Question re: astrological profile.

[tanyev]

Does the time of conception play any part in a person's chart/profile? 'Scuse me if that is a silly question (I'm such a newbie at this), but that question just flashed through my mind when I read the thread about Skinner's new baby. If so much of a person's life can be revealed by knowing the time and place of birth, what about the moment in time that was the catalyst? Granted, those moments are much harder to pinpoint ;), so it would be difficult to observe any patterns, but I am wondering if there are any schools of thought out there that consider this.

It seems I like have come across various articles hypothesizing that the parents' emotions and state of mind at conception can influence a child's development; the specific time and place of conception wouldn't be much more of a stretch.

[stellanoir]

1. Conceptional astrology is practiced and I'm sure it has validity

but I have enough "twouble" getting birth times and physiologically unless the parents are really conscious, it's my understanding that actual conception can occur long after the actual intercourse. Like guys, some spermatozoa have better aim than others that take more circuitous routes, wandering aimlessly for a while checking out the neighborhood before moving in.

Like businesses, marriages, relationships, countries, and buildings, some astrologers cast many charts for various "beginnings" as sometimes manifestation comes in stages and increments.

[tanyev]

2. Aha! Conceptional Astrology. Fascinating.

*off to google*

Thanks!

[cassiepriam]

3. karmic/spiritual/soul astrology

The belief is that the moment of birth is the
only time that really matters. Not when the child
was conceived, or should or would have been born, etc.

The actual minute of birth is the time the soul wanted the astrological imprint on the human body. (for example I was born two months early as I wanted to have a certain astrological chart and cosmic energies. I also came into this incarnation at the last minute :( )

Oh, now that you mention it, conception does take
a part in prenatal solar eclipse analysis of the natal chart. It is one of the few if only astrological measures which is determined prior to the birth time, i.e. the interval between conception and birth. Prior to birth the fetus gets a cosmic dusting from the eclipse energy. The last eclipse prior to the birth.

Not many do this type measure, I love it, think it is very valuable.

[stellanoir]

4. Yes prenatal and even post natal eclipse points are truly fascinating

I've spent far more time pondering those than concptual speculative stuff. Though it's all interesting for sure.

Though I've heard more theories than I can tell.

Have even seen charts of when the ambilical cord was severed. That would be in the more organic settings wherein the attendants allow it to dry out.

Still the first breath is the fisrt breath and is often the first "wahhh."

That is considered to be the the animation point wherein a child is an independent entity.

I'm concerned about the current plethora of C sections though. The women and Dacs who squeeze choldbirth into their schedules with no regard to the will of the child.

I've a lot of stories to tell about that.

You were a premmie. . . ? Wows. Guess your Mars got you through.:hug:

Will respond to your PM shortly dear.

[cassiepriam]

5. PN eclipses

Yes I think it is good info to look at, but as I have complained about in the past there is not a lot of info about the prenatal eclipses. A few books out there, not much.

From the karmic point of view we are looking at the point when the body is free from the mother and is taking the direct energies of the planets on the body. So it doesn't even have to be first breath.

I know that there is lots of concern about C sections and all of that, is this throwing a monkey wrench in the timing of the birth? The spiritual astrologers just laugh at this.
The Divine has it all worked out, so called modern technology doesn't change things at all. We are all born exactly the moment we are supposed to, however if happens.

I have even heard of women consulting an astrologer to determine the best time to schedule the c section, in an attempt to get the best placements for the baby! Gee I want the baby to have Jup in he 2h and bunches of grand trines, when should I have the c section to get that? Or I don't want any squares, when can I get that? :) Talk about designer babies!

I have a friend who is trying to get pregnant and determined not to have a Scorpio. She thinks she is in control of that :) I am predicting that she will have a Scorpio baby!

