what is involved in finishing a basement?

[grasswire]

A friend is renting with the intention of buying an old craftsman house circa 1911. The basement has a cement floor and walls that are partly plastered over but in poor shape. The basement is not totally dry in a rain storm -- it took on an inch of water in one corner in a recent downpour. We fixed the downspout outside in that corner and believe that may control any leakage.

We're wondering what on earth it takes to finish off part of a basement so that it is dry and habitable for some activities and storage. How do you make it sealed and dry?

And how would you do it on an absolute bare budget?

[Stinky The Clown]

1. Books have been written on this very subject .....

The solution may be easy or prohibitively expensive.

Interestingly, you made the right start with the downspout. Water comes from someplace. You need to find that someplace and make it go someplace else.

Old foundations (and some new ones, for that matter) are pretty porous. My sense is that your friend's house has rubble stone walls instead of concrete block. That was pretty typical for that era. The mortar joints, therefore, were very uneven and often had gaps or voids in them. These would be inside the mortar and likely not visible from the outside. But they form a conduit for water.

Assuming water gets to the foundation. The other thing that happens over time is the grading outside the house tends to settle such that the area near the house is either flat or lower than the surrounding area. Water, in effect, runs toward the house rather than away. Ideally, a perimeter of, say, 3 or 4 feet all around the house should slope at least 1 inch per foot **away** from the house. This will carry normal surface water, as from rain, away from the house.

Also be sure the downspouts are not only in good repair but also such that they carry water away from the house. Drain pipe extensions are the solution here. You want them to carry water beyond the perimeter I described above.

Also, let's hope there are no underground springs that are carrying water to the foundation. These are invisible from the surface, become overactive in and after a rain, and are near impossible to correct.

If this doesn't cure the water problem, then you're in deeper (so to speak :) ) Now we have to look to the foundation itself. And that is a job for a pro and isn't cheap.

There are several approaches and without knowing your situation exactly, no one can know the right one.

Install a sump pump and accept that water comes in. When it does, the pump, set down in a sump, would get rid of it.

Install a French Drain around the perimeter of the foundation. This involves excavating all around the foundation and exposing it to the very bottom. The resulting trench is filled with gravel and a series of pipes. The water drains quickly through the gravel, goes into the pipes, and the pipes run it off to a lower part of the property. This is very expensive and not without some risk to the foundation's integrity.

Do the sump and pump thing and add a second floor, several inches above the concrete floor. In essence, accept the water infiltration, make provisions to pump it out, and keep everything in the basement at a level where the water won't reach. A moisture barrier below the second floor is also needed. This is a spotty solution. Sometimes it works and sometimes it doesn't. The basement will likely always be damp. A dehumidifier might help.

There are also some foundation wall coatings that a said to work, but I have zero experience with them. One brand name, sold here on the east coast, and maybe out west, too, is UGL Drylok (or drylock ... or dryloc .... not sure). It looks for al the world like paint, but the company claims it stops water, even water under some pressure. They always show it on block walls. I don't know if they suggest it for rubble walls.

Anyway, the key is in my opening sentence. Find where the water's coming from and make it go someplace else.

Good luck!

[grasswire]

6. thanks for the suggestions

Our work on the downspouts/gutters seems to have prevented another flood because we had heavy rain again today with no water in the basement. On research, the experts give three keywords. Gutter, grade, barrier. So you were right on.

I still can't envision how one finishes off a basement, though. Wood framing screwed to the plastered walls? Is that how it's done? I understand there must be a subfloor, and vinyl could go over that.

I guess I need to get a handyman book to see what's involved. I did find out yesterday that the local independent hardware store is full of cheerful and helpful men -- those who work there and those buying stuff.

[Stinky The Clown]

7. If the walls are smooth and relatively even and plumb .....

you nail studs or furring to the walls and go from there as for conventional room finishing (drywall, panelling, whatever). If the walls are uneven, as they would be in a rubble stone foundation, you build walls inside the foundation walls. In essence, you build a building within the building.

Once framed, finishing is as for any other room.

Be sure to put an appropriate moisture barrier between the wall and the foundation.

