SFRC Hearing: 10 AM Condi Rice TEstifying

[TayTay]

http://foreign.senate.gov/

[wisteria]

1. Thanks Tay. I can look, but I can't listen.

I am at work and I have no audio on my computer.
Oh, I am (hopefully) working on that JK speech tape. I had to leave for work, but I have attempted to record it for you.
Oh course, I will want a copy too.


C-Span 3 had about an hour of Biden on before I left for work this morning. Biden was his usual self and actually everything he was saying at this press conference he held has turned out just he opposite of what he predicted. It was from March 06.

[TayTay]

2. Oh dear Lord, just saw a view of Sen. Kerry

Looks like he is praying during Condi's testimony.

I don't blame him.

[whometense]

3. WTF is Biden on about?

I do not understand the smarmy bastard.

Condi sweetheart, we know how deeply you care???? Do we????

[wisteria]

4. Every time I click on, Biden is in my face. n/t

[sandnsea]

5. Attacking Iran, expanding the war

That's the most important thing Bush said last night and I'm glad Biden got to it. Condi didn't rule out crossing borders to go after Iranians that support the Shiites. Not good at all.

[whometense]

6. If that's what he said, GOOD!

I really have difficulty mining his speech for actual content - it's so laden with meandering blather.

[europegirl4jfk]

11. This guy really has problems

He twice addressed Lugar as chairman, once almost as Secretary, he confounded Iraq with Iran, then Syria with Iraq. I don't see him going through a presidential campaign. If they go after him for every misspoken word as they do with Kerry, he will have a really hard time.

[sandnsea]

13. I'm referring to one question

That was surprisingly concise, so maybe I missed the part you were talking about. Then Condi went to blathering and I had to shut it off again. I'm very upset about this Iran stuff, as I posted the other day. They are entirely too flippant about chasing down these Iranians and Syrians, as if they're chasing down kids who stole candy bars from the local market.

[rox63]

9. Sarcasm, perhaps?

:shrug:

I can't watch/listen, so I'm depending on the play-by-play from DU.

[TayTay]

7. Some questions, as I can

Biden: Is the Pres going into Syria and/or Iran to pursue those who aid the insurgency in Iraq.

Condi: Ah, well, we are doing all we can to make sure that we protect our troops and so forth. You know us, we only do things that are purely, absolutely right. We must protect our troops, of course. Ahm, btw, we don't rule out 'dealing' with these countries. (We don't like them. They are rude and mean to us. They never once sent us a Christmas card. They are bad guys.)

Biden: Does the PRes have the right, under the Constitution, to purse policies in those countries.

Condi: Do I look like a Constitutional lawyer? I don't know, don't care.

Biden: If Bush invades Iran & Syria, then he better come back to Congress and get re-authorized. Now, how long do you think American forces will be in Baghdad, going door-to-door with Iraqi troops?

Condi: I don't know. BTW, the Iraqis are doing everything we asked. They are wonderful. It's amazing, considering how insanely great they are that we still have to be there. We are just supporting them, in the way of doing the actual fighting. Other than that, they do it all. (Timeframes are very evil in this White House, btw. Shame on you for asking me this.)

Biden: 6.2 million people in Baghdad, civil war and Bush says, 5 brigades deployed to Baghdad to work alongside Iraqi units. Young marines will be standing next to Iraqis as they break down the door. How long will this be going on? You know, this is dangerous work. Any idea how long our guys have to do it?

Condi: The image of Iraqis doing this is veyr important.

Biden: Condi, are you confident thatMaliki can send out a sufficient number of troops that can stay in the lead and guarantee the safety of our Marines. The Iraqis won't turn on them, right?

Condi: We think Maliki will be a stand-up guy. (Condi crosses fingers on both hands.)

[TayTay]

8. Gotta go.

Some summarize Lugar.

[whometense]

10. Thanks for the translation! n/t

[Inuca]

12. Dodd

Forceful, and to the point, definitely one of the smart adults around. Calls it "a tactic in search of a strategy". Very good analysis. Condi listens with an unbelievably sour face.

[TayTay]

14. Dodd

Dodd: Thank you, thank you. Everyone is showing up and talking. How great. Btw, this is serious business. Iraq is screwed up.

Dodd is not questioning Condi, he is giving a lecture.

Fools paradise describes Iraq today. (Good one.) From an FDR quote. This new plan is same as the old plan. We got an even bigger civil war. Why do we think there will be a different outcome from what Bush said last night.

