What do you do when you want a spiritual component to your life, but it’s just not there?

[DisgustipatedinCA]

I was raised in a Protestant church, and stopped believing those conventional teachings years and years ago. I’m a concrete, rational person, and I place high value in scientific inquiry, repeatable hypotheses, and the like. Still, I consider spirituality to be a really important part of life. It’s useful for me to think of spirituality in one container and rationality in another container. They don’t mix, one isn’t hierarchically above or below the other—they’re measured with different systems and units.

I have lots of theories about spirituality, ideas I like to consider, and things that I hope to be true. But I don’t really feel any of these things. It’s more like wish projection…”wouldn’t it be neat if, when you die, you find out that you were really part of a larger collective….”. So I’m attracted to some ideas, some notions, but I don’t really feel them. And I’m not even looking for proof, whatever constitutes proof—as I said above, I don’t think this kind of stuff is measurable. But it would be nice to have some sense that you’re headed in the right direction, that this notion is right and that one, not so much. Further, it would be nice to cultivate beliefs that made me feel as though I were “spiritually advancing”, something that feeds a part of my life and is beneficial.

But I really just don’t feel anything like that. Spirituality is hypothetical to me, abstract. I know that in churches (at least the Protestant ones I attended), there are entire programs dedicated to getting people excited about church again. I’m not part of that system anymore, but I’m wondering what you (you being defined as a group that appears to have largely separated itself from standard organized religion) do when you don’t feel anything from your spiritual practice. Do you wait for inspiration, or do you take a more active approach, doing something to kick-start your lack of feeling? What do you do to help yourself remember that’s it’s more important than bills from the next pay cycle, more important than whatever is happening at work?

Thank you.

[BlueIris]

1. Well, for starters I've stopped worrying about whether it's there or not.

In some ways, that is beyond our control. I don't believe we can "make" anyone convert to any system of belief, or even belief itself, including ourselves. So I no longer feel any obligation to "do" anything about times when I feel spiritual awareness is less relevant than paying bills, eating, getting health care, etc.

Something really struck me about your post that I think strikes at the heart of your question: "Spirituality is hypothetical to me, abstract." If that is really the case, then I don't see why you should feel bothered about not having any connection to it.

For some of us, and maybe most in this forum, spiritual awareness and purpose is not abstract, but quite literal in nature. I have had tangible encounters with what I would consider to be divine consciousness. It is not a matter of blind belief for me--I don't "believe" in anything I haven't experienced in a real, physical way. IMO, neither should you (or anyone.) If it isn't real for you yet, (in whichever ways you would define real, of course) then I don't think it should be. Forget about caring about Spirit and what it means to you until you have a valid reason to do so.

[DisgustipatedinCA]

5. Thank you. You made me realize I left some things out

"Something really struck me about your post that I think strikes at the heart of your question: "Spirituality is hypothetical to me, abstract." If that is really the case, then I don't see why you should feel bothered about not having any connection to it. "

The part that I left out is that I believe there's something bigger, something more important than the nuts and bolts of everyday existence. And sometimes, with the right piece of music (as the poster below mentions) or the right setting, right circumstances, I have gotten a sense of better things out there somewhere. I'm sorry I cannot define it further than that, but that's the nature of the transcendent, I guess. So to address your point, I'd say that I'm bothered by not having this connection, because I feel that successfully making this connection would be of benefit to me, possibly the most important thing I could do, or at least way up there on the list. Thank you for your reply.

[I Have A Dream]

2. Spirituality is the only thing that makes me feel truly alive.

I haven't had any amazing metaphysical experiences, and I don't need any. Something deep inside pushes me forward to check things out and use my own "inner knowing" to decide whether something is part of my spiritual path. It is when I heed the wisdom of that "inner knowing" that I feel alive. When I neglect that part of my life for too long, I feel as though I'm slowly dying.

For me, spirituality is a journey, and if I follow my own internal compass, I'm "on course". When I don't follow it and allow others to make these decisions for me, I feel lost at sea.

I guess I'm trying to say that spirituality is a way of living, at least for me, and it affects every decision that I make.

When I am just not "feeling it", I can usually reconnect by listening to music that makes my "soul soar". For some reason, that more than anything else helps me to remember that I'm so much more than just my body and mind, and that it's not an accident that I'm here.

:)

(Welcome to the group!)

[DisgustipatedinCA]

6. Thank you, and a follow-up question for you.

First, thanks for the welcome.

You've never had any amazing metaphysical experiences, and you don't need any. I think I can say the same of myself. But, I'm wondering, do you ever get a sense that there's something OTHER or GREATER than you out there? Similarly, but for different belief systems, do you ever feel as though you are a part of something greater? In other words, is there anything within your spiritual belief system that connects you to something other, something greater, something outside yourself?

