Need help with my kid ...is it ADD or PTSD or WTF? (long)

[FirstLight]

My youngest is a real handful. I love his enthusiasm and personality, most of the time. I jokingly say he should be a lawyer when he grows up because he can argue you to the point of exhaustion and then make you give up just to shut him up...

When I was pregnant with him was the worst part of my abuse from the ex. I wonder if that screwed up his chemistry somehow, because he seems to thrive on conflict...
This morning we had an outburst that lasted for OVER and hour, with peaks and valleys, everytime you thought it was over, somebody or something would set him off again. I try to be as patient and yet firm as i can. he needs to just stop telling me how to parent and just do what he is told sometimes, because every minute he is telling you how YOU made him upset, instead if just dealing with his overwhelmedness... and then i lose my cool and i know it gets worse from there...
we have had countless talks afterwards and he knows he goes over the edge with his feelings, he just cant control it and yet he also ends up blaming everyone in his path and making it everyone's problem. I have been dealing with this personality since he was an infant, and i am not exaggerating.

When he was born, it was not colic that he had, he would cry incessantly...usually when joe walked thru the door and he heard his voice, and then i'd get tense because joe would tell em to shut him up, and that would feed on itself. I wanted to throw him out the window a few times, and then i'd feel horrible for being so on edge, so that didn't help. As a toddler, he would 'fixate' on something he wanted and just repeat it over & over in a tantrum, and totally 'check out' and you could NOT console him or stop him. When he goes into that mode, he is 'not there'...as he got older, it became sentences...but the repetition would continue. and now it is the way he argues about the why and how he is upset, over and over, and there is no rationalizing with him in that state.
I have asked for autism-spectrum testing. I have tried to get in to the county mental health counselors, but i guess they got laid off and such...and there is also this fear in me that he's going to tell them, and "mommy put her hand over my mouth and hurt me" and then i'll get called by CPS. Not only that, but when he is in that state, and i try to hold him by the shoulders or hold his legs to get him to look at me, he ends up saying things like, and "then you threw me into the wall."..when nothing of the sort happened. So i am terrified he will tell the counselor that and it will lead to real awfulness with the state.
i had him on add meds for a year, byut he just got so skinny, and i was worried about him being on speed, basically...so i ended it last summer. i figured since he was older we could have more talks and work on it together. but this school year is not helping, he is in the hardest grade for little ones, 3rd...when they transition to way more responsibility. He often gets overwhelmed and can;t finish something, and will lose recesses, that adds more stress for him and it just snowballs from there...

I called my pediatrician again...mostly out of desperation. Maybe there's some other method we haven;t explored, or a food allergy, or hypoglycemia...who the fuck knows. Amazingly, the receptionist/assistant that i know well answered the phone and i started to cry...
She has done the same meditation classes as I have and also had a son with some issues. She had me hold and then gave me a good talking to. Comforting me, grounding me, and reminding me it isn;t bad to want to help our kids with coping. She has a sister-in-law that sells essential oils and is going to hook me up. She has been using Vetiver oil on her son's feet and got him off ALL meds (he even had one med that gave him a tic)...so there is hope i hope. (I just sent her a message on FB)

Just had ti get this all out of me this morning, and I'll be happy when this thread dies and falls to the bottom of the page. i have to get things handled, in the meantime I am trying not to yell and make myself bleed since I am still healing from my surgery. I am keeping him home today to just work on his overdue HW (stuff he was supposed to have done last week at my mom's, and she didn't check to make sure and he pulls it out this morning, ya, that was part of the meltdown too...)
We calmed down enough to 'talk' and i told him i really don;t want to hear him anymore right now. he is in his room, with his pages, no electronics, but he can work on the pages and play with legoes intermittedly today...i will bring him food and such, and he will spend the day being "calm"...and not bugging me, yea, i said it.

thanks for letting me vent, thanks for any healing or grounding you can send. Thanks for being my spirit family and loving me anyway. :/

[elleng]

1. Sorry for these problems, FL.

:hi:
A suggestion: Pass this on to Tobin, in Lounge + Mental Health forum? Would share w my daughter, who suffers from somethings, but our electronic connectedness is shaky.

