question on tile installations

[NMDemDist2]

I read on DU somewhere (Environment & Energy perhaps?) that folks on the southern Adriatic Sea tile their walls half way up as a thermal mass for cooling in the summers

I am thinking about that in my new house, but DH says you can't lay tile vertically on wall board. what DO you use to attach tile on vertical surfaces?

Ideally I could run water pipes under the horizontal areas that reverse direction for heating and cooling with my solar system and am planning a thermal mass/passive solar room as well. but on walls without a southern exposure I'm thinking tile would be a great look and an environmentally attractive alternative to tons of refrigerated air handlers

any suggestions anyone?

[Stinky The Clown]

1. I'm not sure about he thing with the water pipes .....

But tile can certainly be mounted up wallboard. Don't you have tile in your bathroom? Am I misunderstanding something?

You put tile on vertical surfaces the same way you put it on horizontal surfaces. You apply it with thinset mortar. Use those plastic 'X' shaped spacers to hold it in place. Sometimes you might need to use some blue painter's tape to keep the tile from slipping, like a bullnose where the tile field ends.

Tile can also be set on a mud base on walls, but this requires a LOT of skill to accomplish. In my mind, the mud layer is where one would put the thin pipes for the heating/cooling system you describe (or at least as I **think** I'm understanding it).

[NMDemDist2]

2. it's passive heating H2S and the pipes run along the floor under the tile

you run the cold water up to the solar panels in summer to cool the house and in the winter you run it down from the panels to heat the floor

the wall tiles would be big heavy saltillo style buggers that would act as a passive temp holder (no pipes there) in winter the sun shines thru the windows and heats the tile and they give it off all night

in summer, no sun would hit them (due to good engineering on the over hangs) so they would be cool

see whaddImean jellybean? what i'm wondering is if I need any special supports for big heavy tiles on a vertical surface

[Stinky The Clown]

6. Okie doke, now I got it.

First, downthread is a note about a 'ledger' board. That's a part of doing the job right and is actually the starting point for any tiling job on a wall. Assume you're floor's not level. Cuz it ain't. No floor's level.

Go around the perimeter of the room and find the **lowest** point in the floor, where it abuts the wall. Measure up from that the distance of one base tile (which may or may not be your wall tile, if you're going to use a special base tile, like, say, a cove) plus two grout lines. If the base tile is such that it can't be cut because its a special shape or something, then measure up one grout line, one base tile plus one grout line plus one field tile plus one more grout line. This is the point where your first full tile will start. Draw a short line there.

Keep in mind that you have just located the one point (the low point on the floor) at which two full tiles will fit from floor to the line you struck. As the floor gets higher, you'll have to cut tiles to fit. That's okay. The cuts are least noticeable here.

Now get a 1x3 or 1x4 board and set it dead even with the line you drew. Screw the board to the wall with a drywall screw into a stud. Now level the board with a spirit level and screw it to a few more studs. No need to drive the screw home, as you'll be taking it out again.

Recheck everything to be sure the board's top is level with the line you drew as a marker and that it is dead level.

Carry the line around the entire room, including across doorways and make sure it lines back up with the original line after carrying it fully around the room. You'll use this guide line to refasten the 'ledger' board (actually called a 'batter board', I think) as you move from one work area to the next.

Now spread mortar above the board and set the first row of tiles. use those little 'X' shaped plastic spacers to keep the tiles evenly apart. You put these in with one leg set into the grout line. Don't set them flat against the wall at the bottom of the grout space with two legs touching a corner of the tile; you'll never get 'em out.

Now, spread the second course of mortar and put up the second course of tile, again using the spacers to keep them equidistant and equally spaced above the tiles below. Until the mortar sets, the board and the little plastic thingies will carry the weight and are very capable of carrying a full wall height's worth of tile, so don't worry about that.

You may, from time to time, need to use some blue painters tape to keep a tile or three from sagging or pulling away from the wall. Not to worry. When the mortar sets, all will stay in place.