[Jersey Devil]

9. After making sure there is no water I'd frame it

Install a vapor barrier after making sure your leaks have stopped.

Anchor the lumber to the concrete floor using a nail gun (you can rent one) making sure you use pressure treated lumber on anything touching the floor (that is code now) and then just frame it out 16" on center.

If you are thinking of putting in a toilet or sink yourself make sure you install a butterfly valve so if the sewers back up you don't get sewage in your basement.

[bleedingheart]

2. French Drains first...

sorry to be a downer but I would really recommend that french drains be dug around the house to insure that no more water gets in that basement before investing in a finished basement.

This is what my bro-in-law did to dry up his basement ...and it worked!

1. He hired a guy to dig up the ground around his foundation....I would say the trench was about three feet wide or more...

2. He then repaired the outer wall of the foundation which was built with flagstone, I think he called it parging??? Then he coated it in tar and then...he put foam insulation over it.

3. He then put some driveway gravel in and then laid the french drains..filled out the rest in gravel after the drains were in.

The basement is dry dry dry....and this is an over 100 year old house.

You don't need to hire someone to do the digging...you can rent a trenching machine to create the drains...and you don't have to go as crazy as my BIL did...but ...I would do that before putting any money into the basement.

My neighbor just put in his french drains (I bought my house with them already in...the previous owner of my house installed them)

[Stinky The Clown]

3. French drains may well be the answer, but ......

..... I think I'd try the less draconian measures first .... like adjusting the grading near the house and adjusting the downspouts. These fixes are free to cheap. If they work .... great. Money saved. If not .... then bring in the heavy artillary.

[porter]

4. Very old Basements

I agree with H2S on several steps you should follow.

we had an old Victorian built in the late 1800'c with a basement.

The walls were of little problem but the floors would leak after long periods od rain. when you walked on some sections little water spout would well up in the cracks. We were at one of the highest elevations in that town.

One are not addressed is the drains in the basement. Make sure there is a one way flow valve in all drains. We did not have them and a blockage in the sewer lines came into the basement.

We never finished the basement off but, fear not,it was a very good climate controlled area to make wine. This did reduce some other expenses.

Best of luck

[NMDemDist2]

5. welcome to DU and to the DIY gang too!

:hi:

[On the Road]

8. Sounds Like the Water is as Much of an Issue as Finishing the Basement

It's possible that diverting the downspouts and the French drains will keep the water out. But if they don't, and water is seeping up from under the house, you might need a sump pump.

What's involved is digging a hole and installing a container to catch seeping water and a pump that pumps it out of the house. To get water from all areas, a small ditch should be dug around the inside walls of the basement, sloping a little down into the sump pump container. The ditch is then filled with gravel and resealed with concrete. (You can also put small pieces of pipe at the bottom to help drain.)

It's a fairly big job, but it's sometimes the only way to control water in the basement. I had a neighborhood person put one in for $1200.

Now, if you want to have a semi-finished basement (concrete floors), you might not need to keep all the water out. If it collects in one corner, simply don't use that corner or block it off. Keep other items off the floor in areas that may flood.

[Lefty48197]

10. Basement water problems are ALMOST always caused by the

slope of the soil around the house. You should have a clear steady one foot drop in the elevation of the soil around you house as you move away from the foundation over a length of about ten feet.

[Jersey Devil]

11. Add clogged gutters and leaders

Even houses that never have had water in the basement will have infiltration if water is allowed to overflow the gutters, pouring straight down right next to the foundation.

[wildeyed]

12. We had serious water problems in our last circa 1920's house.

When it rained hard, all the water from the backyard went under the house and into the basement, plus we had a small spring. :crazy:

We dug a French drain around the interior wall, fixed the sump pump and put everything that could be damaged on cement blocks. That worked most of the time. There was one really amazing storm when the power went out and the water got really high down there. We needed repair work on both the washing machine and the furnace after that one.

To completely fix the problem would have required almost 10k worth of work, so we never had it done. I figured that water had been going into that basement for 80 years, a few more would not hurt.

The best bet is to have a waterproofing company in for a quote.