Help!!! DKos Kerry bash thread -- send in the Kerry brigade!

[beachmom]

Like it or not, DailyKos is the #1 liberal site on the web. The funny thing is that the title of this recommended diary is similar to one we had right here. I dashed out a comment, but you guys need to add to it, along with your links, quotes, and other documentation. Here it is. We have to have JK's back!!!

http://www.dailykos.com/story/2005/8/24/112728/826#27

[TayTay]

1. Figures it would go to recommend

I was snide on this (terribfromMA.) (Found my password)

These bozos have no idea what they are talking about and simply want to dump on Kerry. So I just posted that I am not giving money to the DNC anymore, just KErry. (He hehehehe)

[beachmom]

5. Hey terribfromMA, I think we've been friends longer than I thought

I didn't always post comments, but I am finding that a lot of the sane DKos commenters are now active members of the JK forum!!! I'm surprised they haven't revoked my ID, since I apparently wrote "the biggest insult EVER uttered on DKos in its entire history", so says Armando. My insult included no name calling I may add. But I was so angry at that website for their loud chorus of "fuck you" to the Iraqi people who were so brave to get out there and vote in January. Maybe I was over the line when I said Armando was "furthering the cause of the insurgents", but his reaction, instead of calmly explaining that that wasn't his intent, even though he would post EVERY time insurgents attacked in February with a veiled glee in his tone, was more over the top than my original comment. He demanded I "recant", and when I tried to keep talking about the issue, he said he would no longer "speak" to me (what a crybaby), and then ended his rant with the fact that I, beachmom, am a "dupe for BushCo.". Just thought you all should know that you've been chatting with a dupe for BushCo, or so says the DKos website. The thing is that with those people, it's not enough to be a Democrat, it isn't even enough to be a true liberal. No, you have to be an antiwar Leftist in order to be welcomed there. And that Motherf**ker Kos is getting quoted in the Washington Post. Sigh . . .

[karynnj]

7. Hey, but I am an anti-war liberal and they would hate me.

I went to 2 protests (DC, NYC)in early 2003, but I do not have the ability to read John Kerry's Fall,2002 or winter, 2003 speeches without believing he wanted to avoid the war. I am less sure Dean did.

I also really don't see how eliminating half or more of the party can possibly help us. It does bother me that they can't see how hard Kerry and others are working to fix the party infastructure. (Knowing that if it works and 2006 is good, all we will hear is praise for the DNC head.)

You're braver than me - I've never signed up there.

[beachmom]

18. To clarify, I am a more nuanced anti-war person

I was TOTALLY opposed to the invasion of Iraq. I just am not sure what we should do now, and I don't know if the peace movements' "pull troops out now" approach is right. But when I think antiwar Leftists I am thinking more of those folks who are always opposed to war, and really the crowd in VVAW who kicked Kerry out for not being radical enough. So I don't THINK that I am an antiwar Leftist, but hell, maybe to a right winger I am. Ugh . . . I guess labels are futile and I should give up on it.

[karynnj]

21. I'm with you

I like your phrase, a more nuanced anti-war person. I think that's what I was in both the 6os and now.

[LittleClarkie]

9. I just said that is was terribly convenient

for the party and everyone involved to decide that they had nothing to do with the loss, that it was all John's fault. How terribly, terribly convenient.

I'm Kerrycrat.

And that the words I want him to say involve having one hand up and the other on the Bible.

[TayTay]

2. One more thing, look what I found, remembered

From the Bolton Hearings in SFRC ON April 11, 2005

With all due respect to Senator Allen, I just don't think that one can dismiss or should dismiss how one interprets intelligence and how one operates within a position of high responsibility as somehow not important to the American people.

We've just come off the most massive intelligence failure in our history, and we recognize that there are serious questions still outstanding about the degree to which that intelligence was manipulated or the degree to which a predetermined position determined the outcome of that intelligence. And so it is vital to the security of the American people whether or not Mr. Bolton in his position was party to the same kind of activities; and that's the question with respect to Mr. Westermann.

