Chimpy's rumored drinking and the 12 Step promotion it's spawning

[Hello_Kitty]

The National Enquirer article has led to all these people appearing in the news talking about how * never admitted he's an alcoholic and isn't in a "program". Some of these people are therapists and psychologists and it's really aggravating to hear them parroting the belief that 12 step programs are this amazingly effective cure for all addictions. They are not. AA and similar programs actually have a worse relapse rate than using no type of treatment.

I have some unfortunate experience with 12 step programs. I come from an alcoholic family and thought I could find help in a couple of the "co-dependent" groups. What I found was basically a religious cult where you were told to admit you were powerless and could only find respite through submitting your will to a supernatural being. Supposedly you could be a non-believer but I was hassled and ultimately ostracized when I refused to toe the line.

To me, and probably many in this group, there is little difference between a drunk getting "saved" by Jesus or going to one of these religious 12 step cults. Well, there is one difference. A judge won't force you to join a fundie church to cure your drinking (at least not yet) but people are coerced by the courts into AA.

Just had to share that because it really irritates me. :banghead:

[beam me up scottie]

1. Same here.

Al-Anon is a cruel joke, a ruse to get you in the door.

[Marnieworld]

2. Ditto

12 Step groups are ineffective cults. I have also had some experience with trying to deal with alcoholic family members. I love how they say your "higher power" could mean anything and that it was secular. Of course they say this and open and close the meeting with The Lord's Prayer.

I really really hate how 12 Step groups have the reputation as the only effective way of quitting anything. There are other options and the groups really aren't effective. I really hate it when people are sent to them by a judge after a DUI because of the obvious church-state issues.

Thank goodness there are scientists at work at this moment trying to decipher why people drink and how they can stop it all by studying the brain and devising medical treatments. One day there will be no alcoholism because of these people not some smoke-filled church basement where people are chanting catch phrases.

Don't. Get. Me. Started.

[Hello_Kitty]

8. And I don't know which is worse

The ones for the addicts/alcoholics, which IMO worsen those problems - "One drink is too many and thousand isn't enough" "You're gonna DIE if you walk out these doors!" (power of suggestion leading to self-fulfilling prophecy, anyone?) - or the horror they put family members through who are unfortunate enough to get caught up in the "co-dependent" bullshit lie. I kid you not, I actually heard a woman who was being beaten by her husband told to "look at your part in it" and that she should have a hot meal waiting for him when he got home. OMFG! I was thinking, she doesn't need 12 steps, she needs a social worker and a good divorce attorney.

[LeftyMom]

3. I agree

and after 5+ years in NA, most doing extra work (H&I/PI, coordinating the hotline, multiple sponsees) and really structuring her life around the program my Mother came to the same realization.

[Kolesar]

4. You can find a recovery program that is not AA at the UU

A local Unitarian Universalist congregation here sponsors an alcohol recovery program that is not religiously based. I saw it posted in the paper. No, I did not go. ;) Somewhere in the UU belief system, they can accomodate members who actually do not believe in a supreme being. I guess you just go there on Sundays in nice clothes and talk about the kids and the Browns game.

[onager]

5. Here are a few more...

...for anyone who may need them for relatives, friends, etc.

Women For Sobriety: http://www.womenforsobriety.org
...Women for Sobriety groups are non-religious and the meetings also differ from those of AA in that they prohibit the use of tobacco, caffeine and sugar.


LifeRing Recovery:http://www.unhooked.com/index.htm
Non-religious self-help recovery network for individuals who seek group support to achieve abstinence from alcohol and other addictive drugs.

Rational Recovery: http://www.rational.org/

Secular Organizations For Sobriety (SOS): http://www.secularsobriety.org/

[Hello_Kitty]

9. There's also moderation

Yes, I know the founder of Moderation Management had a drunk driving accident and all that. But programs that teach problem drinkers to cut down have been successful in Europe, though that doesn't even seem to be considered here in the U.S. Our model seems to be that if you exhibit any problem drinking whatsoever, then you are by definition a chronic alcoholic who can only be saved by a lifelong commitment to abstinence a religious dogma. Even if you're a 19 year old lightweight who overindulged at a few frat parties. This extreme Puritanical view does not lead to effective solutions. What I think it creates is a bunch of guilt-riddled drunks and addicts. Like our current pResident.

[Hello_Kitty]

7. Glad to hear it. Unitarians are pretty cool.

My stepmother, who was one of the coolest people I ever had the privilege to know, belonged to a UU congregation. When she died of cancer in 1988 the memorial was a Unitarian service. It was the only funeral I've ever been to that truly celebrated the LIFE of the person who died and where you left feeling positive and hopeful. She actually had a drinking problem for a while and went to AA. I was too young to remember but she didn't stick around the program too long and I sensed she thought it was a bunch of bullshit.

[BiggJawn]

6. Anybody ever hear of a Juvenile "treatment program" called STRAIGHT?

Talk about a cult...
On top of all the 12-step bullshit, they tried to brainwash you into believing that if you didn't do things EXACTLY as they said, your kid would die.

We used to have to drive 600 miles on fridays to participate in the "required" weekly brainwashing sessions. I had to stand there and take fat-assed UAW-types who worked at The Rouge who made in a MONTH what I made in a year call me a cheap-assed mother-fucker because I could not and would not put my gas money in the Magic Hat when they passed it around.

I used to drink a lot. After my last marriage went to hell, I climbed into the bottle for a year, and when I climbed out, I found my career in the toilet and nothing to keep me in my city, so I found a new job in a new city with a new partner.

Didn't take no 12-step cult nonsense, nor did Billy Graham put his fingers in my ears and yell 'Out, you foul drunken spirits"..Oh, wait that's Ernest Angely, isn't it?
Anyway, you get the idea.

[Hello_Kitty]

10. Yes, I have heard of it and it's scary.

You will DIE if you don't do it our way. That's the basis of 12 step bullshit and most religions.

As for you, your story is a perfect example of how a lot of problems are circumstantial. Change your circumstances, and the problems disappear, or at least lessen. Amazing how it happens that way. But the "take a pill to feel better" pharma-complex doesn't want you to realize that.

[BiggJawn]

11. True, "self medication" isn't needed after the problem's solved.

Perhaps some people never see an end to their problem.

I still have trouble with the way that marriage ended, and the emotional abuse I put up with, but it's not bad enough that I feel the need to go back into the bottle... Been 10 years....