Finding a Church...

[IA_Seth]

I am looking for a church. I know that finding a church to attend will be a personal decision, but I am hoping that those of you here at DU that profess yourselves Christians will surely be able to point me in the right general vicinity.

First off, I grew up as a Jehovah's Witness...baptised in that faith (I think), and attended the 'Kingdom Hall' until I was probably 6-7. At that point my family wasn't overly religious, but I was still raised in a family that respected the Bible and the church, even if we never attended. My family ranges from self-claimed atheists to those like me, self-taught Christians without much experience in the church-life, but a faith in Jesus and the values rooted in Christian ideals just the same.

In my teens I was very close to my future ex-wife's family and I attended quite a few services at the small Methodist Church where they were members. I liked the fact that they had a woman minister, and I tended to enjoy the sermons that were given.

I am now divorced, living with the true love of my life who was raised Catholic (and still attends her church every now and then) and plan on marrying her in the near future (at least askig her to marry me!). We recently found out we are pregnant, and are happy and excited to know that we will be having a child next July!

Ok, so here is my dilemma. I am looking for a church that won't look at me as less of a Christian for being divorced, living with my girlfriend, and for having a child out of wedlock.

Are there any more liberal churches out there, or churches were these types of things don't automatically make you the devil (like the Catholic Church seems to)?

[Az]

1. Big question

Do you need Jesus to be an active part of the church or just tolerated? If you don't need to be sermonized about Jesus then the most open Church around is a Unitarian Universalist Church. Gotta keep in mind they are very open. Everything from fallen Catholics to atheists roam the halls of a UU church. You will get progressive discussions, lots to think about, meaningful sermons, just not a lot of Jesus. They won't blast Jesus but they don't raise him above any other belief either.

[IA_Seth]

2. Yeah, that doesn't sound like my kind of thing...

As Christian I accept Jesus as my savior, that he died for my sins, and I would like to find a church that glorifies his works through action and not just 'acknowledges' them...I just don't want to walk into fundie judgemental hell either.

Thanks for the info though!

[Critters2]

5. Actually, they might blast Jesus

I've seen it happen.

[Rabrrrrrr]

3. Since the Unitarians don't seem to fit you, go United Church of Christ

(not to be confused with Church of Christ, which is diametrically opposed)

One of the predecessors of the UCC (the Congregationalists) were the first denomination to ordain a woman (in the early 1800s), an African-American (in the 1840s, I believe). The UCC was the first to ordain a gay man, in 1972, and the General Synod of the UCC voted last year to support gay marriage.

I have a number of friends who are gay and lesbian and are UCC pastors.

Social Justice has for a long, long time been an integral and essential part of the UCC. Predecessors to the United Church of Christ go back to both the Pilgrims and the Puritans.

Cedar Rapids has two, a small one and a larger one, which you can find on this page:

http://www.ucc.org/find/city_ucc.php

There is a very conservative hate-based movement within the UCC called "Biblical Witness Fellowship", and another called "Faithful and Welcoming" which isn't as blatantly hate-based as the BWF. There are some UCC churches that are very conservative. I don't anything about the two in Cedar Rapids, so you have to check them out, but one is a Still Speaking church, so they definitely aren't BWF and probably are not Faithful and Welcoming, and the other says on its website that they don't care about sexuality, so I'm sure they're not either one, either.

And yes, I realize your issue is that you are a heterosexual living with your lover who is now pregnant, but generally UCC churches don't care - and especially those that are welcoming to gays and lesbians are definitely not going to care.

The UCC has a lot of former Catholics in it.

(and in the ethic of full disclosure, I am a UCC member, and have been all myu life, though I am a closet Episcopalian liturgically :-))

[Critters2]

6. A friend of mine did an interim in Cedar Rapids

At First Congregational UCC. As I recall, he had a good experience there.

You might find that a few people are a bit uncomfortable with your child being born out of welock--but very few. And, being Iowans, they'll prolly be too polite to say anything.

