Took in more new members today

[Critters2]

As long as the fundies keep kicking glbt people and their allies out, we're glad to have 'em. Today--refugees from the Assemblies of God and Plymouth Brethren. And really good folks! Their loss, our gain!

How was your Sunday?

[TreasonousBastard]

1. The UU church I attend had 7 new members installed...

this morning and the Quaker Meeting I sometimes attend just had one new one show up. That Meeting is too small to have its own meetinghouse, so it's held in a local UCC Congregational church, and our relationship with that church has been a postive thing for all of us.

At the UU luncheon there was much discussion of the strange roads travelled through the fields of Catholicism, Baptism, Presbyterianism and a few others to get to the freedom of belief with the UUs.

A very pleasant Sunday it was.

[Critters2]

2. Mind if I just take a minute to defend the freedom of beliefs

of Presbyterians and at least American Baptists? I've had relationships with both denominations, and found them warm, caring, and, yes, thinking environments. If the UCC ceased to be tomorrow, these are the two denominations I'd be most attracted to (though I would have to find a More Light or Welcoming Congregation).

[TreasonousBastard]

3. As have I, and I've also worked with some extraordinary...

Methodist and Catholic churches and groups.

The point wasn't trashing other denominations, but finding a comfortable, non-dogmatic environment. Several people mentioned how they were told they were doomed to Hell for not accepting certain "truths" and others told of simply not being able to accept such concepts as predestination or transubstantiation and that they were being taught as central to the faith in some congregations.

[supernova]

4. Presbyterians

Well, I was on the way out the door for my daily exercise, damn this addictive DU! (just one more post, I swear!! :P :D )

I grew up in the Presby (USA) church. And I recently left that particular church after being there for 10 years. There are several flavors of Presbyterianism, all the way from the More Light churches of PCUSA (glbt friendly) to the Presbyterian Church in America, a denomination so conservative it makes the SBC look tame. PCUSA is itself schizoid, sorta reflecting the general population # churches that are conservative ("Confessing"), # that identify as "More Light", and # of congregations who muddle through in the middle, trying to make peace between the two. :crazy:

Predestination isn't a central tenet of Presbyterian Church USA anymore, and hasn't been oh, I think it was definitely on the way out when I was little in the 60s. Probably before then. It is now presented as a kind of historical tenet that we have let go of. And needed to, IMNSHO. If you are part of PCUSA, the idea is that we all live as if we are "chosen." And we are. :-)

I was ambivalent about leaving that church because I did learn a great deal from them, notably:

- We all have a voice and that voice matters.
- Each individual is worthy and lovable to God, therefore to others.
- Given the first two, a representative church government is a sound way to hammer out theological differences, rather than having unelected officials who make dogmatic pronouncements. (Yes, sometimes theology by committee has its drawbacks too.)
- Creativity and the arts are as necessary to living life as bread and water. In fact, it is a good way to acknowledge the Divine in others.
- God is all around in the natural world, in the faces of the people we love, as well as "in Church." (God isn't just a building you visit once a week, IOW) (This particular church is out in the country, was founded by rural farmers in the 18th Century, and plenty of activities still revolve around enjoying the outdoors).

So, why'd I leave? Ugh. I think ultimately, with me that church is a victim of its own success. I got the above, and wanted more.... more that I couldn't get there. It's like there was a certain ..... church ceiling, I'll call it. My mind began to wander during the service... the same exact service every single sunday. The same sorts of sermons during the same times each year. The same hymns over and over again. :banghead: I began to feel like I had over-tilled that field. My church experience was growing stale. I felt like I was suffocating.

I started reading on my own.... John S. Spong, Matthew Fox, the Nag Hammadi Library, on and on. I began to realize that the orthodoxy the mainline churches teach only presents one part of the early church, not its entirety. I found great solace in these things that other people had also wondered about, that I wasn't alone in thinking that the "church" isn't what it could be.

So where does that leave me? I'm not sure. I'm comfortable with my concept of "God" and how I relate to Her. But to find a group that is more representative in the flesh, of what I feel on the inside, is confusing to me right now.

[Critters2]

5. Well, maybe the folks you're talking about weren't PCUSA

because I don't know any PCUSA churches that are still preaching double predestination. Maybe there are some, but I know LOTS of Presby clergy and none that believe or preach this.

And I went to an American Baptist seminary, and well, turned out the way I am. This should say something about generalizing about Baptists.