The fact is that on September 18th in 2004, the Bush administration, "using stringent standards" -- I'm quoting from The New York Times -- "adopted after the failure to find banned weapons in Iraq, conducted a new assessment of Cuba's biological weapons capacity and concluded that it is no longer clear that Cuba has an active offensive big weapons program." And so that directly contradicted the position that Mr. Bolton took; and in fact Mr. Westermann was correct. And I think the American people deserve to have people who are correct not fired, but rewarded.

This was said before the Downing Street Minutes came out. It's not KErry's fault tht no one was paying attention at one of the most publicized and watched Senate hearing of the year. Sigh! I just don't think he can be heard sometimes above the din or pre-conceived opinions.

[karynnj]

3. The op is so completely full of it

I think I would question Kerry's judgement and sanity if he wrote anything remotely like it. I seriously doubt for one minute he thinks Howard Dean had it all worked out. I really wish Dean would post something to Kos or some other prominent board to try to end some of this nonsense. Starting with ackmowledging that he was not even AS antiwar as Kerry in Fall, 2002 and Winter, 2003. It might not help, they might think Saint Howard was just being kind to Kerry, but it couldn't hurt.

[paulk]

4. I don't go over there anymore

but I thought your post was great...


Is it the MSM that has bestowed the "#1 liberal site on the web" on Kos? I've been hearing that a bit lately. Sounds like something they would do - tie that bunch of whackjobs at Kos into the word "liberal".

[whometense]

6. I'm with you.

All I can bring myself to do is rate up a few posts.

The place is full of poison, and I want to do everything I can to help see it marginalized as much as possible. GD-P can get bad, but it's worse at DKos - more cultlike.

[beachmom]

8. Unfortunately, the dinosaurs at the MSM think it's THE site

I'm sorry but, DKos is frequently getting mentions in the MSM. I completely agree that DailyKos is the most disturbing place for liberals I have ever had the displeasure to read. I would argue that it's not a liberal site at all -- true liberals are open to hearing different viewpoints, as long as they are intelligent and well thought out. I mean, I read The Economist, and that magazine advocated the war in Iraq, and still does (although they're highly critical of Bush's conduct of the war, and did endorse Kerry for president). But they give compelling arguments. Even if I disagree, I respect their analysis. Cult is right about dKos. I think "antiwar Leftists" is really what they are. And they are dogmatic in their views, like a religious fanatic. You're wrong and they're right. But the funny part is how they are always accusing the Right of what they practice every day. Anyway, I just think that if there is a front page post or a recommended diary that is specifically bashing Kerry that we should jump in and put dissenting comments in in an effort to "democratize" the site. Just so if any of those dinosaurs are reading, they might happen upon our comments, and not be able to completely stereotype the "netroots". By the way, I rarely read it, but for some reason I took a look at it today, and felt I should sound the alarm to you guys.

I wrote a few more comments in the thread, but I think I'm done now. Thanks to everyone for jumping in and lending a hand.

[whometense]

10. Well, in honor of your excellent posts

I put up a few flame-baiters, but I don't care if I never go back there again. It's sort of like commenting on bomb throwing threads in GD - you end up elevating them.

I think DKos has become more and more crazy, and will eventually end up marginalizing itself with little effort from anyone else. Of course, it will take the MSM 10 years to catch up to what everyone else already knows. ;-)

[saracat]

11. I can't post there. I get too angry and full of hate. I am a leftist anti

war protestor but I hate these people. The lack of gratitude displayed to Kerry sickens me. I notice they never mention how Howard "admittedly" squandered his money on cheese and chocolates for donors as well as big time entertainment! Whatever.

[beachmom]

12. Even if you agree, somehow you're not welcome

That blows my mind, Saracrat, that even when you agree with a lot of the viewpoints on the site, you still somehow don't fit in. Even though you and I disagree on some things, I feel like I can talk to you or anyone else in this forum, and feel safe that everyone will be nice. I tell you, if I hadn't found this place, I probably would have given up on blogs long ago.