We should withdraw from active civil war areas. 23 milities operating in Baghdad alone. We have no clue who we are fighting. We can't fight that for a variety of reasons. We should concentrate on helping the Iraqis with infrastructure reconstruction.

Diplomacy needs to be used. Bush ignored this and this recommendation in the ISG. Bush's plan is doomed and won't work. We aren't addressing the real causes of the insurgency and probably can't. Deaths are going up. (Dodd is saying stuff we have already heard. Iraq is a bad place, and this ia bad situation.) Still no hope of a question. Sigh! (Bad. no diplomacy. Real bad. Ahm, no diplomatic solution. Really, awfully bad.) You people suck, btw at diplomacy. Iran and Syria are bad guys. But we still have to talk to them. Really, terribly, completely awfully bad. Bush hates Syria. Still no question in sight.

Will you use diplomacy?

Condi: (She actually found a question in there.) Syria. We did engage them. We had them over for dinner and everything. They were terrible. They didn't even bow to the King or anything. The Syrians were asked to help us stabilize Iraq. However, the Syrians are only thinking of themselves and their interests. (We told them, you scatch our back, we scratch yours. They ignored us.) Now we look weak to them. Bad, bad form.

The Syrians are bad to everyone, the Italians, the Germans, etc. We just don't want to talk to them cuz they are bad, bad people. Iran? Well, we just don't talk to Iran. They are evil. They are trying to kill us. Like Syria, they could stop killing our troops and helping the insurgency but they don't want to. They just want what they want. (We, of course, are not like that. We simply told them what we want and that's what we want. They are stubborn, we are firm in our resolve.)

[whometense]

15. Hagel: 1970

government lied to the american people; said they didn't go into Cambodia, but they did.

I know something about this, as do some others on this committee.

:applause:

Edited to add: Hooray for Hagel - he is talking very straight and very tough.

[europegirl4jfk]

16. Hagel is also against escalation

Is also asking for a at least regional if not international conference. Is talking about Cambodia. If carried out what Bush said yesterday, it's the most dangerous foreign policy blunder since Vietnam! People are clapping!!!

[europegirl4jfk]

19. Cool! He is very aggressive against Condi! n/t

[whometense]

20. He just called her

a LIAR to her face.

[karynnj]

24. He was great

[TayTay]

25. Yup.

JK just nailed the lying. And he called her out on having no Plan B. He made the extremely strong point that Hezbollah and Hamas and other extremist groups are stronger than they were before the war.

If this doesn't work, what is Plan B. Condi said, we have no plan B.

Hagel and Kerry were on fire today. They were incredible. Everyone else can just about go home.

[whometense]

27. Too bad Kerry is followed by

l'il Normie.

What a wuss.

Hagel was fantastic; Kerry was too.

What I wouldn't give to see them tag team her for an hour without interruption.

Question: If the dems are in charge, why do they have to stick to this short-form questioning?

[europegirl4jfk]

32. Condi has no time

Biden said at the beginning that they have only until 1pm because Condi has to testify in the House as well.

[karendc]

17. Not to hijack

but if you get a minute, please help out here:

http://www.dailykos.com/storyonly/2007/1/11/105125/883

Thanks.

[TayTay]

18. Hagel

Hagel: Glad you're hear. Code Pink acting up. Stop the War, etc. (Not referring to you, on the lies thing, Sen. btw.)

Again, thanks for going to the ME. (Isn't that her job?) This issue will be here for some time. I see that you are traveling to the ME. This means follow-up on what we are discussing here. (OMG, that's a first.) No question in sight.

Okay, The Pres speech last night. We owe the military and their families a policy worthy of their sacrifices. (True!) We don't have that today. The PRes talked about an escalation in IRaq and the ME. I do not agree with that escalation. This is a civil war, Iraqi on Iraqi and there is intra-sectarian violence, Shia killing Shia. This is wrong. We won't win a war of attrition in the ME. Yeah, the skeptics have a point you know. The facts on the ground show, this ain't working. (Americans have a right to be pessimistic.) No question in sight. (Oooh, brings up Cambodia and how the US govt lied about that incursion in the VN war. Oooooh. Implies Kerry knows this too.) Iraq is the most dangerous foreign policy blunder in this country since VN. (Applause.)

Is all the Maliki govt in support of this escalation and are our 'allies' escalating? Anybody at all? Or just us?

Condi: No, nobody but us Senator. But, the Iraqis are really stepping up. Honest.

Hagel: Ah, won't we be asking Iraqis to be killing militia? US too? Ahm, gee, isn't that far-fetched.