Yes I was a 2 month preemie way back in the days before neo natal units etc. I weighed about 2 and a half lbs. They plunked the preemies in an incubator and said some Hail Mary's back in those days. But I was a strong little cuss.
I screamed and kicked. Actually I kicked so much and so strongly, that I kicked out the sides of the glass incubator! The hospital staff sent me home early. I like to joke that I got kicked out of the hospital nursery for being unruly. And my parents say that I never did stop kicking and screaming for the rest of my life. How true.

And as I have talked about before I was born on the same day as a total solar eclipse of the sun. Which was combust with my sun, right in the middle of my Pisces stellium. No one can tell me all that was an accident. The Vedics actually think this placement indicates a high likelihood the baby will die. Most that I have talked to did have some complications at birth.

[stellanoir]

8. As to both prenatal and post natal eclipses and for in depth readings

I feel you can view them as senstive or karmic trigger degrees,

I had a friend who planned a C-section and an appraching hurricane intervened so the hospital rushed all the "routine" surgeries scheduled for the following week just to free up the the hospital beds. She ended up with a funny kid who had Saturn exactly conjunct her Moon.

Yup I think it's probably a co creative effort by both mother and child. Still there is a sense around "designer babies" that they may have controlling mommies.

Two and 1/2 lbs and kicking out the side of the incubator??? LOL And I had thought I was the rebellious one around here.
Sounds as though you are the perfect mom for your daughter.

I once worked with a much older guy who was born in the backwoods of Maine in the '30's. I can't remember his birth wieght but he was so small his mom put him in a shoe box in the oven set really low. That blew my mind.

I was born a few days after an eclipse and gave my mum false labor during the eclipse (trepidatious as ever.) That's why I pay attention to them.

[DemExpat]

9. My regression birth therapies

that I had back up this assumption of yours, stellanoir....

Yup I think it's probably a co creative effort by both mother and child. Still there is a sense around "designer babies" that they may have controlling mommies.

I came to understand that how my mother's inability to have me without being drugged and having me pulled out by forceps - which I experienced in a terrible, life-long influencing way - goes hand in hand with my ambivalence of having to re-incarnate again. I didn't want to come back to earth and was forced by one or two "men" spirits to face it all again.
I also saw how I chose my parents and started my present dance....

My mother was a sweet soul, but very weak and unassertive, leaving me to face things with no sense of support or guidance whatsoever. But this therapy allowed me in the long term to face the truth of her inadequacy while allowing me to truly forgive her, as she was my chosen Mom to show me certain very painful lessons.
I feel very fortunate that I was able to thank her from the bottom of my heart for being my Momma before her early and sudden death at age 71 from a brain aneurysm. :cry: :loveya:

I definitely see birth, as all of life and relationships, as co creative efforts.

DemEx

[cassiepriam]

12. They put me in a shoe box too and I had to wear doll clothes.

Then my mom and aunt who were nurses had Grandpa rig up a home incubator for me, according to their directions. (no glass sides this time:))

My mom could carry me in the palm of her hand. The pictures are a hoot!

Oh I thought the same thing about the designer astrology babies, a bit of control issue on the parents' part I would say.

Can you imagine the audacity to think we can outsmart God's plans and soul purpose? The Divine must be laughing at that one. Ah what amusement we must provide for the other side. They must laugh loudly, when they are not crying for us of course.

PS you were almost born on the eclipse, but was not meant to be. Just as well, direct cosmic dust from the ellipse is a trip, I think a few days after is much better.

[stellanoir]

16. awwwww

I can't imagine your intrepid spirit ever to be contained by a shoe box, a palm, or doll clothes. That is an amazing story as well.

Thanks for sharing and so-o-o glad you survived. You are the best.

[cassiepriam]

20. Oh one last thing

As an adult I have to make my bed a huge nest.
Tons of blankets, pillows, throws, pillows.
I burrow under it all like a mole. Even in summer.

My husband says it is because I didn't get enough womb time
as a fetus :(

[DemExpat]

6. I do know that I am very happy about the conception times of my 2 children

being the two most unforgettable lovemaking sessions I ever experienced with my husband!