[saracat]

20. You are soo right. This group rocks. I am so glad that we exist.

Hey I can even be persuaded to another viewpoint with this group! Because we listen and know there can be another point of view(As long as it isn't anti-Kerry! ):) :bounce: :grouphug:

[kerrygoddess]

13. I remember Moltar from the Kerry Blog

Moltar was a regular there and on whole supportive until the SBL came around. I noted that this was mentioned in the post.

[beachmom]

14. You guys are totally awesome!

Thanks so much for chiming in on that Kos thread. I feel like it turned from a total Kerry bash thread to more of a discussion, and that guy Moltar was kind of getting a little sensitive at the end, which was funny since his diary was anything but. It was especially great to read nice things from people other than us, who probably felt safer to say something once they felt there were people out there who still liked Kerry. There was even a first time poster who felt compelled to write for the first time to defend Kerry.

As far as dKos and how popular it is, here is a little info, although the main source is Mydd.com, and he's friends with Kos making the whole thing a little suspect. I did find something in the Wall Street Journal that talked about how hard it is to determine who's the most popular -- there are hits, links, blog ads, and depending on how you use those numbers, the rankings will change. Nevertheless, I think it's fair to say that dKos is way up there, definitely ahead of DU. That's why I think we need to fight for Kerry over there. Problems is, I don't think I could bear having to read the vitriol on that site on a regular basis. But if anyone reads it a lot, the key is to only address front page articles and recommended diaries. Unranked diaries are pointless to comment on. Anyway, here is the info:

http://www.washtimes.com/national/20050811-110912-6938r.htm

For example, the study said that while the conservative blog Instapundit was three times larger than any other blog two years ago, the largest liberal blog, Daily Kos (www.dailykos.com), is getting "more than four times as many monthly visits."

http://www.mydd.com/story/2005/6/12/17357/3049

In the summer of 2003, Dailykos was roughly equal in traffic to Atrios, and had less than half the traffic of Instapundit. However, starting with a large growth spurt following the introduction of Scoop in October of 2003, now Dailykos has grown to three times the size of Instapundit and four times the size of Atrios.

http://online.wsj.com/public/article/0,,SB111685593903640572-DoCm_P_b1HHSoXRla2QEob6bw8w_20060525,00.html?mod=rss_free

[LittleClarkie]

15. In what alternative universe is this person living?

"I want John Kerry to admit he LIED (none / 1)

when he promised us he had his lawyers, his so-called people, on stand-by during the election in case anything suspicious happened. So where were they in Ohio??? He promised to be a fighter, and compared to Gore, he was the wimpiest of all wimps. With his superfast concession speech, he gave up the biggest chance we will ever have in finding out what happened in Ohio, which could have resulted in our having election reform.

As far as I'm concerned, he can leave politics, move to Martha's Vineyard and spend the rest of his days surfboarding."

Superfast? In what universe is the second slowest concession in recent memory "superfast"? And nice talking point at the end there.

On edit: Okay, I just lost it.

http://www.dailykos.com/story/2005/8/24/112728/826#152

[TayTay]

16. Yeah, and the horse they rode in on....

Besides, he doesn't windsurf off of Martha's Vineyard. That would tacky, gauche and in poor taste. And it's too crowded.

He windsurfs off of Nantucket. (Lying friggin bastards from hell. How dare they mix up the Islands off the coast of Massachusetts. Philistines, every damn one of 'em.)

[beachmom]

17. Ha! Ha! I just read your post, and burst out laughing!

Fucking windsurfing. To heck with John Kerry, what about the poor windsurfers and how their sport has been bashed ad nauseum!!! I swear, the lefties bring up the windsurfing more than the right wingers. Anyway, great post, Little Clarkie!!!

[Mass]

19. I loved this comment - I have not seen kos's original comment

but could it be that kos and the DLC have something in common, after all.

http://www.dailykos.com/comments/2005/8/24/112728/826/28?mode=alone;showrate=1#28

Half the globe? (none / 1)

There are alot of ways to criticize Bush, but to accuse him of trying to start a "perpetual war aginst half the globe" jives into exactly what Kos was warning us about yesterday, that the Democrats could become percieved as the anti-all war party. If you mean that you think that this war in IRaq was a mistake, say that, and don't exxagerate