In general, I think the United Church of Christ would be a good fit.

Full disclosure-wise, I, too, have been UCC my whole life, and served as a pastor in Iowa for 5 years. And one day I hope to go back there.

[Kat45]

7. I agree that the UCC would probably be a good fit.

I was raised Catholic, stopped going to church when I was in college, then started looking for a church when I was in my forties. I researched different denominations and the UCC looked like the best one for me. I checked out the UCC church in my town, and I've been going ever since. Definitely a very tolerant, open-minded church.

[Critters2]

8. Thank you. We do our best ...

and yes, occasionally our best gould be better. But mostly, we're a pretty good bunch!

[davidwparker]

19. I'm from a Church of Christ background and may be switching to

United Church of Christ. I've become more liberal and its difficult to get into a frame of mind to worship when the intolerance of 1/2 of the congregation have you wanting to get up and leave.

I just cannot take attitudes where women are 'less than' men. The problems with the USA are due to gays. And, the sheeple there don't see anything wrong with *. It's that last one -- seeing * as a man of God -- that just galls me to no end.

I find myself saying that I'm a sermon-on-the-mount christian to distinguish me now from those types of christians.

[Lydia Leftcoast]

4. When I move to a new community, I always have to "church shop"

although I have always stayed within the Lutheran-Episcopal range.

I find that as I visit churches, one of them suddenly feels like home, and I know that I've found the right one. When I moved back to Minneapolis, I visited my current parish on the first Sunday, liked it immediately but decided to reserve judgment. When the rest of the ones I tried just didn't measure up, I came back to the first one, where I have now been for a little over three years.

Since you don't have a particular denominational loyalty, you might want to read up on a few denominations, and then, when you find one that appeals and you know what kind of a parish you are looking for, call the local headquarters of the denomination and ask for churches that fit your description.

But in the end, it's all a matter of walking into a church, sitting through a service, and realizing that you're home.

[IA_Seth]

9. Thank you everyone...

I will have to check out the UCC and see where that takes me.

My girlfriend is more of the mind that she (we) continue to attend the Catholic Church 'because that is what she knows', regardless of the fact that they certainly wouldn't accept us if they knew much about us.

Ah well, perhaps I will get her to join me in checking out the UCC Church, otherwise we can maintain our seperate faiths!

Thanks again for your help, it is greatly appreciated.

[Lydia Leftcoast]

10. Or, you could become Episcopalians

a common compromise in Catholic/Protestant marriages. You get the ritual, but a very open attitude (in MOST parishes).

[IA_Seth]

11. Oh, I'll check them out..

I've heard the name a lot, but I'm not familiar with the doctrine or customs or anything. To be honest with you, being as self-taught as I am, I don't know much about any denomination.

[Lydia Leftcoast]

12. Call the local Episcopal diocese and ask them which parishes are

the most liberal and the most active. That should give you a place to start.

Episcopal churches have such a large number of members who came from other traditions that they have a term "cradle Episcopalian," which is something like being a "native Californian," i.e. not all that common. As such, many parishes have classes for new members at least once a year. (My own church, which is very large, has classes four times a year.) However, you don't have to join officially to attend or take Communion. (If they make a fuss about who can take Communion, move on, because it's also likely that they're in the faction that is uptight about sexual matters.)

The liturgy will be somewhat familiar to your Catholic fiancee, but not entirely. However, Episcopalians are used to "newbies," and they should be happy to answer your questions. If they're not, try another parish.

Whatever denomination you land in, each parish has its own personality. I'm very happy at my current Episcopal church, but when I was "shopping," I tried some that sent me running in the other direction, even though other people I know think they're wonderful.

You have to go with what grabs you.