I definitely see this as a major spiritual happening in all of our lives.


:D

DemEx

[NMDemDist2]

7. a wise incarnated Master I knew once told me that

there in lies the reason for so many 'broken' people. so many these days are not conceived in love but rather just a quick 'bang'

children conceived in love have a much better chance at physical and mental well being when born

[DemExpat]

10. Yes, I can well imagine this to be great truth.

Its not the only prerequisite for love, but it sure adds joy and gratefulness and sets the stage, so to speak.

DemEx

[stellanoir]

11. I had the same feeling about my son's conception

and years ago when the first test tube baby was born I wondered about the lack of sensuality, love, and emotion and how it might effect those individuals.

[davsand]

13. I also wonder about the fact those babies are chosen.

I dunno--Maybe I'm looking at this all wrong, but I also kind of think that those babies from IVF are wanted so VERY much by the parents that maybe it is able to mitigate that clinical start.

I figure ANY couple that wants a child that bad will probably at least TRY to be a good parent. Maybe that is just optimism on my part--I dunno.

This is a fascinating discussion to be having!


Laura

[DemExpat]

18. Perhaps!

I think that adoptive parents can also have a great love connection as well.

DemEx

[cassiepriam]

14. This does have a very positive impact on the child. The energy is so good.

When the soul enters the fetus it can feel the environment
which includes conception and home issues.

[stellanoir]

15. Yup it all goes into the mix for sure

I'm just so earthy and watery that I can't quite wrap my head around manipulating things (especially birth) according to my presumed will alone.

Just before I went into labor there was an enormous heat lightening storm. Spirit guided me to go out into it. I instinctually "figured eight" and went into labor.

That was a trip.

[DemExpat]

17. I have the same aversion to outside manipulation.

I admit that I had even developed less openness for 'commonplace' abortion after my regression therapy from the womb, birth process and babyhood....as well as my strong feelings/experiences around the spirituality of the moment of conception.

When I was pregnant with both of my children (from the first moments of knowing) I really felt intensely that I had conceived and was carrying 2 souls that had chosen me, and that I could be of great service to them.

But now I have come to understand more the co-creation aspects of it all, that it isn't just the will of one person guiding life experiences. And I do absolutely support safe and rare abortion rights, even though I cannot help but see it as a violent act. One that I might have chosen in my younger years, and an option I defend (though might not advise) for my daughter if she wanted this choice.

DemEx

[tanyev]

23. Y'know, I have never understood why a huge pro-contraception

movement hasn't come along to supersede pro-life vs. pro-choice. If all of that money, time, and emotion were focused on making people aware of conscious choices BEFORE a child is conceived, abortions would become very rare.

[DemExpat]

24. People get stuck in either camp IMO....

"Pro-Lifers" against abortion, period, and Abortion Rights defenders rightly wanting to fight to defend hard-earned gains.

You are right, you hear so little about excellent campaigning for better contraception these days.
Once the pill was available, the debate went into abortion issues.

DemEx

[cassiepriam]

19. Funny I can't stand manipulating body things like that either.

For example, I think plastic surgery is great for others
but I would be horrified to do it to myself. I cannot even
stand the idea of putting contacts into my eyes. Maybe it is a kind
of control issue for me.

LOL sounds like spirit was going to get the baby out with the storm :)

[stellanoir]

21. okay cass. . .

Do we think this kid will LOVE or LOATHE spectator sports. . .?

http://www.democraticunderground.com/discuss/duboard.php?az=view_all&address=364x3175417

Yikes.

[cassiepriam]

22. Princess Di said that Charles made her induce labor so he could play

in his polo matches.

In answer to your question Stella, the kid in question better at least pretend to love sports or s/he ain't gonna make it in this family. :(

PS With their luck they are going to have a kid who doesn't know the bears from the colts from the dolphins.