I ask, because I'd like to think I basically do the right and ethical thing in most instances (and I'd also like to think I'm pretty aware when I know I've chosen to do the wrong thing). I do have my own internal moral compass, and it would pass muster in many circles. The element missing from what I have is some sense of connectedness...to the universe, god, The IS, etc. I'm not looking to "get saved", or any alternative functional equivalent. But sometimes, as with now, I wonder if I ought to be doing something or another to try to feed and/or revive this part of me.

Again, thank you.

[I Have A Dream]

30. Sorry for the delay in responding; I've been extremely busy at work.

In reference to your question about whether I ever get a sense that there is something OTHER or GREATER than myself, I definitely do. I have ALWAYS felt that connection, and because of that, I would never be happy living in a way that only focused on our 3D "reality". (I'm happy for those who are able to live that way; they have every right to make that decision for themselves just as I've made my own decisions in reference to spirituality.) Additionally, Western religion didn't allow me to be the true being that I felt that I was. All it did was tell me "NO!".

I grew up with Protestant Christianity, but it never "fed" me spiritually. I even tried Evangelical Christianity for a year, and the restrictions that it placed on me made it very clear to me that any religion that tried to tell me that I couldn't trust my own mind or heart because Satan could influence them was not right for me. I understand that my mind and heart can be influenced in subconscious ways, but that's not what Evangelical Christians were telling me. Instead, I was being told that I could only trust what they told me and how they interpreted the Bible, and I didn't even really believe in the Bible.

I finally got to the point where I was so unhappy inside that I decided that I would rather risk going to "Hell" than live in fear of "God". It was at that moment that I gave myself permission to search freely for what made me feel happy and joyous inside. I am so thankful to Evangelical Christianity for helping me to get to that point.

I do not feel that I have a personal connection with the being that people call "God", and I've never felt a need for such a connection. I don't personally believe that the being that created this Universe (who I call "Source") connects directly with people, but I could be wrong; it doesn't matter to me whether I know the truth in reference to this. I definitely feel that I have a connection to what exists outside of this 3D existence though. I truly believe that there is a larger "me" that exists, and that the 3D "me" is just a very small part of that larger "me". Connecting with what feels like the larger "me" is what makes me happy. This is spirituality for me. Others might have totally different experiences, and that's the beauty of spirituality vs. religion.

When I said that I follow my own "inner compass", I wasn't talking about morality, just in case you took it that way. Instead, I meant that I allowed my inner voice (what I feel is the larger "me") to direct my life. I'm not sure that I can explain it except to point to what I said above.

I feel that I am on Earth at this time to make a difference -- to help people who are searching in the same way that I had searched. I do not feel that I should push anyone in any direction, but often, when I tell people that I am following my own spiritual path, people are intrigued at the concept and indicate how bound they also feel by organized religion. It seems that when they realize that one can be what they consider to be a "good" person and not be a Christian, they experience a paradigm shift, of sorts. Often, they will then give themselves permission to "follow their bliss" as well, at least in small ways.

One other thing that I should mention is that I had to get to the point where my personality was ready to accept that it shouldn't be in the driver's seat of my life. It had to voluntarily hand the wheel over to the larger "me". It wasn't willing to be told that it had to hand it over to anything/anyone. It had to make the decision itself based upon what allowed it to feel happy. It refused to live a life based upon fear. (This may sound small or inconsequential, but it was an extremely important part of what happened in my spiritual "story".) I am happiest when my personality is the servant of the larger "me", and I do not feel that it fights for control.

Good luck in finding your "bliss", DisgustipatedinCA. If I can help you in any way, please don't hesitate to ask. Much love and light to you during this time.

:grouphug:

[Howler]

3. DisgustipatedinCA

Since you have a logical mind and put a high value in scientific inquiry I would suggest Barbara Ann Brennen

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Barbara_Brennan
Heres her education Bio
Scientific training and early career
Brennan received a Bachelor of Science degree in Physics in 1962 from the University of Wisconsin–Madison, and two years later received her Masters in Atmospheric Physics from the same institution. She then worked as a research scientist at NASA's Goddard Space Flight Center.<2> From 1970, she researched and worked with the "human energy field". She completed a two–year program in Therapeutic Counselling at the Community of the Whole Person in Washington, D.C., followed by a three-year program in Core Energetics at the Institute for Core Energetics in New York, New York in 1978 and a five-year program in Spiritual Healership at the Phoenicia Pathwork Center in Phoenicia, New York in 1979. She was strongly influenced by Eva and John Pierrakos, who founded a system for self-transformation called the Pathwork, drawing on the ideas of Wilhelm Reich and Alexander Lowen. Brennan worked with the Pierrakos, and became a Pathwork Helper and Core Energetics therapist.<3> Brennan also took seminars with and was influenced by Rev. Rosalyn L. Bruyere.<3> She developed her own private healing practice in 1977 and then established a training programme to teach others.<4><2> Brennan claims Ph.D.s in philosophy from Greenwich University and theology from Holos University, both earned in 2001.<5> These universities are unaccredited.<6>

