I have a question

[Gelliebeans]

I was watching the certification of the vote in Ohio on CSPAN today and they offered a benediction at the conclusion of the proceedings.

Then I watched the certification of Pennsylvania's vote and they started this with a prayer.

As I don't normally watch proceedings for other states I was wondering if these prayers were legal as to the separation of church and state?

any idea?

[Philostopher]

1. I think they're common practice.

How common I don't know, but I'm certainly not surprised to hear they do that in Ohio. I think that's 'just one of those things' that nobody feels compelled to raise a stink about, that's been going on for decades or even centuries, customary.

But, hey -- if you think an 'out' agnostic or atheist could possibly get elected to office in Ohio, dream on. Nobody's going to complain about it because they have to win elections in a state like Ohio. We're one of the few states that has something like 'in God we trust' or 'with God all things are possible' on our state emblem.

A few years back, if I remember correctly, somebody started a movement to get the motto changed because he felt what it said was exclusive to some people who live in this state, and I imagine he had to move to Jakarta to get away from the screaming horde with the torches and pitchforks.

My husband and I made the joke that Taft can't take 'God' out of the Ohio state motto -- it's how he does his financial planning. It's all 'faith based,' since he clearly doesn't bother to think about it!

[progressoid]

2. Yep, as soon as I saw that I turned off the TV. I knew I would just get

pissed off watching it. I don't remember which state I was watching but they did a little pledging to the flag, followed by a prayer.
:puke:

Certainly it's not legal, but I doubt we will see that 'habit' ending in the near future. However, I'm optimistic that it will come to an end before my death. Many courtrooms no longer require you to say "so help me god" or use a bible when being sworn in. I think as we become a more diverse nation (and hopefully more enlightened), these antiquated practices will fade.
At least that's what I keep telling myself - otherwise I would be beating my head against the wall in frustration.

[Philostopher]

3. Hey, they can have me swear on a bible to testify if they want.

It sure wouldn't guarantee I'd tell the truth. I could swear on 'The Wizard Of Oz' and mean it just as much, since I believe the whole bible is an allegory anyway. In fact, I think I'd be more inclined to tell the truth if they had me swear on 'Gulliver's Travels' -- I think that one holds more literal truth than most of what I've read in the bible!

[Gelliebeans]

4. I suppose

it's just another divisive measure that has become common practice to exclude a certain amount of the population.

I get very frustrated when Christians say that they are the majority and have been persecuted by the atheists of the world and so they are entitled to take the country back in order to restore moral beliefs.

PULEEZE they have ALWAYS owned the establishment and they have abused it more than any other group. It is the non-believer or minority religion that has had to suffer with their righteousness.

They simply can't understand or won't understand the separation of church and state.

I guess I have to ask myself, "If I wanted to change things I have to be willing to go head to head with these people so that they follow the law."
Unfortunately, as we have seen in the past, the ridicule and backlash is severe for those that voice an opposing opinion.

I think things will be hard for non-believers until a majority of our country get sick and tired of the fundies running the show.
I only hope that will happen soon.