[shrike]

15. Not all Catholic parishes would consider you the devil, Seth

The Church is not monolithic and there are plenty of liberal priests, including the pastor of my church. Who recently gave a sermon lambasting those who criticize Muslims or consider them evil -- "The things they're saying about Muslims today could have been said about us Christians over the last several centuries. One of the priests in my area has also been jailed several times, for peace protests and for protests at the School for the Americas. (One of my cousins, btw, had a Catholic wedding when she was visibly pregnant.)

But if you don't have such a parish in your area you'll have to plan accordingly. "Mixed-faith" marriages can certainly work. My husband has no use for organized religion, isn't Christian and is a theist only on his good days. I'm a practicing Catholic, and although we've had our differences over the years religion has never been a problem.

My stepdaughter and her family are also unchurched, and they are very nice and respectful of my beliefs. A little courtesy goes a long way.

[IA_Seth]

16. Interesting..

I've actually read a lot about the Catholic faith and I am not opposed to it in the slightest, I'd actual love to find a parish close to me that would accept our situations without judgement. It would certainly make my girlfriend happy!

I'll look on that front too.

Thanks again.

[shrike]

22. Since you are having a child together I can understand why

you'd both want to be on the same page.

If you can't find a Catholic parish to your liking, the Episcopal faith may indeed be your best bet. I had a Catholic friend who attended an Episcopal church near his house because he liked the people, and because the service was so familiar he felt like he was actually attending mass.

[Critters2]

20. The priests around here still require couples to sign a document

saying they'll raise the kids Catholic, and REALLY pressure the non-Catholic spouse to join. I thought this sort of thing ended years ago, but its SOP around here.

It's like I'm in a time-warp!!

[shrike]

21. That's a shame

Neither my BILs nor my husband are Catholic, and I don't recall any of them being pressured to turn Catholic. My one BIL decided on his own to take instruction, since his daughters were being raised Catholic and he "wanted to know what this was about." It turned out to be a positive experience for him, since the leaders of the group hammered in the notion of family coming first. He's been a real family man ever since. However, he still thinks a Sunday morning is better spent doing anything but going to church.
You're right about the insistence of children being raised Catholic. Though I've heard of Catholics raising their children in the faiths of both parents.

[StoryTeller]

13. Where are you in IA, Seth?

I live in Nebraska. I might be able to help you out with some specific churches to try, if you're anywhere near the western part of Iowa. PM me if you want.

[Critters2]

14. Someone said he's in Cedar Rapids. nt

[IA_Seth]

17. I am in Cedar Rapids..

quite a long hall from western iowa, but thanks for the offer, I appreciate it.

[davidwparker]

18. United Church of Christ.

I've become increasingly liberal and have attended Church of Christ, which is very fundamental. United Church of Christ seems to be open to people. If I find that United Church of Christ has the same beliefs that I'm looking for without the judgmental attitudes of the ones that I've attended, then I will be attending United Church of Christ myself.

[TreasonousBastard]

23. Lydia L is spot on...

that the denomination is not as important as the individual congregation.

My personal experience has seen Lutherans ranging from Missouri Synod churches as fundie as a good Southern Baptist to ELCA churches you'd think are fronts for the Unitarians.

There are many conservative Presbyterians, but also those "other" Presbyterians who sponsored the Witherspoon Society's Stony Point Declaration.

Methodists come in all flavors, but two Methodist churces I'm familiar with are Peace Churches, and an assistant minister of one actually took a year-long sabbatical to attend our Quaker meeting to clear his head.

There are welcoming and affirming Baptists who are accepting of everyone and have stayed with old Baptist roots of tolerance, pacifism, and nonreliance on unproven doctrine. Try www.bpfna.org to find links to some of these if any are in your area.

You probably wouldn't be too happy with my brand of Quakerism, but you can find links to Evangelical and FUM Quakers at www.quaker.org Those branches, particularly the Evangelicals, are far more Christocentric and even hold traditional services, unlike our silent meetings. What we all share, though, are the fundamental testimonies and leadings such as integrity, peace, and social concern.