She has written two of the most influential books of energy healing "Hands Of light A guide to healing through the human energy field"

And “Light emerging” The journey of personal healing.
Also there are two wonderful books Called “Eastern Body Western Mind “” Wheels of light” by Anodea Judith That I highly recommend.

But the most important thing is MEDITATION, MEDITATION, and MEDITATION! LOL!
I hope you find these resources helpful.
and Welcome to ASAH!!! I'm so happy to meet you DisgustipatedinCA.:hi: :hug:

[DisgustipatedinCA]

7. Thank you, Howler

I'm sorry to say I don't know anything about Barbara Ann Brennen. I'll do some reading about her.

Eastern Body Western Mind sounds like just the right sort of title for me. Again, I'm not coming from some angle where I want to make spirituality rational, or prove/disprove something spiritual on a scientific basis. But that rationality is a large part of my existence, so if there are books written with an audience like me in mind, I'd be very interested in reading those books.

Meditation? I've tried it, but not in a systematic or serious way. And of course I've heard that prayer done a certain way can be akin to meditation. I don't want to ask you personal questions about your meditation practice, but I am curious--do you feel benefits from a practice of meditation? I'd need to make a quiet and still place that doesn't exist in my daily schedule now. But that's why I'm asking this series of questions--I might be interested in making incremental changes in my daily life here and there.

[Howler]

8. DisgustipatedinCA

I didn't think you were coming from a need to prove or disprove spirituality.
I got the feeling that you wanted to engage and interact with reverse entropy.
These books give you a road map to immediately start experiencing and communicating as well as communing and channeling the energy that people call "God" or the "Tao".
And these Authors take what some folks consider "Woo Woo" out of it and give you basic steps to achieve that connection.

Yes! A million times yes! There are most definitely benefits to yourself and your spirituality by meditating.LOL!
The reason I keep laughing is because when I started on my own path my Teachers made a point to stress this as an invaluable practice in seeking spiritual connectedness as well as psychic awareness. After 30 years I'm sayin the same thing to new seekers.
Which is Very Ironic if you knew me back then.Every time I give this advice within my husbands earhot he snorts! He remembers.LOL!
DisgustipatedinCA you can meditate to a favorite piece of music too but I highly suggest taking the time out to do a full lying down meditation.
They have fully guided meditation c.ds to start out with by .....shaki Gwain...???...Its been years since I took a guided one, and I'm not sure of the spelling. Any ways you can google "Guided meditation C.Ds and I'm sure there will be hundreds of choices.

As I said before DisgustipatedinCA I am always overjoyed to meet another traveler.:)

[GliderGuider]

4. What a big question!

What is "spirituality" to you? How do you define it? What value does (would) it bring to your life? What does the lack of it feel like to you? Do you notice its absence or do you mourn it? When you notice the lack of feeling you mention, and you inquire into it, what comes up - for example, what do you think about when you try to get in touch with your feelings?

My recipe (coming from a seriously analytical and scientistic family that rejected spirituality altogether) was to go the other way. I dove into the intellectual analysis of the predicament of humanity (peak oil, politics, climate change, food shortages, species extinctions) until I realized that there is no hope - our species and much other life on the planet is simply doomed. The resulting years of suicidal despair turned into a Dark Night of the Soul. At the bottom of it I realized that I could not survive without a sense of the sacred in my life, and since I had none, I'd damned well better find it in a hurry. Surrendering to that realization was the tipping point for me.

Yes, this was a bit extreme :-) but it left me with the understanding that my spirituality arose when I realized I could not survive without it. It wasn't a "nice-to-have", it was a mandatory requirement for my continued existence. How might a lack of a spiritual component in your life threaten your physical or psychic existence, now or in the future?

One other small point - during a retreat I made a vow to become less knowledgeable. As a self-styled intellectual, that really helped.

