Plumbing Problem, Need Some Suggestions Please

[Coyote_Bandit]

This is an old house built in the late 50's. Laundry connections are in the garage. House is "L" shaped and the main drain line makes two 90 degree bends before exiting the house.

I recently replaced the washer and now the washer drain overflows. Never had this problem before - and this washer is the same capacity as the one that I replaced.

From what I can tell, it's not the drain or the line being clogged, it's simply that the drain can't handle the pressure and amount of water thrown out during the spin cycles.

I should probably also mention that about a month before purchasing the washer there was a plumber here who did check the main drain line and found no problems.

Would appreciate any suggestions as to how to resolve this issue.

[Hassin Bin Sober]

1. That may be a question for the pros. I would check here:

http://www.plbg.com/forum/list.php?1

[randr]

2. Venting problem most likely

If the washer is draining faster with more volume you may have a venting problem. Many homes were built with inadequate drain venting and will not handle the volume of modern appliances.
A length of hose to extend the exhaust hose into the drain may work, making sure the extended hose is as large or larger than the one from the washer. Simple hose clamps will make the connection.
A permanent, up to code--depending on local issues, solution is to have a plumber install a vent to the exterior. If allowed an internal wall vent system may be used.
Good Luck!

[Wash. state Desk Jet]

3. I ran into that at home.

I re plumbed a bit and moved the washer dryer out into our store room ,than drained the washer straight into the drain line. ran the drain line up the wall of course. And of course it over flowed. I added a deep sink and drained the water into washer deep sink. It drains fine. so if you don't have the deep sink ,get one. The washer deep sink holds the full volume of water pumped out of the washer and allows it drain as it will.

On venting, indeed that may help ,you can buy a out the the wall vent that plumbs in to the drain plumb out. Than you reconnect yer under the sink assemble. About $30.00 for that item,and it comes with all parts and instalation instructions- Home Depot or Lowe's or any builders supply will carry those.

Also you might treat the drain line. Get a bottle of Drain Care. About $9.00. follow the directions.

Again if you do have a deep sink-it is always good to have one . you may have to reconfigure the drain line somewhat. As it is now, your washer has a stronger pump mortar and the volume has increased.

If you have any questions about reconfiguring your drain line to accommodate the deep sink
,, feel free to ask.Also it is always nice to have that extra facet with the sprayer at the laundry ,that's if you don't have that. If you don't than of course you plumb in your water lines and valves for your sink, but those water lines are already visible so you can see that job is easy.

[Wash. state Desk Jet]

4. And

since yer laundry connections are out in the garage ,to add a vent you can go out the side of the garage and straight up over the roof or up the side. Of course there is a 90 degree bend coming out. But my guess is that is not necessary. You can also get up on the roof and snake out yer vent, that may help all drainage. I don't know about yer local codes but venting or adding a vent that way is a exceptable method most places.And, if yer go through the soffits, you can buy the vent to install up on thr roof ,you just slip the vent under the roofing material and connect up yer vent line. A little roofing sealent around the edges . The vent should be above the roof by about 12 inchs,Anywhoo, it's a pre fab vent and will be code exceptable.

Again if you don't have a laundry deep sink,that really is the way to go. And since the house was built in the fifties, you have yer 1 1/2 inch drain going into your main line, there could be some build up in the inch and one half line.

By the way what happens when you stick the garden hose in the drain, ? Thats how you run a simple test. If it drains just fine with the garden hose in there ,than it's the volume of water the washer is pumping out.

Do the experiment and get back with test reusult !

good luck.

[Coyote_Bandit]

5. Apparently my suspected problem is a common one

Since I've had the new washer less than a month I called the service department that sold and installed it. They'll be here sometime on Saturday. Since they don't do plumbing work and have no reason to sell their plumbing services I'll let them be the ones to confirm (or deny) my suspicions regarding the source of the water that appears when doing laundry.

I don't have a sink in the garage and I don't have space to add one. The washer and dryer sit between a chimney and the door into the house - which means they can't be vented to the outside through the wall.

The new washer has the same capacity as the old washer. The old washer drained just fine. There was a plumber here a couple of months ago (not a drain related issue - he installed a secondary cut-off and a pressure regulator on the water main). When he was here I asked him to check the drain line in the yard for obstructions from tree roots and to check the main drain from the house. He snaked both the yard and most of the house (didn't go past the 90 degree bend) and found no obstructions. I've got no reason to think that there is any drain obstruction - assuming of course that the doggies aren't flushing things they shoudn't in my absence.

