So Ive been staying out of GD lately and I am curious to know

[JohnKleeb]

if Catholic bashing is still rampant or has declined.

[Princess Turandot]

1. Are you on drugs, my good man..

of course not..

AngryOldDem, a BAD CAT, kindly posted a link to a new one, which I responded to not once, but twice! I was a very bad girl, posting more than one provocative statement..

http://www.democraticunderground.com/discuss/duboard.php?az=show_mesg&forum=102&topic_id=1113876&mesg_id=1113876

[AngryOldDem]

2. responded very well, I might add!

[JohnKleeb]

4. Ive been known to drink :)

[AngryOldDem]

3. Still pretty bad...

DemBones' CRS thread was the nicest I've seen things here in quite a while, but you know how long that lasts.

As I said, I should probably avoid these threads, but I can't pass up the news links -- I find almost as much Church news here as I do reading National Catholic Reporter.

[JohnKleeb]

5. Sucks to know, thanks guys though

[ElectroPrincess]

6. Yes, like the original Princess here ... I added my 2 cents worth ...

It seems to be such a waste of time though. I'm not going to allow myself to counter any more in the future. Thanks for asking and it's good to know that I'm not the only one who feels left out.

[JohnKleeb]

7. Its bigotry

If I got some good information, maybe I could do my journalism feature article on what I consider a well kept secret by history and thats the bigotry the American Catholic faces, did you know that founding father Charles Carroll actually considered leaving his home Maryland for French Lousianna?

[DemBones DemBones]

8. Did you know that, historically, the Klan has been

as much anti-Catholic as anti-black? Then there were the Know-Nothings. . .

[ElectroPrincess]

9. Oh yes, and I often times have to explain to my Protestant friends

that we HONOR Mother Mary and it is NOT the same as our Worship of God in the Trinity.

Wow, it's amazing how glib even the average "well meaning" Protestant can be when dismissing our saints and implying that it's the same as worshiping many Gods.

I'll admit that I do not know much since I converted in 96' and only returned to active participation and volunteer work since my daughter began attending Catholic Elementary School last August.

My husband of 22 years has never lost faith and has actively participated since he was a child. I'm blessed to enjoy his guidance (when I'm insightful enough to take it).

Thanks for having this little refuge. I want the Democrats to succeed. I only wish that they would understand that liberal Catholics do not want our government to implement moral changes. Moral choices are only valid when FREELY arrived at. The forgoing is so obvious, I'm at a loss as to why other Democrats can't respect our presence instead of being seemingly "threatened" by our beliefs.

[demosincebirth]

12. They are afraid because they seem to lump Catholics in with the christian

fundamentalists and with the scandal that the Church has been going through with its pedophile priest, with the latter, rightiously deserved.

[AngryOldDem]

10. My alumni magazine had a fascinating and scary story about that

...I went to the University of Dayton, a Marianist institution. Back in the 1920s, a Klan group (klavern?) actually burned a cross near campus, and more or less singled out the college in their anti-Catholic efforts in general. The story was a fascinating and well-written exploration of the Klan's hate toward Catholics in the Dayton (Ohio) area. I knew the Klan was active in Dayton back in the '20s, but I had no idea how active. This was eye-opening stuff.

If I can find a link to it on the UD website, I'll post. But John, you may find this enlightening, and I'm sure you can get a copy of it by asking UD. It was in the University of Dayton Quarterly, Winter 2004-2005, entitled "Burn Bright the Cross -- The Klan's Crusade Against Dayton Catholics."

EDIT: Detail.

[Princess Turandot]

11. Sure..I'm always bemused when someone on DU (I don't mean you)..

'informs' Catholics that we shouldn't support right-wingers because they 'hate you too'..what surprised me at DU was how much 'progressives & liberals' hate Catholics.

Speaking of the KKK, while I would be very unlikely to ever vote for Rudy Giuliani again because of his nauseating support of Bush (comparing him to Churchill finally put me over the edge on that score) I personally think he did a very good job as the mayor of NYC, even pre-9/11. For some bizarre reason the KKK decided to hold a rally here in NYC, I think maybe in City Hall Park. Giuliani tried to stop them but was foiled on First Amendment basis, but the Corporation Counsel found a 19th C law still on the books which prevented people from demonstrating while wearing masks. It was still the law, as silly as it sounds (and I'm sure has been broken many a time in the 20th C) so the judge told the Klan they could hold their demonstration, but without their hoods. There were several hundred cops on duty to prevent a melee between the large anti-KKK protesters expected and the Klan, but in the end, I think only 4 had the chutzpah to actually show up with their faces showing. They walked around for a short period in a small circle, then departed. It was one of those really bizarre moments: I'm not sure why they would choose to demonstrate somewhere where most of the citizens would have been inclined to beat the cr@p out of them.