Condi: Sadr not supportive of this. (Of course.) Ahm, we are working on it with Maliki. He will support us, really. Maliki will take on the militias.

Hagel: Is Maliki supporting this escalation.

Condi: AH, tap dancing. Sure.

[whometense]

21. JK's up

Joke? "I'll put down the hammer."

[karynnj]

23. Biden is a jerk -

He let Dodd and Hagel have a lot time then tried to cut Kerry mid question. Lugar was way more respectful.

[whometense]

26. I agree.

Politics? If so, despicable.

[TayTay]

Kerry got the point across

This Admin is tap-dancing and they have NO BACKUP PLAN if this doesn't work. He completely nailed Condi on her deceptions here. He was awesome. He got more done in 8 minutes than just about anyone else will in the whole rest of the hearing.

Wow! Nice, nice work Senator. You rock! (Go get some chicken soup.)

[karynnj]

29. I have never heard anyone stop a Senator mid question.

This is pathetic. (maybe he knows Kerry was better then him yesterday.

[wisteria]

33. I guess he figures it is ok to go after someone who is down, especially when

that someone is 100 times better than him. That was ignorant and I hope that some good kerry person picks up on it. Biden, throwing his weight around.

[karynnj]

34. He must know Kerry is running

If he isn't, Kerry will subtlely or overtly be able to help people in the primaries.

[wisteria]

35. In other words, he isn't taking any chances of being upstaged. n/t

[rox63]

42. But wouldn't he also have done that to Dodd?

Dodd just announced this morning that he's running. If Biden was stiffing the competition, you'd think he'd also do the same to Dodd.

[karynnj]

49. Could be he is arrogant not to see Dodd as a threat

He wants to be the "foreign policy expert" in the race. Kerry has the name recognition, the money and the ability. Unfortunately, he has more media and part opposition than anyone. Biden may be afraid that te hearings are one natural place where Kerry can show what he can do.

Biden has said he is a candidate for much more than a year. he has never polled more than 4 or 5% - and is usually lower. This in spite of some media push. (especially the Washington Post). He likely sees Kerry as his biggest threat (at minimum splitting some of that vote.) and doesn't even see Dodd. Dodd is new.

Imagine Gore and Kerry (:cry:) don't run. Look at the anti- Clinton race then. If Obama and Edwards seem too green, which elder wins - who is more likable and reasonable? Dodd also could pick up the moral leadership thing naturally.

[JI7]

68. that was just too obvious

i just watched it and there is no way it was just about the time. the time has been and usually is an issue but almost never do they cut people off like that. he sure is a punk.

and if Kerry has a cold or any illness, i sure couldn't tell from this. he looked really good.

[karynnj]

69. I wonder if it wasn't Biden trying to play alpha male games

Where he is asserting to Kerry that he (Biden) is more powerful and signalling to everyone that he will not give Kerry any extra respect. Lugar always let Kerry have extra time - simply noting afterwards he let it continue because it was productive.

It becomes clearer and clearer that the establishment Democrats are quite willing to ignore that Kerry was the overwhelming choice of the Democratic voters - far more than Clinton was in 1992 and nearly became President. This and his competence should entitle him to a natural respect.

[whometense]

70. That sounds plausible to me.

I certainly wouldn't put Biden above such petty crap.

[karynnj]

71. What gets me is that it is not just Biden - you have so many

Democrats (Shumer, H Clinton, etc) who have publicly shown, not just lack of respect but disrespect. Kerry is a good strong voice and he does not deserve this. (It is sickening to me because they know how good a statesman and person he is. Biden had it right in 2004, Kerry is a classy guy - How many would say theat about him?)

[TayTay]

22. Kerry

JK: You were splitting hairs with the answer to Sen. Hagel. Level of violence is getting worse. This is a large civil war. We saw a different ME than the one you talked about. Speech last night was important for what it did and didn't say. Bush lost an opportunity for bipartisanship. That is fading away. Pres lost the opportunity that the ISG and other things presented. Diplomacy is off the table. Bush is throwing diplomacy away, don't understand why.

You policy is unbelievably off the mark and a failure. The zealot groups in Iraq, Lebananon and so forht are much stronger. The IRaqi govt is saying they don't want these extra troops and we are forcing this on them.

Bush said America's committment is not open-ended. Support of American and Iraqi people is waning. What does the PRes mean when he says support of Americans is not open-ended.

Are you prepared to pull out if it fails.