:grouphug:

[FirstLight]

2. I am a little nervous

about posting such personal stuff anywhere but here...you have my permission to PM that person and have them come here.. :hug: thanks

[elleng]

3. Thanks; will do.

[BlueIris]

4. A little random, but: I love Vetiver oil.

Public service annoucement: while I think it's valid to want to try to help your kids be as healthy as they can be, as well as not have them on any meds they genuinely don't need, I hope you will not make any changes not recommended by a healthcare professional. I sincerely doubt Vetiver oil can substitute for a pediatric neurologist, a psychiatrist, a cognitive therapist or the right combination of appropriately prescribed medications. Not all problems are energetically caused, and many serious physical and psychological conditions are going to respond to an exclusively naturopathic approach.

[Tumbulu]

5. I agree with you

essential oils may be very helpful- use them by all means- but please seek professional help. I do think that people who help children are used to these sorts of situations, especially if you and your children are victims of abuse. Please do not let the fears imbedded in your lives from the abuse in the past continue to enslave you.

Seek help- cognitive behavioral therapy - counseling, anything.

Please seek outside help so that you can get a hand up and out of the pit you were buried in by the violence of the past.

[Tobin S.]

7. I'm with you guys, BlueIris and Tumbulu

I think the OP's son is in need of professional help. If you can't afford to get the treatment privately then maybe there is a waiting list with the county you can get on and hopefully it won't be too long. Also, if your son requires medication, most psychiatrists will give you free samples of the appropriate drugs if you are in need. I've gotten them from my psychiatrist before when I was without health insurance. It was enough for 28 days. The problem with your son might be correctable without meds through talk therapy, but if medication is suggested I wouldn't rule it out.

But get help as soon as you can, FirstLight. You know something is wrong now and that your son could be a better kid. I went without treatment for 10 years after I became ill at 20 years old because I did not know I was sick. That was like 10 years in hell. Think of what might happen as your son grows if you don't get help. I was convicted of 2 misdemeanors and was hospitalized 3 times for being suicidal while I was suffering from my symptoms and I'm a naturally laid back kind of guy. I have bipolar 1, btw.

I'd be willing to bet that your son can have a normal life and you can have a positive relationship with him, but it will probably take some work and some time. Don't delay in getting started.

[LiberalEsto]

6. Lots of good advice here

I'd also recommend that you read "Your Eight-Year-Old" by Louise Bates Ames. I read her entire series when my kids were small, and they were very helpful. This book could give you insight into what is normal for this age.

If only Ames and her colleagues would write books like "Your 28-Year-Old" and "Your 25-Year-Old." Sigh.

Good luck! :hug:

[FirstLight]

8. yes, and yes...

all of the above.
I did get an appt with the pediatrician for dec 5th, and will be talking to him about testing and other referrals.
if he wants to talk meds, i really need to look at different ones than what he was on, maybe there's something more we aren;t looking at.

and again i will be pushing for a referral for a therapist...
we go through these ups and downs and much up the time things are fine, it's just the hard times that suck as always. I have dealt with depression and my own stuff all my life and wasnt until i had good therapy and meds till i was okay,(and i continue with both) so i know how hard it is to be in that place...that's another reason i hurt so bad when he's freaking out too...

so ya, diet, meds, therapy all the things ii know we need to have in place, it's just hard to get those things in place. I have been asking for help from the school since he was in kindergarten...and every year it seem to get dropped somehow...and then again i have so many other issues i am constantly chasing down, things feel like they fall through the cracks ALL the time....it doesn't help when services are hard to scrounge up or you have to be calling every week to get someone to listen...

[FirstLight]

9. had another meltdown this morning

I know part of it is because the last 2 weeks since my surgery have been in upheaval, school routine and home routine disrupted. And staying with my mother didn't help, my parents are not equipped to handle stuff, they are just too old school.

so now he is arguing with me trying to give him the herbs, and it has to become this half hour long debate that he is upset because he thinks i am telling him there's something wrong with him...when i try to explain that we all have different issues, i take blood pressure meds, laney has had to take stuff for her gland disorder, it's just that he doesn't make enough of something in his brain. and the herbs are better, why can;t he just trust me? bu noooo...the little taurus just *won't* let it go and keeps going on & on & on about it - from every angle possible - till I am just exhausted and tell him to shutup and get in the car cuz we are going to school... gah!


no wonder i take blood pressure meds, lol...that's not funny! :(

[eilen]

10. Well, he needs some help stabilizing his moods

and learning some boundaries and perhaps something to help his anxiety.

I feel for you. My brother has a very difficult child who acts out when he does not get his way or when he wants to do something other than what he is supposed to do.

