Muhammad was Schizophrenic?

[Odin2005]

I'm currently reading a book on the early Middle Ages and have been reading the section on the origin of Islam and the chapter's information on Muhammad as a person just screams Schizophrenia. He sounds like a classic schizophrenic that interprets ones' own "aha" moments as The Voice of God.

On a similar note, Jesus was almost certainly a schizophrenic, too

[laconicsax]

1. Jesus wasn't anything but a literary character. n/t

[realisticphish]

2. I'm not so sure

I've gone back and forth on this a million times. Now, obviously the Biblical Jesus is an amalgamation of other mystery religions and cults, etc. But I think it's entirely possible that there was a radical apocalyptic rabbi called Jesus, who either just preached or in fact raised a rebellion (there is some interesting evidence of that in the Bible, even). Whether he claimed to be the son of God, etc, and all that, meh. Who knows. In the end, I have a feeling that there is a core person the story is based on, with aspects of other similar rabbis stuck on, and then liberally coated with the cults of Dionysus and Osiris.

[onager]

4. The problem is that description also fits many, not just one.

...a radical apocalyptic rabbi called Jesus, who either just preached or in fact raised a rebellion (there is some interesting evidence of that in the Bible, even).

At the time of the Judaic Fundamentalist insurgency in Jerusalem, the streets were crawling with "radical apocalyptic rabbis." Flavius Josephus, an eyewitness, as well as other accounts describe those times in great detail - street-corner preachers urging youngsters, armed only with knives and rocks, to attack the world's greatest army. The more things change, the more they etc. etc.

That's why I've always suspected the Biblical Jesus was a mish-mash of many different charismatic (and megalomaniacal) religious leaders from that time.

Also, I don't see Jesus as particularly radical. He did urge the Jewish populace to shut up and pay their Roman taxes. With that kind of message, it's not hard to imagine one of the Jesi being supported by the Romans. And maybe after the destruction of the Temple, going off happily arm-in-arm with Flavius Josephus to live out his life as a Roman pet and sterling example of a Good Jew. (Even by his own accounts, Josephus was a first-century Benedict Arnold.)

There was a full-blown rebellion led by a Messiah, just a few years after Jesus got nailed, circa 36 CE, and it was put down by Pontius Pilate. But that Messiah was a Samaritan, the Judeans' neighbors who worshipped a different, Off-Brand God.

Much like the Judeans, the Samaritans had a holy mountain (Mount Gerizim), where they wanted to build (or re-build) a temple. The Samaritan Messiah gathered a group of armed followers and started leading them up the mountain.

As he did in every account except the New Testament BS, where he is depicted as vacillating ninny who caved in to a crowd, Pilate acted decisively and sent in troops to crush the rebellion. The leader was captured and executed. It's pretty hard to fault Pilate in that case; this wasn't a charismatic rabbi mouthing obscurantist parables, it was an all-out armed rebellion against the state.

When the big revolt broke out in 66 CE, the Romans didn't take any chances, according to some accounts. In a pre-emptive strike against another Samaritan insurgency, the Fifth Legion occupied Mount Gerizim.

Josephus implies that the Samaritan Messiah incident got Pilate fired for excessive brutality, but that may just be his usual Pilate-bashing. Josephus was born circa 37 CE, so he couldn't have witnessed those events. Pilate was a lot like another political leader much maligned in the fictions of the New Testament (and Josephus), Herod The Great. Like Herod, Pilate managed to survive for many years in a smoldering tinderbox of a region, surrounded by people who hated him. For all we really know, he went back to Rome, collected his pension, and lived happily ever after.

[realisticphish]

6. not to mention

that one does not climb that high in the Roman Empire by being a wuss

[Warpy]

5. The Jesus myth was certainly cobbled together

out of Mithras, Hercules, Osiris, and a dozen other eastern Mediterranean myths. Whether or not there was an itinerant rabble rousing preacher back then named Yeshua bar Maryam whose ideas were written down 100 years later and still resonate today is a distinct possibility.

I've worked enough psych in my life to know that schizophrenics don't make enough sense to start religions. Also, back in pre scientific times, they were more likely to be seen as possessed by devils or demons and ostracized at best, tortured and killed at worst.

[realisticphish]

3. Makes sense to me

Same for Joan of Arc, or in fact any religious "prophet" who wasn't a deliberate fraud (i.e. Joseph Smith)

[golddigger]

7. Not surprising since their God is a

Psychopathic mass murderer.

[TZ]

8. The point of this?

I really really hate armchair analysis of historical figures. First of all, none of us are REALLY qualified to dx mental illness. Second of all is you are making an assumption that the historical writings about Muhammed are at any way shape form accurate, assuming the person even existed. This is the kind of thing that also reflects very very poorly on atheists. Good grief. I'm sure there will now be trolls citing this thread as an example as how atheists thing all religious believers are mentally ill.

[Commie Pinko Dirtbag]

9. Read this book:

http://www.amazon.com/Man-Who-Mistook-His-Wife/dp/0684853949

[realisticphish]

10. I love this book

totally fascinating. I'm a particular fan of the guy who would walk at a 30 degree angle because of an inner ear problem. He designed a level that could be attached to his glasses, and from that day on, he walked perfectly upright. I love ingenuity