PP Update, Many Thanks, & A Bothersome Question

[Sapphocrat]

PP being, of course, The Progressive Pages:

http://www.globalblogs.com/progressivepages/index.html

First, a huge, heartfelt THANK YOU to everyone who has been contributing listings to the Progressive Pages. In the few short weeks the site has been up, we have 393 entries in 218 categories (and I see a dozen or more waiting in the queue, and I have about 20 entries to add myself today).

393 businesses/companies is not bad! Especially when you consider that a good many of them are progressive alternatives to the bright-red, repub-supporting businesses we all want to avoid. (Have you checked out the alternatives to Microsoft products from the Mozilla Foundation yet?)

So, we're growing, and I'm very encouraged by our rate of growth, especially after the predictable slowdown over Thanksgiving weekend. We're back up to around 500 hits a day (REALLY good for a brand-new site!), due in no small part to DUers spreading the word on other forums and on mailing lists, and by linking to PP from your own Web sites. Thank you! Please keep up the momentum!!

fudge_striped_cookays, especially, deserves some sort of medal -- in addition to adding entries just about every single day, she has REALLY been getting the word out... fudge is our greatest evangelist! :headbang:

I've been in the background doing a monstrous amount of research (when I'm not trying to spiff up the site itself), double-checking new entries, etc. ... And of course I've been keeping a close eye on where our traffic is coming from, and what the world out there is saying about us. (Oh, Phil Shore/Titian, whatever you're calling yourself these days! You just keep on dissing us over on the Bartcop and Smirking Chimp forums all you like -- AFAIC, all publicity is good publicity... and you're sending us LOTS of of traffic. Thanks! Although I would be careful about calling anything a "scam," unless you're really dying for someone to sic your ISP -- or a lawyer -- on your whiney butt. LOL)

Which brings me to a question that's been bothering me for the past 24 hours, concerning a comment on the Bartcop forums. I told myself it was nothing -- but that if it was still bothering me a day later, I would bring it to DU and ask you all what you thought about it.

In a discussion thread about the choosetheblue site, a poster mentions PP, quotes one of my DU posts, and then concludes:

"neither site is 100% accurate on how we should choose to support and who to not, but they are useful sources of information."

Does anything about that statement jump out at you the way it did at me?

It's not the "accuracy" question, but the bit about how "neither site is 100% accurate on how we should choose to support and who to not".

I envision the Progressive Pages as a resource to (as I wrote on the PP "help" page) "help forward-thinking people make educated judgments about where they do and do not want to spend their money."

I don't think ANY site, anywhere, should TELL people which businesses they should and shouldn't patronize (dedicated boycott sites aside). Sure, obviously, the PP isn't at all coy about the fact that we want people to support "blue" businesses and to starve "red" ones. But the bottom line is, we present information from both sides -- and to my way of thinking, it is up to the reader/consumer to make the ultimate decision about whether or not it's worth patronizing a business that, say, contributes to a PAC that spends 51% on Dems and 49% on Repubs... or whatever.

For example, I just did an entry last night on the Atlantis Casino-Resort in Reno. In the 2004 election cycle, the Atlantis owners contributed (by my calculations) 59% to Dems and 41% to Repubs. This makes them "bluer," but certainly not blue. They don't have a nondiscrimination policy -- does this make them "redder"? ... but they're on record as contributing non-monetary resources to HIV/AIDS causes -- does this make them "bluer"?

AFAIC, the Atlantis is neither red nor blue, but right in the middle.

There was a discussion here about Trader Joe's, which inspired me to research TJ's for its PP entry (yes, that's one of mine). My personal opinion is that it's fine and dandy to shop at TJ's... but my opinion came after considering all the data I found (and, I hope, presented in a comprehensive way).