[DisgustipatedinCA]

9. Wow. thanks for the reply and the thought provoking counter-questions

Spirituality: I probably define this in a few different ways. "Religious stuff without the trappings of organized religion" would be one way I'd define it in an exclusionary sense. Another way I'd define it is "something either outside oneself or extended from oneself without conscious-mind awareness, that is greater than the single person that I am; something that does (or should) bind humanity together at some level" (side note: I rarely read this forum, and I'm not familiar with any sore spots, don't go there's, or accepted norms, so I don't mean to step on doctrine if I'm defining spirituality in a way that's unacceptable to others--just my own working definitions).

What does the lack of it feel like to you? Pretty much nothing. I live in a concrete world of details and timelines. There wasn't some yearning for a greater spiritual life that led me to write this post. But there was an academic thought that I should really have more spiritual components to my life. And academically, I kind of agreed with that notion. The quantum leap seems to be going from "it would be a good idea to pursue this more fully..." to "I feel this thing, and I want to incorporate it into the living of my life".

What value does/would it bring to my life? I don't know, but I have suspicions about the converse, about the alternative. And my suspicions run along the same lines as what you've already mentioned: if THIS is all there is, with famine, wars, hateful people, pretend paper that makes entire countries go on austerity diets--if this is all there is, then I'd better busy myself with something, because the futility of it all will consume me one day if I don't either find a distraction, or find a personal solution. I'm good with finding distractions, but I'm thinking in terms of going for personal solution instead.

Thanks very much for the post. It's given me something to look at from different sides; much appreciated.

[katty]

10. hey, take a deep breath and invoke your 'essential self'-call

upon that spirit-that has no boundries! and then kick back & have a glass of wine!

[Celebration]

11. since I am not particularly verbal

I have a problem answering this. Plus I have some of the same issues myself.

Joseph Campbell kept saying "follow your bliss."

It is kind of strange but I feel drawn to some of the same things that I was drawn to in my childhood, but with a different twist. I am drawn to being out in nature, by myself. That describes me as a child. And that is where I turn as an adult. As a child I made up games, even war games. As an adult it is photography. But essentially I find my spirituality by being outside in nature, by observing nature and documenting it.

By the way, I seriously doubt that is the answer for everyone. Meditation is another way. A lot of people find their bliss in community. I only need a moderate amount of that.

Basically it all has to do with leading an authentic life, being true to values.

[DisgustipatedinCA]

12. Thank you, Celebration

I could live on Joseph Campbell. I have the Bill Moyers and Susan Sarandon (Mythos) DVD sets. I haven't watched them in awhile, but Campbell always resonated with me. For me, maybe the trick is to define "bliss" as usefully as possible for myself. I know it doesn't mean "hedonism" or "do anything I feel like at any given moment".

I'm also a photographer--it's been awhile since I hung out in the photography forum, but I'm also into landscape photography. In my case, I'm thinking of a million different things when shooting: will I get in place before the sun is up, where is the sun relative to my shot, do I have a fast enough shutter for this focal length, do I have enough/too much DOF, those sorts of things. And while I have gotten a lot better at this activity, and can make all of these adjustments without thinking too much about them, I'm still probably in too technical of a state of mind to truly appreciate the beauty around me. I've noticed that about my photography before now, and I've thought about taking some of those hikes without a camera in hand. I think I'll make a point of doing that and seeing what comes of it.

Anyway, thank you again.

[Why Syzygy]

14. Nature

does it for me too. It is especially effective when water is involved.

I try to keep in mind that we are spiritual beings having a physical experience. We ARE spiritual. There is nothing 'out there'. No silver bullet. Spirituality is who we are. So, to me your longing represents a stirring in your spirit. You're ready to get to know that part of yourself now. It's a discovery.

Being comfortable with ambiguity is required in my path. The Mother Goddess, Sophia (wisdom), is my inspiration. Ironically it is in the most basic of sensory input from Her physical gifts to us that awaken my soul. In this worldview the biggest "sin" is what money junkies are doing to Her and Her people.

Breath work is very good. Do you ever listen to chant music? Singing sets our facial bones to vibrating. They in turn stimulate the pineal glad. I'm a rational sort too. For me, the path to the spiritual is via the physical. Have you ever seen the natives in South America in their rituals? The women sit in a loose circle and chant. And chant. As they do that they go into a trance (from the breath and sounding). There are many such ways to alter our consciousness, which is what it's all about I guess.

Very thoughtful question. Thanks for posting it here.

[Celebration]

25. chanting is absolutely awesome

I wish there was a chanting group here with a facilitator. I'm not quite musical enough to start or lead one. But I would pay to go to a regular chanting group. I'm not quite seeing the value of chanting by myself, though, and listening to chanting doesn't quite cut it for me. But chanting in a group? Ah, that is just amazing.

[Why Syzygy]

27. If there are

any Intender's Circles in your area, they often do chants as part of the program.