Anyway, that's about it. When all is set and dried and firm, remove all the plastic thingies and the boards. Now go back and set your base tiles, but only if there will be a second course above that also needs to be set. If the base tiles themselves will be cut to fit, read the next step. If there is a course above the base, I'd set just the base and then go back and measure and cut each second course tile.

Whether for a base course that gets cut to fit, or for the second course that gets cut to fit, the next step is the same. Its best to number each cut tile in some way so you know where each one goes. Set the base tile on a plastic thingie on its side so as to keep a space at the floor/wall joint. Install all the base tiles and then install the second course, fitting each cut tile where it belongs. use spaces at every tile.

When this part dries, that's it. You're ready to grout.

Do you know how to grout?

on edit ...... a good guide to doing this is one of the 8-1/2 by 11 paperback glossy books you see at Home Depot or Lowes. Sunset is a good publisher. they all have titles on tiling. Get one. It will be maybe 12 or 15 bux and well worth it. The illustrations alone will be invaluable. They will also give you instructions on how to best arrange your tiles left to right so you avoid unsightly ultra short tiles at one end - the sure mark of an amateur job.

They also talk about grouting and the ever hateful caulking.

Don't get me started on caulking. Caulking's a royal pain in the ass. Really. It sucks. Butcha gotta do it.

Tiling is really pretty easy once you get a groove going. The only problem I;'ve had (and its only been lately) is an aching back and knees from the bending. (I am NOT going to say I'm old ... cuz I'm not. Really, I ain't old. :) ) The actual doing is **very** easy.

[Stinky The Clown]

7. About finding the floor's low spot ......

.... that may be harder to do than to describe. Since you're going to be using large (12-ish by 12-ish) saltillo tiles, here's an alternative. I'll assume you're not using a special base tile, instead polanning to run the wall tile right down to the floor.

Measure up from the floor a distance that is approximately 2/3 to 3/4 the height of one tile and set the batter board there. With this method, you'll likely have to cut every base tile, but you avoid the need to find that elusive low spot.

[NMDemDist2]

9. as always, your knowledge is awesome! and tell me about the old

knees and hips. I painted all the baseboards here one day which entailed sanding, wiping, taping off the floors and walls then painting.

i was fine once I got my butt down on the floor, but it was a major undertaking to get my old arse back up

:rofl:

[Kingshakabobo]

3. I agree with HUBS........

No problem tiling up wallboard. I had my bathroom done from floor to ceiling.

The tiler used a neat trick. He screwed a horizontal "1 by" ledger-board about half way up to split the work in two. He did the top part first, working up to the ceiling and then worked down to the floor. He had to do this because the tile was heavier marble. Depending how high you go, and how heavy your tile is, you may want to use the ledger trick so the weight of the tile doesn't cause settling. Also, I think the trick might help if you have a really un-even floor...

[NMDemDist2]

4. i'm thinking it will almost work like a waistcotting. tile half way up

and regular walls on the top. that way I can still have my art work hung with out a cement drill bit LOL

[politicat]

5. There's a mass principle and an evaporation principle.

Tile on wallboard gives slightly more mass, which will keep things a little cooler, but the real cooling effect from floor and wall tile is when it can be used as a slow evaporator.

That requires unglazed tile, a water-safe substrate and water. Old houses in Yuma have terra cotta floors and walls, and the idea is to sluice them down with water every morning, so that as the day goes by, the water evaporates slowly and cools the air. Sure, there are puddles first thing in the morning, but they dry up. Terra cotta jars with lids will do the same thing (the Russian solution).

Most of those houses don't have wallboard, though. They're either concrete block or brick or adobe construction with interior block walls, too, and on concrete foundations.

And yeah, it works. Really, really well, or it did, when Yuma wasn't mostly paved and it still got cool at night. (I hear that doesn't happen anymore.) Any place that's still more desert than urban and has less than 30% average humidity is going to be okay for it.

[NMDemDist2]

8. that might be just the ticket in the old farm house in NM i'm looking at

cuz there is a screened in porch that I think will work as a passive solar mass. if that is indeed the case, "sluicing" the tiles down in summer may be a real possiblity

we'll see when i go back over there and check out the layout of the property :bounce: