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A post in GDP asking Edwards Democrats who they support.

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balantz Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Apr-30-08 02:00 PM
Original message
A post in GDP asking Edwards Democrats who they support.
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balantz Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Apr-30-08 02:40 PM
Response to Original message
1. How silly of me.
Edited on Wed Apr-30-08 02:51 PM by balantz
I was expecting too much honesty perhaps. And the overwhelming Obama "support" (for lack of a better word) has I think scared many others off from DU. So the poll is what it is. There are a few interesting comments by genuine Edwards Democrats. Thanks for participating.
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chimpymustgo Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Apr-30-08 04:24 PM
Response to Reply #1
2. Sorry about that poll. But the thread was pretty interesting.
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balantz Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Apr-30-08 04:47 PM
Response to Reply #2
3. Yeah, I think the poll got ganged by non-Edwards people.
But I agree that there are some interesting comments.
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balantz Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu May-01-08 01:46 PM
Response to Original message
4. According to that poll I posted there are now 220 previous Edwards Democrats
who have now gone to Obama. Give me a break! If their candidate is doing so well, why do they have to bolster his support falsely? Is it because they know deep down that there is no there there? Sshh! Don't say it out loud...the Obama train just may derail at any moment now...:nuke:
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redqueen Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu May-01-08 05:19 PM
Response to Reply #4
5. ...
Edited on Thu May-01-08 05:19 PM by redqueen
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balantz Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu May-01-08 05:21 PM
Response to Reply #5
6. Well then, perhaps they were all telling the truth. n/t
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redqueen Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu May-01-08 05:26 PM
Response to Reply #6
7. Thank you.
Edited on Thu May-01-08 05:32 PM by redqueen
After the repeated insinuations of the results being meaningless because they were nothing but a bunch of lying Obama supporters, I sincerely appreciate that.
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balantz Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu May-01-08 05:50 PM
Response to Reply #7
8. No problem. I had forgotten that there were so many Edwards supporters back then.
Edited on Thu May-01-08 06:16 PM by balantz
I try to not be an asshole. I just have my reservations for either of the remaining campaigns. I don't think they truly represent the American people with a truly progressive agenda. But I think the "powers that be" have guided the situation to where we are left with these two remaining candidates. Also, there is a lot of unnecessary nastiness "out there" which lends to my opinions that I mostly voice here in this forum.

But as for posting in this forum, I reserve the right (privelage) to voice my opinion freely, even if Obamabots and Clintonbots might take offense. Besides expressing frustration and tearing into the remaining candidates and their supporters, we do discuss topics of importance that are generally much more to the left than what people discuss "out there". There are a lot of important issues that are not being addressed, like poverty for instance, or predatory corporate control of our governmnet and our political process.
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redqueen Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu May-01-08 05:56 PM
Response to Reply #8
9. Your sig, though...
Edited on Thu May-01-08 05:59 PM by redqueen
that's not directed "at either candidate"'s supporters.

I don't think any campaign (with a realistic chance of winning) has truly represented the American people with a progressive agenda, ever. And yes, of course the powers that be are steering things the way they want them to go.

The nastiness, yes... it is unnecessary. It is what it is. I understand being unwilling to participate, or being fed up with it... what I *don't* understand is the desire to pin it on one group of supporters, and use that as a way to actually make the nastiness worse (by unfairly maligning one candidate's supporters).

Good luck getting through the rest of this nightmare without joining the melee as I do on occasion, but please note that I'm not going to lie to you and act like I don't, or try to act like I'm a "saint" (one of the terms so frequently used to goad Obama's supporters... even here, in the forum where people are reportedly fair... I wonder if there are any threads here calling Clinton a corporate whore... hmmmm).

Peace. :)


edited to add "(with a realistic chance of winning)" to the second paragraph... cause duh... Kucinich!
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balantz Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu May-01-08 06:54 PM
Response to Reply #9
11. My sig line,
Edited on Thu May-01-08 06:55 PM by balantz
"LEMMING-LIKE LUNACY IT'S A HOAX FOLKS", refers to supporters of any campaign (but one in particular) where the supporters (some, not all) have become blinded to anything but an image of their candidate being, well, almost messiah-like. Thinking their candidate will do everything absolutely righteous and save the world is lunacy. I think it is at best dumb, and at worst dangerous. I think the candidate "worshipped" thusly should not ride that advantage completely, but has a responsibility to keep reality in the picture and keep his/her campaign, and supporters "on the ground."

