Just a general FYI for my participation here.....

[steve2470]

I just want to make sure we're all on the same page as far as my writing here is concerned, and there's no misunderstandings or hard feelings:
1- If you have issues with your doctor or therapist, you really should face them and tell them, or at least write them.
2- Getting off medication should always be done under competent medical supervision, and not "cold turkey".
3- Taking medication or not is your personal decision, and I won't touch that decision at all because of liability issues. However, in general, I am in favor of patients taking the appropriate medication for their psychiatric diagnoses.
4- If you're suicidal at all, you really should be talking to a human being either in person or on the phone. Suicide is a permanent solution to a problem that can usually either be "fixed" or at least coped with/accepted. If you can't find anyone, at least call 911 and talk to the operator. Going to the hospital is better than death, in my humble opinion.
5- If you have issues with a particular psychiatric hospital or ward or ER, write the CEO of that hospital and tell him or her.
6- All doctors in the USA are accountable to their respective state medical boards. Therefore, if you cannot resolve a problem by talking to your doctor, and you're still angry or unhappy with him or her, you can always go to the state medical board. Lawsuits, of course, are always an option as well.
7- If you have issues with the way the police handled your commitment to a hospital, you need to take it up with the Chief of Police in that particular jurisdiction. Lawsuits, again, usually get attention, if all else fails.
8- If you have issues with a particular psychotropic medication (such as Prozac or Paxil or Zyprexa, etc.), you need to address them with the particular pharmaceutical company. Again, sometimes lawsuits or class action lawsuits get attention. I am NOT an apologist for any psychotropic drug, and I will NOT recommend any in particular, again for liability reasons.
9- If you are not happy with your psychotherapy or psychiatric help, for God's sake, please tell the treatment providers ! They cannot read your mind. Usually, your complaints can be resolved. If not, they can always refer you to a competent provider.
10- If you are not in psychotherapy or counseling, PLEASE consider it. In most locations, there are "free clinics" or "sliding fee scale" clinics which base the fee on your income or lack thereof. In this day and age, there is NO excuse to not seek help. Even some churches have decent counseling.
11- If you are not "getting results" from your particular therapist, please at least discuss the situation with your therapist. Maybe he or she is just not right for you. The "fit" between therapist and client/patient is very personal and sometimes it takes trial and error to find the "right" therapist.
12- If your psychiatrist does not listen to you, then COMPLAIN to him or her. You are the BOSS ! You can fire him or her, usually. However, sometimes the doctor does listen and just does not agree with you.
13- When you see your doctor, please open up and tell him or her what is wrong with you. Don't try to impress the doc or hide your symptoms. That is only hurting you in the long run.
14 - The reason for my edit LOL: PLEASE try to write down or memorize the exact psychotropic medications you are on and their dosages, for many reasons. Also, PLEASE read the paper that your pharmacist gives you or look up your med on the internet or in the PDR. Try not to freak out about the 1000 or so possible side effects that are listed. You may be fortunate and have none, or very few that you can "live with". All patients/clients should know what they are taking and WHY.

Whew ! That does it for today. I know there is a lot more I could say, but that covers a lot. Maybe this could be made into a sticky here. Just a thought.
Steve

[DemExpat]

1. My feelings on this....

There are several of us here who have been through the regular medical psychiatric/professional mill - some for many years - and have found more lasting and "real" relief after getting off of all medication, so if there is still a lot of room here in this group for those of us who are not necessarily recommending medication for all mental health problems, then your experience, knowledge and presence is welcome, Steve.

I personally just would not like to see a "takeover" of the atmosphere here by someone with training who enthousiastically wants to help those by constantly steering the discussion towards the pharmaceutical "solution"....

I hope you understand and respect the medication-free approach and experiences too.


