performing arts programs in the county public school system).

Hopefully I'll hear back from UU today; as of yesterday, they charged $100/hour, with a two-hour minimum, for their facility. I'm hoping the gathering can be a fundraiser for whatever projects the congregation may be focused on in the community and thus they'll cut me a break on rental fee.

Take care...I don't envy your job at all and have the utmost admiration for the path you've chosen.

:hug: :hug: :hug:

[eilen]

39. Have you considered approaching the Masons?

They have nice halls and are very community oriented.