Gamers are sometimes their worst enemies

[nadinbrzezinski]

ok here is a true tale, the board requires you to sign in... but if you want I will give you links to proper threads.

It is a local board fer local gamers, and it stands to reason that a locally based game designer might want to talk to local gamers.

So poll is posted... what makes a PNP RPG good for you? Discussion is going fine until our local grognard uses the following words:

And yes if there is no combat I feel like I am growing a vagina....

I confront him, for his misogyny... and believe it or not I got in trouble for doing that with the Mods... oh his friend posted after that, well it like he is being a pussy... I asked this other person if he knows what the term means.

To make an ugly incident short, I left that board... I do not tolerate mysoginy.

Now here is my question, after looking at my hubby play DnD online... and WoTC (and Atari) did not place any chain mail bikinis anywhere, and I have noticed a very different environment here... is this a problem with PNP players, older PNP players, or just the local cave trolls?

And yes, this is a very serious question, for this was yet another example of gamers are their own worst enemies at times.

[NewHampshireDem]

1. Too many 12 year olds and too many guys stuck in a delayed adolescence

I think most of the stupidity is the result of about 10% of the gamers. I play GuildWars and many multiplayer FPS's and find that the vast majority of the gamers out there would not tolerate such stupidity--and that's why the best moderated/admined games and servers fill up so fast. I find that what happens then is that you get the two extremes--the tightly run ships on one end, where no quarter is given to the smacktards and the servers overrun with smacktards on the other end. The few visigoths that are out there find each other and the places they are welcome pretty quickly.

Long story short, any place where I'm uncomfortable with the lack of mods/admins, I don't go back to. Problem solved. Arguing with jackasses only makes it worse (eg. Bill O'Reilly).

[Ready4Change]

2. More a problem with individuals than with culture.

I've run into misogynists in all my pasttimes, not just gaming. It seems some guys feel the need to express themselves through denigrating females, no matter what they are involved in. And it plays well to many weak willed, sexually insecure males as well, so you'll often run into tight, dirty little packs of such.

They are usually a small subsection, although I imagine that, in smaller towns, they might be all there is. Hope that's the rare case.

[TheBaldyMan]

3. sad to say you get them on all online games

as well as pnp games and sports from football to whist.

There is a continuing move in online games to curb the worst excesses. NHDem mentioned GuildWars but that comes after a great many systems where every unsocial vice was disrupting the majority's enjoyment of an innocent game. Remember Diablo anyone? There could be a deteriation of everyones behavior on some systems as you had to adopt the worst offenders playing styles just to survive.

The general rules are :
If the is an exploit it will be exploited.
If there are cheats they will be used.
If it is possible groups of high-levels will prey on lone lower level characters.
If all else fails expect abusive text messages, usually with an explicit sexual content.

IMO it isn't the game that's at fault it the disfunctional fools who disrupt others enjoyment. They are not very good at the game. They get creamed in a fair fight. Couple stupidity with immaturity and behaviour can be much worse than a PnP game. Also being online gives a level of anonimity that will be abused by cabals of bad gamers. They do seem to congregate because they tolerate behaviour that would get you kicked or banned from a regular group or guild.

I played D&D as a kid and I assert that players in the flesh can act just as petulant and spoilt as online gamers.

[Occulus]

6. That's what the beauty of GW is, though

I've seen it happen over and over: the cocky, arrogant SOBs who just care about "getting through the mission" rather than enjoying the game are often the ones who will join a party just to run through the maps. They are usually wiped out when they dash ahead of everyone else into a mass of enemies, thereby committing a sort of suicide.

Our guild usually just lets those people die of their own actions.... we much prefer strategy.

Back on point: I think some of the problem might be a marked lack of female players to rein in the abusive jerks. Having voice chat really helps eliminate this, or so it seems to me: it's harder to insult someone in an online game when they can talk directly back to you. You're not as anonymous in such a situation.

[TheBaldyMan]

7. I must admit I am as guilty of use of abusive language as

anyone, there is no excuse, even if s/o is being a complete idiot or acting like they've never played the game before. I try to rein in my behaviour but keep snapping. Especially as you don't know how old some gamers are. I'd disagree about the number of female MMOPRG players, theres probably more than you think, they just get the wrong kind of attention if s/o finds out they are a girl in RL. I know - I tell people in RL I'm a bald man in my forties and I still get weird offers when I play a female avatar.

btw if you are ever playing GW and a party member starts to swear in capslock - that would be me.

[nadinbrzezinski]

4. Well the funny thing is

I tried to also deal with it by going to the mods and going WTF? Over... apparently the only thing they will intervene on is on personal attacks.

Well I guess all the racial slurs I pointed out that apparently can be used, should and they believe that the members will take care of it.

They are surprised that I developed the wrong opinion of their board. I guess they are not seeing the problem... a misogynistic comment IS a personal attack

Well it is good to know it is not limited to PNP... now anybody writing a Masters or PhD thesis? Might be interesting to explore what drives people to that attitude. Too bad I wrote my MA a while back and it was in history anyway, but a sociology one would be fascinating, or for that matter, a Poli Sci one.

Yep serious question, and I truly appreciate the serious answer. Trust me, I did not get the same from the board Administrators or Moderators.

[NewHampshireDem]

5. Being a mod is largely a matter of personal preferences in most places

When I was running a server for Day of Defeat, I had to work to develop a fairly comprehensive manual for members of the clan who had mod/admin privs on the server and on our board. Getting everyone on the same page was a full-time job ... and these were all really great people. There was constant dialogue among us all about which rules were rules and which were just guidelines, and where the line should be drawn. To be honest, it was often draining--no one becomes a mod/admin because they want to monitor the playground; they do it because they want to have a place to play.

[nadinbrzezinski]

8. Yes it is but once yuo allow that kind of language

you loose control, at least in my opinion, At the very least, yuo loose posters