Just my view,

DemEx

[steve2470]

2. yes of course ! :-) eom

[steve2470]

3. an addendum: there are alternative ways to approach..

mental illness, some with more empirical research backing than others. However, everyone is responsible for their own health and as such are free to explore their healthcare choices. Unfortunately, the harsh reality for mental health practicioners is that if one of us "recommends" a particular therapy or herb or modality, and it fails spectacularly, resulting in a suicide or a homicide, then that practiticioner gets sued, loses their license, etc. That being said, I can't, of course, recommend anything that is not "approved", but I'm more than happy to read your posts about your results. I am not wedded to the pharmacy companies, not by a long shot :-)

[DemExpat]

13. That is the crux of it....

Unfortunately, the harsh reality for mental health practicioners is that if one of us "recommends" a particular therapy or herb or modality, and it fails spectacularly, resulting in a suicide or a homicide, then that practiticioner gets sued, loses their license, etc.

This pushes any professional support or treatment of mental illness to the pharmaceutical solution imo - not a good trend, and not always in the best interests of the person needing some help.

For this reason I personally do not generally trust professionals to look beyond their limited (imo) view of mental illness.

And which is why I am not participating on an open forum on a large Mental Health Forum - I like this informal group of people who have personal experience with these struggles.

BTW - my brother in law killed himself 2 years ago while undergoing several years of therapy and being on Anti-Depressives.....
I would say that his medical treatment/support failed spectacularly, but do not expect his therapist OR the drug company to be sued or to lose their license....their bases are (generally) legally covered because their approach is condoned, whereas other complementary, not mainstream medical treatments are not.

Meds and good psychotherapy saved my life - several times - but long - term use was very negative for me, and my real self-empowerment, understanding, and experience developed when I kicked the meds and turned to other views.

Complementary meds approaches (Homeopathy and some herbs), improving diet, exercises, kicking caffeine, sugar, taking vitamin/mineral supplements and Omega essential oils, relaxation, writing thoughts and feelings down in a journal for processing, learning to say "NO" to lots of things, etc. etc. etc. have helped me heal and obtain some balance in my life.

I feel most strongly that it is vital to have informed and broadened choices - especially in dealing with mental dis-ease!

:hi:

DemEx

[EFerrari]

4. Hi there, Steve

All my relationships in the area of mental health issues are with peers. Here and everywhere. I've found that, for myself and for my family, participation in those relationships generates trust, caring and creativity.

What do you see as your relationship to this group.

Best,
Beth

[steve2470]

5. i'd like to answer some questions and offer some support when

I can. I'll have to get my own support elsewhere lol :-)

[EFerrari]

8. Thanks for your response.

And I wonder why you'd think you'd have to get your own support elsewhere?

I truly appreciate you extending yourself to this group. And, btw, I'm also new to it. I'm a doc of English with extensive training in psych. And I'm hoping to learn much here, to share and give back when possible.

But, want to make this suggetion: Anyone who deals with mental health issues 24/7 is a pro by definition.

We consumers have a lot of information, we have a lot to share. Thanks for being here. I hope you'll find this group as comforting as I have.

best,
Beth

[steve2470]

9. Thanks, I appreciate the appreciation. If I have a really bad day

I'll tell all of you about it :-(

[EFerrari]

10. Super

And I hope if you have a sort of neutral day and just have a thought or even a good day, you'll dish us as well.

Sky's the limit.

[steve2470]

11. ok lol You're on, so to speak :-) j eom

[jdots]

6. is this condescension ?

[steve2470]

7. no, I'm just trying to be helpful to those who don't know the

system intimately. No condescenscion intended.

[undergroundpanther]

12. I think

Professionals can get this I can help additude..note the*I* in that sentance, yes you can help.You may have axcess to information we don't have..but remember unless you have been on the other end off a "professional" you really can't say you have experinced it.

In the hospital a patient has EVERY human right taken away or potentially every right taken away. Even the integrity of saying what goes into your own body can be violated by force"for your own good".
Mental illness isn't just an individual hell,it's a socio dynamic hell that creates it's own problems reactions and solutions. Alot of professionals tend to think if you fixit all inside a person with therapy they will be'normal"..But society is sick..and no matter how you work reality does not all of a sudden get"kind" people die,people act like assholes,wars happen.. Sometimes fixing it ain't the cure. Because in reality there is no such thing as normal,and it's the"professionals" these schooled cultural engineer do gooders who take it upon themselves the job to enforce and create what normal is and impose it on the different.Why did you choose to be a therapist? Don't tell me a pat answerr like because you care..I wanna know what motivates you to care..

