So with this latest round of news about priests raping children...

[laconicsax]

Anyone else notice that, once again, religious posters avoid the subject?

It really speaks volumes about those who scream bloody murder when an atheist has an opinion but remain silent when more evidence that the RCC is a criminal organization committed to the rape and torture of children.

[realisticphish]

1. i am american

and proud of it. Yet, when we fuck up, i am right there calling out our shit. I don't shift blame, or accuse this one person or that.

Why don't we see the same with Christians? Or at the very least Catholics. Of ALL people, they should be the most outraged. Rather then circle the wagons, I would be more concerned with cleaning house. The more they stammer and shift blame, the weaker any eventual action taken will be seen. Swift, decisive action could have blocked a lot of criticism of Catholic hierarchy

Of course, there are probably DU catholics who ARE pissed off, etc. But the majority are silent, or at least not speaking above a whisper

[Toasterlad]

6. For the Life of Me, I Can't Understand How Anyone Could Remain a Catholic Since These Issues

have come to light.

I've seen their desperate, convoluted attempts to separate "their" church from "THE" church. But if it isn't enough that ALL catholic churches are misogynistic and homophobic (don't think yours is? How many women priests at your parish? How many openly gay priests?), how do you justify contributing money to any organization that uses that money to protect and defend child rapers?

What an appalling lack of self-respect it must take to call oneself a catholic.

[Warpy]

8. The elephant in the room that nobody wants to mention

is the priest shortage that caused those old boys to protect their pedophiles at all costs, no matter how many children they destroyed. The priest shortage is a direct result of their policy of celibacy for priests, based on greed and the fear that a wealthy priest would leave an estate to his children and not to Mother Rome.

No believer seems capable of bringing these issues to the forefront.

The plaintive cry is that other religious officials do it too.

It seems Catholics have fallen into a silent, orderly line behind papal infallibility.

You want outrage, read the European press.

[trotsky]

2. Or when they do speak up, it's a Bill Donohue imitation.

A whole lotta knee-jerk attacking the accusers, blaming the victims, accusing all involved of "Catholic bashing." Ah, those poor poor followers of the world's largest individual religion. So persecuted.

[onager]

22. Hey, stop reading my mind!

http://www.democraticunderground.com/discuss/duboard.php?az=view_all&address=214x242590#242664

Just FEEL the Xian love from the guy I was responding to...

Id Love to do a Video to tell you to Fuck off. Im a Catholic and My Church (St Marys Star of the Sea) In Oceanside CA has done a lot of good in the Years I since I was five. Here's the deal, You arent Catholic (or you wouldnt have said that) so why dont you leave Catholicism to us. The Catholic Churches Response (PULLLEEESE) the response down here on planet earth (at the Parrish Level) has been mighty bad, so Like I said Fuck off and leave the Catholicism to us.

Clearly, Satan is blinding that one with the Anti-Punctuation/Grammar Beam...

[piratefish08]

24. I saw that response on the other thread. You can feel the christian love right through

the computer screen.........

[awoke_in_2003]

3. Those priests...

are not true christians, dontcha know :sarcasm:

[Goblinmonger]

4. Or when they do, it's "priests are gay"

Just pisses me off. First, it avoids the real problem at the top. Second, I know so many priests that are good guys. Third, how does the "they're gay" get to stick around?

[Toasterlad]

5. What Else Can They Do? They Can't Fall Back On "Priests Aren't REAL Catholics"

The christians love that "argument", but it's hard to accuse a priest - who's been ordained by the church - of not being a "true" catholic and still maintain any credibility.

[darkstar3]

7. Very true,

which is why everytime someone brings up the boy-fucking to a Christian claiming moral superiority, they get up on their huffy bike and leave the conversation.

[laconicsax]

15. Did you watch the Intelligence Squared debate with Hitchens and Fry?

I don't recall which of the two said it but it was something like "defenders of the Vatican always get up and say, 'of course you'd bring up child abuse' like it isn't an actual problem."

Later, Ann Widdencombe said, "...and of course you try to talk about child abuse" and then tried to downplay child rape as a non-issue.

http://www.intelligencesquared.com/iq2-video/2009/catholic-church for the video (in case you haven't seen it or just want to see it again).

[charlie]

17. Breathtaking, innit?

Let's not bicker and argue about 'oo killed 'oo...