[rucognizant]

18. Follow your Bliss..........?

I have been doing that for many years....( earning a living with my art talent) with an interim period of complete disillusionment, ('90 2007, when I was forced to sell my house at a loss, had just enough to buy my current house which is poor and disintegrating around me)intensely spiritual for the past 2 years with mystical & magic synchronisities, accompanying my Reiki practice. I got a small grant ( to support advertising & visibility, not living expenses) and produced some wonderful paintings............
If I had gone into fincance as a cafreer I probably could have done quite well, I have inherited my Grandfather's ability in that field & understand the nuances of it, A LOT BETTER THAN THE CLUELESSLY ENTHUSIASTIC CURRENT INVESTORS WHO ARE BEING HOODWINKED WHILE WORKING FOR EARLY RETIREMENT.!
But I chose Art, in the 50's a respected profession..........but "man can not live by bliss alone" and I have 45 days to find a solution to being able to continue to live independent in my own house or bail.......? where ? unknown ? funded by ? NOT MY $891. per month SS not enough to pay rent anywhere! And I am saddened.at this time of year, I really miss the house I lost. The sun came in the door on the east shone into 45' of windows in the south side all day including the big double dormers in the South bedroom.....the huge fieldstone fireplace with the pipes under the flame throwing heat out into the 20 x 25' living room & the bedrooms upstairs over the balcony overlooking the liv. room.........also warmed..............even in a power outage when the blower motor didn't work when the stones warmed up they radiated heat.
THIS house! angled to the sun, at this time of year, hardly gets any sun at all. It strikes the corner of the house where no windows are.
Oh It DOES beat in from the West in the middle of summer when it is hot! I did have a compass in my hand when I looked at it 20 years ago...........but of the 20 houses I looked at ( all were pretty much the same way.you see in Downeast Maine..........the roads all run NE to SW.......down all those little peninsulas.........In their appalling lack of connection to nature, the early builder went for 4 square to the road,tidier you know! Wouldn't you think that men who went to sea and depended on the weather for their lives would be a little more sensitive than that?
My 45 days? I got 99 gallons of heating oil from LIHEAP for the WINTER! That shoulkd last me until the end of December...then what? I can not make myself believe at this point. I KNOW we ARE SUPPOSED TO MAKE HAPPEN WHAT WE WISH....BEEN DOING IT FOR 37 YEARS..IT JUST ISN'T WORKING ANYMORE.

[Celebration]

22. ...................

:hug:

[bigmonkey]

13. You might be really pleased with Ken Wilber's work.

The easiest of his books, for the philosophically minded, might be "A Brief History of Everything", which is in the traditional philosophical "dialogue" form. He also has a small book called "The Marriage of Sense and Soul" that I particularly like.

Very rational guy. Very spiritual guy. Quite remarkable.

[GliderGuider]

15. That's an excellent suggestion!

I'd recommend his book "Integral Spirituality" as well. Wilber should be a very good fit for someone with with an intellectual, analytical orientation.

[snot]

16. I'm agnostic about whether or not there's a god; and

regard anyone who claims certainty one way or the other as deluded or a con.

But either way, I believe I need a purpose in life in order for my life to feel satisfying and meaningful (see Viktor Frankl's "Man's Search for Meaning").

And even if there were/is a god, that should not, in my view deprive us of the joy, or relieve us of the responsibility, of exercising our own initiative to figure out worthy and satisfying purposes for ourselves, and even designing our own "master plan" for our world, if we wish.

And if there is no god but us, there's nothing to stop us from being the best gods we can be.

I believe we've got nothing to lose, and perhaps everything to gain, by assuming that we can help make this world better, and I strongly doubt we've got much of anything better to do.

Whether you believe in god or not, trying to make the world better is simply the most challenging, interesting, fun game around. (Creation is, I believe, both more fun and more challenging than destruction.)

I think there are adequate, rational grounds in the sciences and logic for going along with all of the foregoing, without ever leaving the rationalist container.

But once you get that far with it, and start trying to figure out what you think a better world would look like (or whatever other purpose you identify as satisfying to you to pursue), and to figure out what might be a satisfying way for you personally to forward things toward that goal, well, I think you end up finding you're living a spiritual life.

Note, I do think one should try to find ways to pursue one's chosen purpose(s) in ways that tend to deploy your peculiar talents or involve your interests or things you enjoy, both bec. there's no reason not to try to find a path that's as fun as possible for you, and also bec. you'll probably be more effective at it if that's the case.

And if you pursue this path for any length of time, I think you'll find yourself having spiritual feelings. Or if not, I think you will, at the minimum, experience love and joy; and that's what I call spiritual.