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Two Americas Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri May-02-08 03:53 PM
Response to Reply #9
19. hiding
Edited on Fri May-02-08 03:59 PM by Two Americas
Many Obama supporters (and no doubt supporters of other candidates at various times) are hiding behind Obama. "We are the side of truth and righteouness - just look at our candidate - so how dare you counter us in any way?" Any criticisms of their behavior are characterized as attacks on Obama. Then it is assumed that what a campaign is about is engaging in an all out food fight with anyone not onboard, and that gets projected onto others. This makes it almost impossible to talk about anything.

You may not be fully aware of your zealous partisanship, and then think that anyone objecting to that is "goading" you, or merely advancing another candidate and tearing down Obama supporters and therefore Obama by doing that.

What you don't know is that you could drop the battle, lose nothing, and all of a sudden those whom you now think are antagonizing or goading you would become just normal human beings who are actually pretty nice and are more than willing to have constructive conversations with you. You would also find that the criticisms of the Obama campaign and Obama supporters are no threat to Obama's success, or at very least no threat to the success of the ideas and plans that Obama symbolizes for his supporters - the opposite is actually true.

But first you have to "put down the gun" - the all out 24 hour a day sales and marketing effort for your candidate. Until then, anything any of us say that varies from the Obama promotion script will be seen by you as "the other side." I don't want to argue against Obama. I want to argue against people forcing us to be on one side or the other in a destructive and boring food fight, and that is at this time being caused most frequently and aggressively from people who happen to be Obama supporters. So long as you "hear" that as arguing against Obama, we are in the same trap and you will keep getting the same results - people will be pissed off at you. Then you hear that anti-Obama and step up your efforts, and piss people off more, and then blame them for the "divisiveness" which makes them more stubborn and resistant to you.
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Catchawave Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu May-01-08 06:49 PM
Response to Original message
10. I just kicked it again ... good thread
Edwards still stirs passion and I support your message :D

I miss that passion :cry:
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balantz Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu May-01-08 09:50 PM
Response to Reply #10
17. Thanks Catchawave.
:)

I miss that passion too :cry:
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Two Americas Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu May-01-08 07:02 PM
Response to Original message
12. oh the hell with it
I am going to post my uncensored observations and opinions, from a pm I sent last night.

This NOT an attack on Obama, and is not an attack on all Obama supporters. This what I see in the Obama movement, and what I think holds his candidacy back, if anything, and puts us in a very weak position going into the general. I would say the same thing about what I am seeing regardless of what the cause was and whether or not I agreed with that cause.

They are crossing another threshold into madness tonight

A new threshold has been crossed tonight. An Obama supporter is being attacked, and for what? For having insufficiently strong beliefs in the personality of Obama and the cause of promoting that personality as the only answer, the only solution? And being attacked with the same venom and bile as they would be had they aggressively opposed Obama - ridicule, character assassination, abusive language, insults. Promoting and idealizing this personality is to be seen as synonymous with everything from smiting the evil ones to saving the country, and I suppose saving our very souls, as well. Anyone expressing any heresy to this belief, and the belief in the power of this belief, is to be ostracized and targeted, ridiculed and purged from the circle if possible. It is much easier and more accepted to express doubts about one's faith in the context of the most rigid, fundamentalist and conservative church then it is to express doubts about the Obama movement here.

This is a religious revival movement. It has all of the features of a religious movement, and the adherents are behaving and speaking in the same intolerant and self-righteous way that true believers do in any movement of this kind. Since this is a religious movement that people were not born into, it is by definition a cult. The language being used, directing people to the "word" - be it telling people to "go read the book" or "go read the website" and the inability of the followers to put it into their own words, are also closely parallel what commonly happens in a religious movement.

You accurately identified and described this very early, ClericJohnPreston. I don't think there is any stopping it, and I think the Obama movement will seize control of the party and purge all heretics. There will be no way for many of us to work within this movement, because we will not in good conscience be able to knuckle under to a group that tolerates no doubt, no wavering, that demands absolute belief without variation or exception, and that launches into pack behavior against any whom are seen as outsiders and attacks them.

The list of outsiders grows longer and longer, and as of tonight includes any and all failing to express the proper reverence and adulation. This thread is the harbinger of worse to come, and now having crossed this threshold - where even believers will be tested on their beliefs - I think there is no turning back. Obama believers now think that any turning back from this path is tantamount to surrendering to evil and losing their souls.