[FirstLight]

11. i wrote a long email to his teacher

and she just told me he's fine at school! so what, is it just ME he argues with all the time? i know it is more than that....

[Celebration]

12. oh, wow that is GREAT news

I just read through this. You guys need some family counseling. If he is fine at school I certainly wouldn't give him meds.

[elleng]

13. Sounds like 'more than that,' BUT

keep in mind 'kids' do, in fact, 'reserve' bad stuff/acts/behavior for we parents; that's the way it is, 'normal,' so what you're seeing is not all NOT normal. At the very least, sounds like he does know what's right, and has some ability to conform to it.



:grouphug:

[Why Syzygy]

14. Taurus

My son is also Taurus. We both have Moon in Libra; and Rick has indicated that's why we 'debate' .. or used to.

I think what helped with him was giving him choices. With known consequences. Your son isn't too young to do this.
Say, "Do you want to take your herbs now or (half hour later)". If he makes the decision, he has reason to stick to it.
If you give him a choice every time he starts to argue, he can't argue! He may have some ideas of his own on what kind
of choices he would like to have. Incorporate them if you can.

This is how kids learn responsibility. Without self determination and decision making, responsibility remains a stranger to them.

eta:
I cannot imagine how difficult it is to be a single mother. Cut yourself some slack. It's TOUGH! Continue to build your
support network. Someone/somewhere (www) might have suggestions on how to make it easier to be the only parent. You need
plenty of coping skills. But. You will grow so much from living this.

[BanzaiBonnie]

19. What you said!

[southerncrone]

15. Taurus = Obstinate

not to mention hard-headed. They also like to feel they are in charge, so Why S's ideas are good ones.

I know you have been through tough times, but you CANNOT meltdown yourself, or become emotional, when he acts this way. The parent must remain calm. Kids need to know that the parent is in control to feel safe & secure. They "test" us on occasion to see if we are. Sounds like he's doing a lot of "testing". If he gets a "reaction" from you, then you are become "peers" & the parent/child hierarchy is dissolved.....this will make him feel insecure. Cycles will repeat.

As I recall, there was a similar pattern w/your oldest son. During those times you indicated that you were worried about the little ones being exposed to your fighting. Could be that fear has come to be. He is exhibiting learned behavior based on his "role model", the older brother. He thinks: This is HOW boys are SUPPOSED to act toward Mom. Learned behavior based on observation.

I do agree family counseling should be sought. We are here for you as a sounding board, but that does not substitute for authentic counseling, which would include the entire family. This might lead to referrals to other agencies who could help w/testing, counseling, etc.

Make peace the goal.
:hug:

[Celebration]

16. one of my kids had this oppositional behavior

at home, with none at school. It was very difficult. You are exactly right that the parent has to remain calm at all times, and that is difficult at times, let me tell you. But to be dragged down into some verbal battle needs to be avoided at all costs. It is just very, very counterproductive, and seems to cement this behavior by the child.

I love the idea of giving the kid choices, as was mentioned above. The parent sets the choices, but the kid gets to choose. It's a lot harder for the kid to feel controlled at this point. All of this is about control.

Another thing that actually helps are behavior charts with stars and rewards and all that stuff. That also gives the child some control. The parent is able to sanction behavior without flying off the handle.

I think way back when I read some book about various strategies and so forth that parents should take, and whatever it was helped. None of these techniques are magic, but they just helped.

And then, there are energy therapies that we talk about here--EFT, etc.

The cardinal rule about all this is tons and tons of praise and positive feedback when the kid exhibits good behavior.

[FirstLight]

17. thanks to all of the above

yes...and my little bull knows that he and i are both stubborn (me a GOAT) so we tend to lock horns too. ;)

but yes, we are going to pursue all the alternatives we can ... today started very happy and mellow... and he's been taking the herbs for the last 3 days and being very good, so who knows if that's what it is...

:hug:

I appreciate you guys here for letting me vent, and thanks for the great ideas too. I promise i will be continuing to work this out as lovingly as possible...

[Celebration]

20. yea--

May peace reign over Thanksgiving.

:grouphug:

[BanzaiBonnie]

18. In young children, there is no difference between

ADD and PTSD. While part of his personality and other factors are coming through, trauma is a huge influence on how he sees the world. He is doing the best he can to survive. You are still suffering under the burden of the trauma too. Take care of yourself first. It's going to take some work but be gentle with yourself and him. Love one another.