[Proud_Lefty]

17. The yearning you're feeling is your soul saying

WAKE UP. Now is the time to find what feels right for you. Spirituality covers so many things, astrology, numerology, sound, stones, reiki, past life regressions, etc., etc., etc. It can become overwhelming. You don't have to learn about all of it, but if venture out and if something interests you, learn more.

For starters, realize that you are a spiritual being having a human experience. That being wants to be happy, healthy, peaceful and comfortable. Then yes, we are all part of everyone and everything else. Wanting and visualizing the same happiness, healthiness, peacefulness and comfort for all that is, helps bring you closer to source, the inner voice, the God within you, where we all need to connect.

Then look into the various techniques that help you and go with that that resonates with you. Don't let anyone drag you into anything you're not comfortable with.

Enjoy your journey. You'll find it probably won't resemble a religious path. Religion limits and encourages people to stop being themselves. Spirituality knows no limits and helps you embrace yourself, honoring your flaws and mistakes.

Welcome!

[hermetic]

19. How fortunate

we are to live in a time where all avenues are available to us at the click of a key. We used to have to seek out books to get this information. Now the magnitude of videos on YouTube covering everything from how to meditate to how to read Tarot cards can be overwhelming, but it's all there for you.

Since you are scientifically inclined, you might want to watch this TED talk by a scientist about spirituality. It's VERY interesting.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=UyyjU8fzEYU

Meditation has calmed my mind. I no longer despair over my past or fear for my future the way I used to. It helps keep me centered in the now.
How to choose a meditation technique.
http://meditationtechniques.co/3387/how-to-choose-a-meditation-technique/

Do you have SIRIUS radio? There is a wonderful program called Tapestry that looks at a different form of spirituality every week. I try to always listen to it. Podcasts are available, as well.
http://www.cbc.ca/tapestry/
"An engaging, provocative and unexpected hour of radio: an hour in which rabbis and poets get equal time on the topic of faith, science-fiction writers and physicist-priests ponder the great creation myths, athletes explore the hero's journey as a spiritual metaphor, and architects examine the idea of space for the soul."

Happy trails!

[get the red out]

20. No answers, but interesting seeking

I've got no answers, but I really enjoy seeking. I have gone up and down with this spirituality thing. I remember as a child seeing the light in "Jesus" in Church, then finding despair in the hatefulness of my parents' religion as a teenager. I became quite agnostic (for me agnostic was being a chicken-shit atheist; scared to death to admit I believed in nothing anymore and damned angry about it). I went through a long period of being depressed and setting myself up to be betrayed by people and nearly killed myself and sought spirituality because I was told to. It was the first time anyone told me I could have an idea of some higher purpose without the required limitations and hatefulness of "Church". Then I began to see that what I had found, that "belief system" had its own limitations, as all systems where any humans consider themselves knowledgeable do. I also went into a very dark period of fear that my parents' beliefs might be true and I might burn eternally. This prompted me to begin to read and read. I chose books on Christianity in a historical perspective as well as books about scientific investigation into reincarnation (which had always had a resonance with me). I read things that made sense to me and others that did not and kept going. I am still going! I have done meditation, but find that my best meditation is running/walking in the pre-dawn or doing needlework (which I had always had but failed to realize what it was for me). Right now I am working more on trying to be in the moment and see what I am feeling and feeling the connection to "out there".

If we look, we see eventually. There are experiences around us all the time that aren't based in logic, or at least I see them. Ever accidentally stare in someone's direction to have them suddenly turn and look at you? What logic is that? I laid down to take a nap one day and suddenly dreamed that I was running fast across a field, top speed. I suddenly awoke with the bed slightly shaking and looked beside me to see my dog's feet running in her sleep. WOW, we are all connected, or at least I think so. These little things keep me going because I don't have the really big things. But I know I have the right to sort through information and select what is right for me, and even cast that aside for something I resonate with more later on. Freedom. To me that is what spirituality has that religion does not. I am not locked in.

I have bookmarked this thread. I saw some books mentioned that I want to read myself. Thanks for the topic, it's wonderful, even for me who doesn't know anything at all!

[kentauros]

21. What I do is listen to HayHouse Radio.

I can get exposed to all sorts of ideas there, especially on Eldon Taylor's show (that comes on today in a few hours.) I think he archives his show on his website, too, but have found his site not of the best layouts for finding things.

Here are the relevant links:
http://www.hayhouseradio.com/index.php
http://www.eldontaylor.com

Alternately, you can always read the Tao :)

[Why Syzygy]

23. Eldon Taylor

http://www.facebook.com/pages/Eldon-Taylor-Fan-Page/112261405523569?ref=ts

facebook fan page. He is posting for "public", so maybe anyone can read his Wall.