Clinton supporters have mostly been run off - it is exhausting trying to speak in this environment even for those of us who are not Clinton supporters, and one gets worn down and depressed after a while fending off the same insults and attacks again and again. It also is probably not psychologically very healthy, since spending too much time in an environment where up is down can wear away at a person's rationality no matter how strong they are, and the relentless pressure of the howling mob is difficult to resist.

Nothing less than groveling at the altar and begging forgiveness for one's sins - one's offenses against the admired one - will do, apparently, and all are suspect of carrying the seeds of dangerous thoughts and can then be attacked as war mongerers or racists or Republican agents, or God knows what else. I saw Clinton blamed for the rise in gas prices tonight, and also a post linking her to the Nazi party. Being a supporter of Obama is insufficient - HOW one is a supporter then comes into play, and the way one must be in order to be an accepted supporter is to adhere very strictly to the script. One must see no wrong in the favored one, or even hint that one finds any faults with him, and one must also agree with the mob as to exactly who the enemies are, and how these enemies are to be detected, and one must also agree and follow through on how we properly scourge and stone the heretics - the right incantations must be used.
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cornermouse Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu May-01-08 09:09 PM
Response to Reply #12
13. flip side of the neo-cons.
They're doing the exact same thing the neo-cons did back at the beginning of the Reagan era.
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balantz Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu May-01-08 09:31 PM
Response to Reply #13
14. Maybe we should call them "neodems"?
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balantz Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu May-01-08 09:44 PM
Response to Reply #14
15. Or better yet, "neolibs".
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cornermouse Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu May-01-08 09:48 PM
Response to Reply #14
16. Strange as it may sound, I want my vote to matter.
By that I mean, I want to cast my vote for someone who I think will do a good job of running the country or in this case, post-Bush restore the country. Voting for someone only because I think they can win doesn't qualify as a vote that counts.

I will never understand why Edwards dropped out. I don't think Obama has what it takes and I don't think either Obama or Clinton will be able to buck the people who are behind the scenes pulling strings. I keep wondering how or even if we're going to be able to survive the unbridled greed the oil companies are so proudly showing us as they wipe us out financially. The media talks about the lousy CEOs that we have running the companies but they call them bad because of stock options, not because they made bad decisions.

I just don't know.
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balantz Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu May-01-08 09:53 PM
Response to Reply #16
18. The corporate-elite have no borders or national patriotism.
hey can go where they wish whether or not we all go broke and hungry here.
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unc70 Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat May-03-08 02:13 AM
Response to Reply #12
20. I posted in that other thread last night with a lot of my own frustrations
I haven't posted much for a while since Edwards suspended, but since PA I have lost my self-control a few times and posted something, often related to what I see in NC or to "educate" someone who I deemed clueless. Clinton and Obama were among my least-favorite candidates from the beginning and until Clinton won PA, I thought I might not have to chose between them and would just vote for the nominee in November.

I already knew a lot about Clinton, so I started looking more-closely at Obama after Iowa and posted some of what I found when Edwards was still in the race. After that, I discussed privately details of my growing concerns with Obama but refrained from publicly mentioning anything not already widely discussed on the net.

I have reluctantly decided to vote for Clinton because I think the possibility of the Obama campaign imploding before November and harming all of us is just too great a risk. The most-damaging effect of Rev. Wright on Obama does not involve race or religion; it is the serious erosion of Obama's credibility. His initial claim that he was unaware of Wright's claims, etc. after attending his church for twenty years started the erosion. This past weekend caused very serious damage. Even one more revelation or event could be enough to begin a rapid drop in support.

If I had to guess the next problem, I would go with the Robert Blackwell money laundering that the LA Times exposed this week or with Obama's mentor Frank in Hawaii now identified as Frank Marshall Davis. Anyone else following these two?
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balantz Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat May-03-08 06:12 AM
Response to Reply #20
21. I wasn't, but will now.
Please enlighten.
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balantz Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat May-03-08 06:41 AM
Response to Reply #21
22. Interesting about Obama's communist mentor, Davis.
I actually like the communist mentor stuff, it gave me something to like about Obama.

But the republinuts won't.

I found the Times article about Blackwell but haven't read it yet.

I would guess that these two items will be some serious coffin nails.

Why are we in this situation? Is it all a set up?

I sometimes find it hard to believe this political horror show is happening.
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