[demosincebirth]

13. Princess,

don't lump all liberals and progressives in the same boat. I'm very much a progressive, and many other Catholics I know are liberal and progressive. But, many of us, also, are Conservative on certain social issues, too

[Princess Turandot]

14. I was referring to some of the DU posters actually,..

the ones who never fail to take a pot-shot at Catholicism in a thread, even in ones where it takes some creativity to work the slight in. I was being a bit sarcastic i.e. that a board which sees itself as defending the Constitution and the 'People' harbors some folks who are as bad as the real bigots in the world. I was not referring to all 'liberal & progressive' individuals or implying that all Catholics are one or the other. My real point is that I find it disturbing that there are some DU'ers who blithely post incredibly offensive things about Catholics, and if they can sneak it in, about Jews as well, and then claim that they are expressing an opinion on a topic, when their real goal is to flame Catholics who belong to the board. Maybe I haven't been around DU that long, but I've never seen someone start a thread saying 'I'm Catholic and I know Atheists are going to hell'. But I have seen quite a few threads which call religion things such as fantasy, mythology and stupidity.

Someone responded to one of my posts (in the thread abt the Pope's remarks on the tsunami) saying that 'the Pope didn't read DU.' I guess that was her rationale for defending the stupid comment that I had complained about. Her response said it all, which I doubt she even realized: the Pope isn't the person being insulted with those types of inappropriate comments, its other DU'ers who are. And if people are trying to maintain cohesiveness in some way as Democrats, insulting the people who are on your side isn't a very effective tactic.

[demosincebirth]

15. I agree with you position, Thank DU for

opening up this forum where we can discuss political and catholic issues without having to endure immediate slander to our faith, from those who seem to know everything about Christianity and Catholicism.

[DemBones DemBones]

18. I've been at DU almost since the beginning. I discovered it

very soon after it began (January 2001) and I lurked for months and months before finally registering and beginning to post (fear of Big Brother Ashcroft, you know!)

In all that time, I've never seen a Catholic start a thread saying "I'm Catholic and I know all atheists are going to Hell," or anything remotely comparable to that.

Exactly, the Pope doesn't read DU, so the slams on him are really slams on us, the Catholic members of DU.

And WHY are they attacking us? Trying to deliver the entire Catholic vote to the GOP?

[AngryOldDem]

20. But, but...there's no bias here, Princess!

It's all in the eye of the beholder.

I'm currently being baited in a GD religion thread by someone who has been around long enough to know how religious-themed posts usually go on DU.

We're accused of also dishing it out.

I'm tired of arguing the obvious, and I find it funny that it's only she who is debating this with me. All the other usual suspects are there and they're staying out of this discussion, perhaps because they know I have a point.

[DemBones DemBones]

17. Absolutely correct! I am fairly conservative on social issues,

more so than some Catholics, less so than others.

For instance:

My opposition to abortion is part of my belief the seamless garment approach to life issues: I oppose war, capital punishment, abortion, and euthanasia. The first two positions progressives agree on while the second two are regarded as "conservative" views. Yet they're all about not killing other human beings.

I oppose abortion but do not support criminalizing it. The only real way to stop abortion is to effect a massive change in people's hearts and minds. Criminalizing it would just result in an increase in crime: people performing and having abortions.

I could support resticting abortion, keeping it legal only in cases where the mother's life is truly at risk unless she has an abortion (a very rare case, despite the "pro-choice" rhetoric on this issue ), perhaps in certain rape and incest cases.

I support people's right to use contraception, though the Church opposes birth control of any sort, by either abortion or contraception. I believe better use of contraceptives could drastically reduce the demand for abortion.

I support the human rights of homosexuals of both sexes, as does the Catholic Church. They are as much children of God as heterosexuals are.

I support same sex civil unions but oppose same sex marriage. I oppose marriage for same sex couples because it attempts to make a radical change in an ancient institution in order to secure same sex couples the same economic and legal rights as married couples. I support the ends (equal rights) but not the means. Conditions do not have to be exactly the same for there to be equality.

[JohnKleeb]

16. I wasnt aware of the extent of it but it doesnt surprise me

[DemBones DemBones]

19. Hey, we have TWO Catholic Princesses. And I'd

only heard about Jewish American Princesses! ;-)

(Know what a Jewish American Princess (aka a JAP) makes for dinner?

Reservations.)

Back in the eighties I was teaching high school and used to hear good JAP jokes from our school's librarian, a good librarian and person who was also Jewish and (of course) a Democrat.