[Why Syzygy]

24. Peter Russell

This interview with Peter Russell goes right to the heart of this question.

http://www.peterrussell.com/TV/index.php?pg=128510091244487

It's the one entitled, "Touching Essence".
youtube channel
http://www.youtube.com/user/prussell117

You probably already know that 'religion' differs from spirituality. Whereas religions have a written code of beliefs
and plenty of ammo to keep folks in line (straight jacket); spirituality throws the doors open wide. All things are
possible, and yes, even 'allowed' (so long as there is no victim involved).

[DisgustipatedinCA]

26. Thank you, everyone, for all the responses and further reading

This is an impressive group, by the way. I really appreciate the suggestions everyone has given, and I think I have lots of reading to do.

As a side note: it's kind of nice to post in a forum where people aren't trying to one-up one another, a la GD. I'll still join the general discussion wars, but looks like a nice spot to visit for more contemplative reading.

Thank you.

[Fire Walk With Me]

28. Do spiritual things.

Feed the homeless. Volunteer at the local soup kitchen. Collect clothes and items from friends and family for Goodwill donation, and donation to homeless shelters, women's shelters, etc. Apply your personal skills to help those who need them.

If you are uncertain about the best way to apply yourself to the benefit of others, pray to be used for your best ability to be of benefit to others.

Loving actions are a core basis of spirituality.

[BanzaiBonnie]

29. The two gems I would share have been from two wonderful teachers

Rudolph Steiner wrote that is you study any one subject deeply enough, you will find the place where it's connected to everything else. The other teacher, this one in real time, said that the most important thing to remember is that we always have choice.


Following those two pieces of advice has brought me immense joy as well as the freedom to keep growing into myself. That is where I find myself connected to every other thing.

[rosesaylavee]

31. You sound like me or how I was before finding

the Unitarian Universalist society we've attended now for 16+ years. It's a group of like minded people who have arrived there from a wide variety of faith backgrounds - Christian, Jewish, Muslim, Buddhist, Hindu, Atheist, Agnostic and we all allow and support each other in our differing spiritual paths. We also have a pretty fun time doing it.

I would suggest attending one or two in your area just to try them out... like other churches, each congregation may have a dif vibe. We are fortunate in that the one closest to us is our preferred congregation. No group is perfect but we are amazed that this has worked for us as long as it has.

Enjoy your search!

[Remember Me]

32. I was going to do it anyway, some day, but took the plunge and became a donor

today, specifically so I could respond to this thread.

It's a wonderful question, Disgustipated, and asking is exactly what will get you the answers you seek. You might get some answers here, or possible hints and clues. But please also ask the Unseen, by whatever you call it/them. Simply calling them "Spirit" is useful and many people do that, including me. I have never, ever asked Spirit for help in the form of guidance and not gotten it. I've asked for other things that were denied, but I was asking for those things mostly when I was much, much younger and didn't yet understand that sometimes a resounding No! is a real blessing. (Takeaway Lesson: when asking for "things" or events, etc., always add "This or something better, and for the Highest Good of All, and you'll be absolutely sure that whatever happens is the best for you and others.)

So, my own first bit of advice would be to start asking your Unseen partners for guidance on what you need to know, learn, do, be. And then watch as certain books almost jump out at you or fall off the bookshelf into your hands (only a slight exaggeration), or you get into an interesting conversation with a perfect stranger, or just happen onto a TV or radio show that has information just for you. Etc. "When the student is ready, the teacher appears." So, ask and be ready to receive: try very hard to listen, hear and then follow any and all inner promptings you get. In fact, practice by doing such silly things as asking for a great parking space when you next go out and then following your inner urges about which parking lot row to go down, etc.

Now, here's a shocking but absolutely essential bit of information for you, something you're going to have to know, I think, and the heart of what I signed on to tell you. Your rational mind is fine and great, and does a lot for you and is to be honored, enjoyed and loved. But as I've already alluded, you're going to have to make friends with and cultivate your subjective mind, because that's where Spirituality resides, in the main.

Now, what tripped my triggers was that you said twice, "But I don’t really feel any of these things." FEELINGS, emotions, etc., are exactly what you're after. Can you be spiritual without them? I'm not absolutely sure, but my guess would be in a limited way at best. Often, scientists disdain the subjective, which has certainly caused a great deal of the tension and fighting at DU between the so-called (self-described) "skeptics" and those of us who simply KNOW better (sorry, but that's the truth).