[Odin2005]

9. I think some are afraid of looking like "anti-papist" bigots.

There his a history of "The RCC is the Whore of Babylon and needs to be destroyed" sentiment among many Protestant sects and thus bashing the RCC has become associated with historic anti-Catholic bigotry.

[laconicsax]

20. And it seems that there are plenty who like to play that card rather than face reality.

As evidenced by a certain thread started today in R/T. Apparently, the Vatican doesn't represent Catholicism, and denouncing systemic child rape and cover-up is bigotry.

[darkstar3]

21. Oh, but don't you see?

"We are all one, except when we're not."

They'll happily credit "The Church" for all the good things done by various saints and godbaggers, so long as it's convenient (see the debate about Mother Teresa on a stamp if you want to see how fast that credit can shift to suit purposes). But as soon as someone church-related does something purely fucking evil, that wasn't "The Church", it was just him.

Members of the Catholic Church could give good long lessons to middle-managers about credit-taking and blame-management.

[laconicsax]

23. "We are all one, except when we're not."

I think that's the best explanation of the Trinity I've seen in a while.

It makes sense that mindless godbags would try to emulate the nonsense of their whacked-out beliefs.

Oh, and Sal, if you're reading this, feel free to quote mine. You know you want to.

[meeshrox]

10. Absolutely...

Also, why are they not arrested and prosecuted? Just wondering why their exempt from the law against molesting CHILDREN!

[FiveGoodMen]

11. Separation of church and justice

[meeshrox]

12. Spot-on!

:thumbsup:

[laconicsax]

13. The same reason that born-again convicts get pardoned and released early.

[frogmarch]

14. How many bad apples

does it take to spoil the barrel?

How many abuses by Catholic priests will it take before the Catholic Church goes under?

I don't understand how anyone can be a Catholic now. The excuse I hear my husband's Catholic relatives give for their continued loyalty to the church in the midst of the growing abuse scandal is "We can't let a few bad apples spoil the barrel."

Some people are so stupid.

[ZombieHorde]

16. I don't think Catholics care about child rape, homophobia, misogyny,

or the anti-condom propaganda. Gun enthusiasts donate to the NRA, animal rights activists donate to the Humane Society, what kind of person donates to the RCC?

The Catholic church does fucked up shit, but atheists are the bad guys for pointing it out. :crazy:

Only religion can get away with this.

[onager]

18. For some fun, enter this in Google...

"hbo celibacy"

Celibacy is an outstanding HBO documentary from 2004. It traced the history of the practice in the Catholic church and noted the rapidly declining number of priests and nuns.

I remember the docu mentioned a journal entry found back in the Middle Ages, about a notorious monastery in Italy: "With wine and boys around, the monks have no need of the devil to tempt them."

:rofl:

The fun of entering that Google search: you get a slew of articles condemning the documentary, including some Official Poutrage from the Conference of Catholic Bishops.

The Conference of Sons of Bishops regrettably did not respond...

"While the film accurately dates mandatory celibacy in the Roman rite to 1139, a supposedly unbiased expert misleadingly asserts that the final decision was one based solely on questions concerning the inheritance of church property," the review continues. "At no point does the documentary take seriously that following the example of the celibate Christ is a motive for priestly celibacy. Primacy is always given to motives other than spiritual."

Hey asshat - we don't know that Christ was celibate, do we? Standard Disclaimer - "assuming he even existed."

"The Church does not deny that certain members of the clergy have committed heinous crimes resulting in immeasurable harm by their betraying the trust of those they were sent to serve," says the OFB review. "But the show's oversimplified prognosis, which recommends ending celibacy as a panacea to the ills facing the Church is hardly convincing."

Well, f**k me with Linda Blair's crucifix. All they've DONE is deny those heinous crimes, until they are cornered by lawyers and their insurance companies.

http://www.usccb.org/comm/archives/2004/04-112.htm

[beam me up scottie]

19. What kills me is that this is old news.

The evidence was posted on DU before and after Ratzi was promoted but it was dumped in R/T where the apologetics were allowed to distract and disinform.

The BBC, Guardian, Salon and even TNCR posted lengthy articles on their websites. The BBC even made a television documentary about the subject.

grrrrrrrrrr


I'll dig up a few of those posts, brb