In effect a hospital is a mindfuck,because it's a totalitarian state, within a free country(well sorta free).The hospital has traumatic effects on people in it,be they staff or patients alike (think a milque toast or not so milquetoast kind of stanford expirament).

Professionals who have never been patients have real psychological trouble seeing how thier helpfulness can be seen by patients or people with mental illnesses as arrogance,thier concern as condenscending,thier information as "proseletyzing". Triggers abound from "treatments" people have suffered through.

I hope you learn alot here about yourself,and healing.I hope you grow to understand what it's like to really be on the inside.That you understand where the patients defensiveness comes from and why it's legit and it's reasons so you never become "professional" enough to lose your heart and soul in maintaining the system.

[EFerrari]

14. #12 How I Fired L.A. County

Steve,

Your #12 reminded of something and it made me laugh. It's funny now, although at the time I was so mad that it was all I could do to shut up and just do measured breathing.

My partner's Dx doesn't read well an hour at a time. He's so great about getting himself seen, about following instructions, much better than I am in fact. But, his situation just doesn't "present" very well in 50 minute segments.

So, for several years, no one got that he was dealing with BPD AND with a measure of autism. And I was too much of a recovering Catholic good girl to assert myself, even if the folks at the other end had the skill to fold in the family. (Rolling my good eye.)

Anyway, this all led to nasties, like upsets where Christmas trees got tossed through windows, lights and all. Long story shorter, at one point we were separated and Doug was taken in by his friends. I heard he was homeless and called his mentor to send him down to me in L.A.

So, I called around and we headed into the biggest clinic in the county, the only one that treated BPD. We were told they had a very specific program for him but it was full and meantime, he could see a therp and get his meds monitored.

Eighteen months went by. The meds doc put him on some standard protocol that didn't work for him, and then gave up, prescribing whatever I asked for. I put in hours and hours on the net researching because I'm an English type, not a pharmacologist!

Ditto for the therapist. There was nothing happening there. No DBT, no skills training, nada. And poor Doug was decompensating every 5 to 7 days. Don't know how either of us made it through.

I called, and went with him and did everything but picket the clinic. And was alternately ignored and had my boundaries violated but good. It was a mess.

Before the last decomp, I called the clinic and told them flat out, I was in danger from the decomps, Doug hadn't gotten one minute of appropriate care and if anything happened to either of us, it would be their @sses. No one returned my call. I called again, and the doc said, "I can't keep doing this with you." Wtf?

Doug decomped, got scared, took all of our money and left the house, I went to the hospital with a concussion. (Shaking my head, hugging us all retroactively.) He landed in jail for possession of pot.

That was Sept 10, 2001.

By 9/12, I was recovered enough to put us back together. I called the jail and found him. Got through to Psych Services and an angel took down the list of the meds he was on. (Eventually, the charges were dropped. This is just the way they handle people who have psych problems and no treatment.)

Then, I called the clinic's director. I told him he was fired. I faxed him a list of the times I'd called and stated my concerns and been put off. He seemed particularly concerned about the fact that I wrote to my support group daily, and had an entry for every single day Doug had been (not) treated at the clinic.

Than, I called the therapist and the psychiatrist and fired them, too. I would have called the receptionist and fired him, too but, he actually DID his job.

(So, that left me with Doug coming home and no team. But, that's where we'd been for over a year and a half.)

In the end, I called up a therapist that Doug had seen in another town and whom I'd really respected. Begged her to do phone work with him and she was on board. Scoured the town for a real doctor and begged the family to pay his fee. It was huge and worth every penny.

Since that happened, Doug has had one minor decomp in over two and a half years. And now we both have the skills to handle them quickly and safely. We eventually came back north, so Doug actually sees his therapist and has a wonderful meds doc. Blessings, both of them.

I worry about all the people who go to that clinic who don't speak English or who just believe that's how things are or something. If I had the ovarian fortitude, I would sue. Not to be mean, but to get change for those people and their families.

As it is, I know we couldn't have gone through that without my on line support group. Because there was nothing for me in real time, for either of us, & those good people at the other end of a phone line were there for me 100%.