You know, Open Secrets is one of a dozen sites I rely on heavily for campaign-donation information... and while it's obvious the folks at the Center for Public Integrity are as dead-set against bolstering up the military-industrial complex as I am, in the end OS presents the raw data as is -- you can read OS's many anti-red articles as you like, but in the end, it's up to you to decide what the raw data means to you. I assume CPI assumes, as I do, that people are smart enough to draw their own conclusions, and make a final judgment about whether or not they're ever going to buy Certo Pectin again (because it's made by Kraft Foods, which is owned by Altria/Philip Morris), or buy another car from GM (which makes Hummers), or watch CNN (because even though it's biased, at least it's not part of the Murdoch conglomerate).

Even when it's blatantly obvious that a business/company is against everything democratic and decent in this country (I'm thinking, oh, Raytheon, right down to the Triple Creek Ranch in Montana), I don't think anyone should be in the business of mandating whether or not people "support this business and boycott that one." Well, OK, if you asked me, I would advise you never buy Certo Pectin again... But it's just that we are not supposed to be SHEEP, who need to be told what to do and what not to do. I honestly believe that anyone who calls him/herself liberal/progressive recognizes, by default, the myriad shades of gray between black and white -- or in this case, the myriad shades of purple between red and blue. (Heck, that's why visitors can rate companies on a 1 to 10 / blue-to-red scale!)

OK, that said -- it was just one comment, on one message board -- but it's been bothering me that anyone would expect a straight "support/boycott" list. This is not a black/white, red/blue world -- and to think it is strikes me as utterly... well, un-democratic!

Thoughts?

In any case, thanks for letting me get this off my chest. :)

[DemBones DemBones]

1. I agree with you that it's necessary to use all

the info you can get about a company, not just its donations but its employment policies, especially for those who give a roughly 50-50 split to Dems and GOP. But I think we can all judge for ourselves what to do about companies that give over 80% to one party, depending, of course, on what party that happens to be. ;-)

I wouldn't worry too much about Dems marching in lockstep on this. You know what they say about herding cats.!

[NMDemDist2]

2. thanks for all your work

:yourock:

and there will always be somebody to nay say.... tis the nature of the human animal

joke em if they can't take a screw ya know?

[NMDemDist2]

3. here's an addition for Grocery in Arizona

Basha's is owned by a democrat (he's even run for Gov here on the Dem ticket-- Eddie Basha)

is this the right way to help?

[fudge stripe cookays]

4. Got em!

Check out the PP link. I added em myself!

If you have any more information to add to their entry, you can put them in the comments section to give folks more data to help them choose.

If you have any more just like that, let us know!

And I definitely think we're just giving people the information they need to make an informed choice based on their own criteria. To some people, donations are their main thing. To others, sweatshop labor use or pet cruelty are deal breakers as well. I think we're simply doing our best to get all the info and put it in one place.

Thanks Sapph! :yourock: too! Thanks for the compliment! It's a labor of love!
FSC

[NMDemDist2]

5. i forgot one, I have researched the owners and can't find anything

political on them either way

they have an extensive natural foods dept and lots of homeopathic stuff and are offering homeopathic flu shots for $20

Sprouts Farmer's Markets
www.sprouts.com
several Phoenix/Scottsdale locations and growing....

[fudge stripe cookays]

6. This is all I could find....

but this is the old guy, and he's retired. I'm not sure how much pull he still has.

Grr...it won't paste for some reason:

Henry Boney Boney's
$500 National Republican Senatorial Committee
$250 National Republican Congressional Committee
$250 National Republican Congressional Committee

But this is great info! See? Never been to Arizona, so there's plenty of stuff you know about that Sappho and I might never know without you telling us.

Keep it coming!
FSC

[NMDemDist2]

7. Henry was the dad who actually ran for office and the one son

sued the AZ guys over the family name (sounds Repug to me)

the guys here :shrug: who knows, but did you check their website? the stores are so cool! and I quote




A fresh approach to "old time" values
At Sprouts Farmers Market you will not find supermarket items such as Coca Cola or Best Foods Mayonnaise, but you will find a large selection of healthy, unique items. Our large variety of bulk foods allows our customers the opportunity to buy the exact amount they desire. Sprouts features all natural beef and chicken with no added chemicals or artificial ingredients at supermarket prices, specialty and organic produce from local farmers at great prices, a large health food selection, beer and wine, and a giant vitamin selection.