Condi: The Iraqis now know they must succeed or their people will revolt.

We can see if the Iraqis will do what they say.

JK: What if they don't? (Said twice.)

Condi: Ah....... divert and don't answer the question.

JK: what comes next

Condi: Ah....... babble, babble, babble, talking points. We have great people there, etc.

JK; Yeah, great people and stuff. But if our people and the Iraqis can't do this, what comes next?

We have a lot of empty promises and no action. How are we going to do it?

Condi: ah, we are doing this. Really. Ahm, really.

JK: Why is there not a political resolutin on the table that says that the struggle between Sunni and Shia and the intras-Shia violence etc, What's going on with that. Political piece

Condi: National Oil Law. (That is neutral.) De-Baathificaiton policy, lets some Baathists back. Commitment to provincial elections. (Sunnis like it.) These are the elements of a national reconciliation plan. This is good stuff and the international community will like it. (We have to secure Baghdad first.)

[whometense]

55. Salon War Room

http://www.salon.com/politics/war_room/2007/01/11/one_answer/index.html

...John Kerry just tried to get Rice to say what the Bush administration will do if the Iraqis don't live up to their latest round of promises. Rice refused to deal with the question. "I don't think you go to Plan B," she told Kerry. "You work with Plan A. You give it the best possibility of success."...

[europegirl4jfk]

28. Coleman: Cost is too high

Doesn't support Bush's plan either. I'm amazed to see so many Reps abandoning Bush!

[TayTay]

30. Feingold

RF: Condi this is one of the worst foreign policy debacles in US history. We have 140,000 US troops there. It is getting worse and worse. We are getting nowhere on this.

Bush wants more troops, even though his other plans have done nothing. We have had 4 years of failed strategies. The US wants the troops to redeploy out of Iraq.

Feingold is saying that we need to 'use the power of the purse' to get a change of policy in Iraq. (Oooh, cutting off the funding comes up.)

OOops, gotta go.. Can someone summarize Feingold.

[karynnj]

31. Feingold sounds like he is calling to cut funds period

(not Kennedy) but completely

Is the US more secure? Condi - yes

Condi: Longer term issue is how the ME evloves.
Feingold: I understand and reject

Feingold: Is Afghanistan better after attacking Iraq
Condi: Not everything is about Iraq

Feingold: what about NK? Iraq is diverting attention
Condi : blah Blah etc

(Feingold notes time up - Biden didn't stop him -

[europegirl4jfk]

36. Boxer: "You are not listening to the American people!"

Boxer also cites ISG. "Madame Secretary, you are not listening to the American people!"

Nails Condi on what she said before the SFRC before, that she has NO DOUBT that the Iraqis will care for their own security in a reasonable time frame.

Boxer asks: Wo is paying the prize? Tells the story of one dead soldier; very touching.

America is ALONE. "No country standing with us for this escalation." Brits are bringing troops home. Poland and Australia is all what's left of coalition, no-one joining in surge.

[ginnyinWI]

37. they're a good tag team today--

Dodd, Kerry, Feingold and Boxer--with Hagel thrown in for good measure. But Condi's a true believer--has swallowed Bush's vision. It's just a few of them against the whole Congress, and the whole world.

If things keep going at this pace, who wouldn't predict that the question of impeachment comes up eventually?

It warms my heart!

[TayTay]

38. I agree.

OMG, real hearings with teeth. (I am in tears.) This is what we worked for last year.

God, oversight is wonderful. Checks and balances are wonderful. Being able to call Bush to task through this hearing is just so wonderful. Sigh!

[wisteria]

41. You know, my husband the practical ,sensible guy, mentioned that very notion

after Bush's speech last night. I was shocked.

[Island Blue]

39. I'm home sick today so I'm able to watch this.

It's making me feel much better I must say. :)

[wisteria]

43. Lucky you, well that you can stay home and watch it anyway.

I hope you feel well soon though.

[ProSense]

45. I'm relying on this and other

threads. Feel better.

[europegirl4jfk]

40. Nelson, Florida

"Have supported the administration on the war, but cannot support your policies any longer. I have not been told the truth."

Asks if Abizaid and Casey support the surge. Condi confirms and says that it's actually Casey's plan. (Is she lying again?)

Nelson was in Iraq and couldn't believe Iraqi National Security adviser who said it's AlQaida and Baathists but country is not in civil war. Iragi politicians deny what is going on in their country. How could more troops help in such a situation?

Nelson thinks also that intense diplomatic effort is needed in the region.