My own view of things (but it's not my original view -- this has come from my own studies and understanding of my studies and this makes sense to me) is that we need both parts of our brain functioning together. Ideally: the rational, logical mind in service to the part of our mind that creates and is inspired and feels compassion and love and loyalty and so many other Soul Qualities and is in touch with the numinous.

YOUR Soul is whispering to you right now, and reaching you through your intellect, which may be the only or at least main avenue open. I hope you'll find ways to allow more of the subjective into your life in general, because it is all tied together.

My recommendations for books would be to take a look at Quantum Physics and books such as The Tao of Physics. Or a completely different approach, scientist Gary Zukov's Seat of the Soul or other of his books.

Or, have a look at the Institute for Noetic Sciences, founded by astronaut Edgar Mitchell. http://noetic.org I so support their work, and am so disinterested in it. LOL. Mitchell was so transformed by the spiritual experience he had as an astronaut circling the Earth, that he founded this organization way back when to bridge science and spirituality. IONS does a lot of research on consciousness, healing, etc. and have all sorts of programs, books, etc. Have a look to see if it interests you.

Back to Quantum Physics for a moment. While it's not yet written in stone, quantum physicists have found that the basic building block of the universe is energy -- and will eventually find that that energy is Love (or Light which is also God, but we're getting into a certain type of theology and I don't want to do that here). AND, all the mystics I've ever known about or studied have told us that everything is energy, AND that it can be moved and manipulated by intention. Or, as Edgar Cayce put it, "Mind is the Builder," by which he simply meant that we could make -- create -- anything we wanted to out of the basic building block substance of the universe.

When I was much younger -- in my teens or perhaps early 20s -- I read a wonderful thin little book, The Universe and Dr. Einstein by Lincoln Barnett. I still have it, all these decades later. Having read a number of metaphysical books and been introduced to the "everything is energy" truth already in my somewhat young life, I was knocked out by what I read about Einstein's Theory of Relativity. I finished that book and closed it in awe at the realization that "Some day science and religion (by which I actually meant spirituality, not having articulated the difference for myself yet) will merge." What I hadn't counted on, and what thrills me beyond belief, is that it's already happening. Here, in my lifetime, it's already happening. And it's SUCH common knowledge that it can even be the subject of Oprah shows. Plural. Really! Now, the confirmed, rigidly mechanistic, reductionist so-called skeptics among us can't see or appreciate anything of the sort. But should this line of inquiry and study interest you, who knows? Perhaps you will be able to reach some of them.

Or not.

But whatever lies ahead for you, I hope you'll ponder the thought that your Soul IS reaching out and gently leading you in a certain direction and that it's all for a purpose, in this incredible time in Earth's history. You are here for a reason. It will be very exciting (for you) to find out what that reason is. Godspeed!

[Howler]

33. Welcome Remember Me.

I hope you will be posting here regularly now.
:hi:

[Remember Me]

34. Thank you!

Probably will. Feels like home. :D

[Howler]

35. We do have really good folks here.

And after reading your post You are a very positive and welcome addition.
I can't wait to read more.


:hug:

[Remember Me]

38. Oh, my goodness

Thank you. That's quite a compliment.

[Proud_Lefty]

36. Yes, welcome

I love your insight. You definitely seem to have a lot to offer.

[findrskeep]

37. I would suggest some energy work, such as

Reiki. Any type of energy work will open you up, it will also bring to the surface anything that needs to be released, i.e. emotional baggage/trauma etc. Releasing old hurts like that will also raise your vibration, and by raising your vibration you will grow spiritually. Also, I think someone else mentioned "meditate, meditate, meditate" and I second that as well. The other thing that I have found that will raise your vibration faster than anything is to have gratitude. Just think of some things in your life you are grateful for and focus on them and feel that wonderful feeling of gratitude. Practice this along with the energy work, meditation and you'll begin to open up. There are all kinds of things you can do easily to raise your vibration, i.e. grow and open spiritually. Just to mention a few for example...listening to music you enjoy, spending time in nature, if you like animals spend time with them or get a pet, eat more 'living' foods such as raw vegetables and fruits, etc. I've seen it happen so many times with people. Soon, you'll begin to see situations through "new eyes" and all the worries that go along with the 3D life, such as bills, work issues, people that get under your skin and basically anything that causes you stress will take a backseat and a whole new world will open up for you. Good luck!

One more thing, read or listen to some of Gregg Braden's work. His stuff tends to bridge the gap between science and spirituality and it's very interesting. One thing that always stood out to me is the work he's done concerning the magnetic field and how the dissipation of it is affecting consciousness, and helping people to awaken..fascinating stuff. There's tons of free video's on youtube. And yes, "ask" and then practice being very aware..you will receive "nudges" leading you in the right direction, to the right people/contacts/teachers..