Thanks for sharing your experience. I'll report back after the service guy visits this weekend.

[Wash. state Desk Jet]

7. OK than !

Given the additional information I would venture to say raising the drain line may solve the issue. Now since you mentioned experience ,when installing those stacking washer and dryers and in some cases plumbing in for those,the stacker's drain directly into the drain line. In fact there is a box that you buy extra that has the drain hook up and the hot and cold water valves. Now, in a second story install of course if yer plumbing runs straight down ,the length of now 2 inch drain lines by code isn't a problem. That last stacker I installed was a straight shot form the basement drain up to the enclosed porch where the stacker's were installed. The run of drain line straight up in the old 1 1/2 inch drain lines was just enough . In other words it drains just fine. The old plumbing accommodated the change.

In short what I am getting at is this, can you add to your drain line, can you raise it up? That may compensate for the volume of water pumped out by your new washer. As those pumps wear ,those pumps also decease in pressure meaning the rate in speed and volume flow slows down. Yer new washer pump is more powerful.Also the product Drain Care,Draino makes it's equivalent- what the stuff does is it breaks down those hard deposit build up's in your drain lines. Now, your home was built in the fifties and if it has not been re plumed ,and my guess is it has not,than you do have hard deposit build up in those drain lines. So Drain Care is a good thing to use on those pipes. Home Depot and Lowe's has that Drain Care and Draino's equivalent to it. It is a green color liquid ,Drain Care makes the stuff in you mix it form or powder,- good for about 40 treatments.

Be interested to know what the out come is after they look it over this week end.

Good Luck.

[Coyote_Bandit]

9. I've used DrainCare for years

The previous owners installed a tub liner in one of the bathrooms. DUMBEST. FRICKIN. IDEA. EVER. The stopper in the tub cannot be removed. I've read everything, tried everything, asked a plumber to remove the damn thing (when none of the normal mechanisms for removal worked he offered to cut it out) and have called the manufacturer for specific directions regarding removal of the damn thing. Nothing works. Because a tub liner requires a longer bathtub drain, it seems that it is not uncommon for installers to use a number of methods to jury rig the installation - some of which make removal of various pasts difficult if not impossible. As a problem preventative I use a hair clog remover and DrainCare monthly in that fricking bathtub. Word of advice to anyone redoing a bathroom: avoid tub liners like the plague - they don't save much money in the remodel and they can create a lot of problems.

I assume that I can raise the drain line for the washer up but I'm not positive of that. The drain is plumbed into the wall between the cold and hot water lines. So far as I'm aware there aren't any electrical or structural issues to prevent raising the drain line but I haven't investigated. Both the washer and dryer sit on a ledge above the garage floor and I didn't opt to unhook everything and wrangle it around to investigate the leak. I'll let the service guys do that.

[Warpy]

6. I wish they'd start putting those deep sinks into laundry rooms

especially now that front loading washers and dryers stack so well. Those deep sinks come in handy for a lot besides draining a washer. They're good for handwashing more than one item at a time (and spinning it out in the washer), washing miniblinds, filling mop buckets, and generally doing big washing jobs the kitchen sink is too small to do.

Your suggestion was a truly great one.

[Coyote_Bandit]

8. If there were a spot for one of those sinks

I'd have it installed in a heartbeat. It would be far easier to scrub the (small) doggies in a laundry sink.....

[Coyote_Bandit]

10. Update

The service guy was here earlier today. Seems there is a water valve in the washer itself that is leaking. The valve is located in the same back corner where the drain connections are. Service guy seems to think that he will get the part in two or three days so hopefully I can get it installed by the end of the week. Then I can do some more laundry to test both the washer and the drain capacity. More later.

Thanks for all your suggestions.

[Wash. state Desk Jet]

11. It seems you were almost there yourself.

A leak in a place other than the drain occurred to me in thought. Your decision to let the service repair people unravel the hoses at all connections was a good choice.

That may the problem.

Leaking at the pump mortar could be another problem. Look around the bottom of the machine when you put it back into operation. A leak in the pump mortar or seal would require replacement of the machine by the store you bought it from.

Come to think about it, have you thought about calling he store and telling it you don't want that defect washer ?
I mean how would you know if that is the only defective part? And did you ask them about the volume flow pump rate ? And have you thought about the garden hose experiment? Stick the garden hose in the washer drain and turn on the water than see if the drain keeps up with the flow.Leave it go for about ten minutes.And treating those pipes while the washer is down really isn't a bad idea .Are your drain lines galvanized pipe by the way or copper?


Good luck on that.