Biden interrupts again.

[europegirl4jfk]

44. Voinovich: another disillusioned Rep

"I went along with the president. I bought into this dream of a democratic Iraq. But now I don't think any longer that it will happen."

[Inuca]

46. Number of potential or announced

presidential nominees present: FOUR! If my count is correct... Just a thought.

[wisteria]

48. I count four also. LOL.

You know who I think runs circles around the others?

[Inuca]

51. No, please tell :-) nt

[wisteria]

47. Obama is up, someone let me know how he does. Please! n/t

[Inuca]

50. The way I see it

quite similar to Kerry's. What are the benchmarks to make sure it works, i.e. what does not open ended mean. And what will we do if in 6 months things do not work out, are going to start pahsing down. ANswer: I do not want to be specific, do not want to specualate

[europegirl4jfk]

52. Obama: Question is at what point do we have enough?

The solution always seems to be six month away. The sectarian violence always worsen. Obama don't believe assurances from the Maliki government that it's different this time. Want to know what benchmarks are and what consequences if benchmarks not met.

Rice: We are not staying married to the plan if the Iraqis don't live up to expectations. But she doesn't get specific on a date or conditions for withdrawal.

[Inuca]

53. What I find most amazing

is not that JK, Boxer, etc. are very good and critical, but that with the single exception of Corker (I think, I did not listen much), all other republicans have also been quite critical as well. Hagel the most, but unless I missed something, all the others as well. Listening to Murkowski (spelling?) right now, not exactly a firebrand liberal, "I would agree with sen Hagel... I am not conviced as I look at the plan that it is so much different from what we have been doing in the past"

[europegirl4jfk]

54. Murkowski also very skeptical of surge n/t

[europegirl4jfk]

56. Menendez: "I didn't vote for the war in the first place."

"One of the best decisions I've ever made."

Surge wrong name; it's escalation. Iraqi troops aren't reliable; simply don't show up. Did president obtain commitment from Maliki that Iraqi troops will go after al-Sadr? Condi confirms that.

Menendez doesn't believe it will work. Benchmarks are without consequences, it doesn't push Maliki to go after militia. Gives Maliki a blank check. Gives Iraqis dependency on US forces. There is no answer on what happens if the plan fails.

[ginnyinWI]

57. JK just appeared on CNN

I just caught the tail end of it, but he was criticizing Bush's escalation. CNN was in CNN-Int. mode, so it went out to the world. :)

[wisteria]

59. Good. Seems he has had enough of everyone not saying what needs to be said about Buish's plans.

I hope they treated him with the respect he deserves.

[europegirl4jfk]

60. Missed it

But if it was on CNNi I hope they will repeat it later, as "Your World Today" continues here until 8pm.

[Inuca]

58. Isakson

not sure what he is talking about, killing time, no question, left time for the newcomers, and called Maliki Malaki. Cardin up now.

[wisteria]

61. Our guy is up from PA. How is Casey doing? n/t

[europegirl4jfk]

62. Casey: Pennsylvania has lost more than 140 troops in Iraq

Death in small town is like earthquake. Obligation he has as senator is to support policies that make sure that losses of life are reduced, especially for policy that is flawed. Doesn't believe that president's policy has support.

[wisteria]

63. Thanks, I like that hometown touch and that he honors those in Pa who have died

serving our country, by mentioning them. It is good that he reminds Condi of this also. Thanks!

[wisteria]

64. Ha, Ha, this must be a tough day for Condi,

Kerry get tough now it is Webb's turn.

[beachmom]

66. Webb: just great!

Compares Iran to China. Also hits the IWR and what exactly the president can do for preemptive attacks without authorization from Congress. He's very worried about a conflict with Iran.

Throws down a challenge: why doesn't George W. Bush get on a plane and go to Tehran?

[Inuca]

67. And he ended by,,,

.... suggesting a bold act for B, to get on a plane and go to Tehran, that was kind of fun... Biden wraps up (correctly) emphasizing that they do not have the right to go into Iran, will lead to constitutional crisis (and not only)

[europegirl4jfk]

65. Webb: Necessity to widen diplomatic approach

Always warned that invading Iraq would empower Iran and that has become reality.There should be negotiations with Iran. Compares Iran to China in the 1970s: aggressive engagement process that brought China eventually in international community.

Is it the position of admin that it possesses authority to take action against Iran without Congressional approval? Of course, Condi doesn't answer this question. *g*

Webb things Bush should go on a plane and go to Iran, as Nixon did when he went to China.