OT: A few pieces of interesting news re: 2008

[beachmom]

First off -- it's pretty obvious, Wes Clark is either a) not going to run or b) if he changes his mind will only be a token candidate. Markos is now dropping him from the Straw Poll:

http://www.dailykos.com/story/2007/3/5/15854/32884

He says he is not running, and won't be running for the next 3 months.

Secondly, there is a lot of buzz about this "1984 Hillary" video. I think MANY at this forum will find this video interesting. Still, it's important to note that Obama is NOT behind this video, and I would think very lowly of any Democrat who put this together. Also, I think Bush would have been a more appropriate "star" to this video:

http://www.talkingpointsmemo.com/archives/012813.php

[karynnj]

1. That video is brutal

It's weird because it works. i think because Hillary's naturally abrasive voice - here in almost a monotone - is speaking calming platitudes.

(Consider how poorly it would have worked with Kerry's voice which always shows emotion that matchs content.)

[FrenchieCat]

2. First off, it is not "obvious" that Clark is not going to run....

The headline you point to was taken from the site of a blogger who not only supports another candidate but got his information from culling Clark's website and found a supporters' account from Clark's New Hampshire appearance. It was one source that he chose to highlight, and thus far, there are 5 sources repudiating that one source. Even the source now says that Clark may not have heard her question clearly enough, and she may not have heard all of Clark's answer. She now feels very badly that what she reported on the WesPAC site has been taken as gospel by bloggers and spread throughout and that Markos now has an excuse to ignore Wes Clark just like the media has done all along. "Crashing the Gates my Ass" is my thoughts when I think of Markos; a legend in his own mind gone wild.

The Robwire.com blogger is the guilty party took that quote from the Clark supporter. Two other blog site picked up this information from the Robwire.com site, and Markos did as well. Unfortunately, our bloggers (not you...but the one who put this out, and the ones that followed that lead including KOS) are beginning to show that some are no better than the corporate media itself. The rule of having more than one source for a story other than an opinion is being ignored by both the corporate media and now bloggers in their quest to have "breaking" information.

In other words, one supporter quote on Clark's site went from one blogger and was spread to the others...just like the rumor mill the Internet is quickly becoming.

Markos is now dropping him from the Straw Poll because Markos has his own agenda, as most Kerry supporters should know.

As for labeling Clark as being a "token", that's pretty insulting. He wasn't a token last time, and I'm not sure why he should be this time if he chooses to run. Considering that we are fighting two actual wars, and a war on terror (which was the reason that Kerry running last time was a better choice than having one with no experience with war), and some are pushing for a bit of bombing on Iran, while the shoddy conditions of our Veteran's services as well as the detoriation of our Armed Forces are all over the news......I am amazed that a 2 year-in Senator, a former President's wife who is a NY Senator, and a one term senator/trial attorney would all be considered "heavyweight" contenders while Gen. Wes Clark, a retired four star general who won the last war and brokered a lasting peace would be relegated to that of "token". I understand the media undermining Wes Clark's stature and accomplishments, I just didn't expect informed bloggers to do this as well.

[beachmom]

3. He's not a token in his very insightful foreign policy views, Frenchie

But he IS a token as far as winning the primary. Look I know this is hard to take, but it's March, and if he doesn't declare soon it's not going to happen. And, yes, money matters, and he's way behind on money.

But I will say no more. You were kind to us when Kerry dropped out, and I haven't forgotten that. I certainly didn't mean to upset you with my post.

[FrenchieCat]

4. Thanks......

I was just inserting facts to include when one reads that KOS headline.

Would Clark be the "Token" military guy?

Look, I still believe that anything in America is possible. I don't believe that money 10 months prior the vote is what will make the determination of who our eventual nominee will be. If that were the case, Kerry would not have become our nominee in 2004. Howard Dean and Wes Clark (for that matter) had raise more money than Kerry prior to Iowa....and look who won....and went on to win the nomination?

[TayTay]

5. I know. What worries me is the National Primary on Feb 5th

The old system had it's flaws but it did allow for more candidates to get out into the field and talk to actual voters. The system in place for '08 ('04 on steroids, btw) is not conducive to getting all candidates a chance to 'strut their stuff' with real voters. That Feb 5th Super-Duper-Extra-Special primary with 20 states reporting in is bad, bad news for democracy.

Gen. Clark is someone who 'wears well' with the word-of-mouth style of politics that is being done away with in this rush to get a nominee by Feb 6th. This nomination is about money and it's about The Powers That Be pushing everyone else out of the way. (This is going to happen to all the candidates except the Big 2, imho, and I hope and pray I'm wrong.)

[MBS]

7. I hate hate hate hate hate the movement towards mega primary on Feb 5th

the general primary-date "arms race", trending towards ever earlier primary dates, was bad enough. But this is now RIDICULOUS. Like you said, it's all about money and The Powers that Be.

[karynnj]

6. I took "heavyweight" to be determined just politically

and I agree with your summation. (I think Obama has a little more than the 2 years in the Senate because he was in the IL Senate and a was a Constitional Law professor, Civil Rights lawyer and an advocate.)

I felt the same revulsion when every AP based story of Kerry pulling out mentioned that he did it because of these three heavyweights - when on the merits he surpassed all of them. Clark clearly is more than competitive with them on the merits.

This nomination is being pushed far too early and is completely undemocratic. Wes Clark and many other people who should have been able to participate in an ideas primary may be kept out because of money. (Kerry, Warner, and Bayh who had money were pushed out in different ways.)

We have become a "moneyocracy" to steal Senator Kerry's made up word when he spoke in the Senate for his and Wellstone's real election reform bill. Ten years ago, while speaking for that bill, he warned:

" Today the political system is being corrupted because there is too much unregulated, misused money circulating in an environment where candidates will do anything to get elected and where, too often, the special interests set the tone of debate more than the political leaders or the American people. Just consider the facts for a moment. The rising cost of seeking political office is outrageous. "
<snip>
"Let us recognize that the faith in government and in our political process which leads Americans to go to town hall meetings, or to attend local caucuses, or even to vote--that faith which makes political expression worthwhile for ordinary working Americans--is being threatened by a political system that appears to reward the special interests that can play the game and the politicians who can game the system.
Each time we have debated campaign finance reform in this Senate, too many of our colleagues have safeguarded the status quo under the guise of protecting the political speech of the Fortune 500. But today we must pass campaign finance reform to protect the political voice of the 250 million ordinary, working Americans without a fortune. It is their dwindling faith in our political system that must be restored."


<snip>
"Every time in the history of this republic when we have faced a moral challenge, there has been enough faith in our democracy to stir the passions of ordinary Americans to act--to write to their Members of Congress; to come to Washington and speak with us one on one; to walk door to door on behalf of issues and candidates; and to vote on election day for people they believe will fight for them in Washington.
It's the activism of citizens in our democracy that has made the American experiment a success. Ordinary citizens--at the most critical moments in our history--were filled with a sense of efficacy. They believed they had influence in their government.
Today those same citizens are turning away from our political system. They believe the only kind of influence left in American politics is the kind you wield with a checkbook."

I seriously doubt he ever thought it would get to where it is today. I don't like that the powers that be have narrowed our choices to this small group.