Rev. Jeremiah Wright makes me proud.

[RevCheesehead]

Proud that finally, one of our clergy is willing to publically take on the forces of evil in this country, and counter hate with the words of Jesus.

Thank you, Pastor. O8)

[kwassa]

1. I was quite impressed with him on Bill Moyers program.

Very interesting guy.

[Critters2]

2. I know it's anathema to say, but I have mixed feelings.

His public statements I support. He's a fine preacher and I think you're right, people need to hear what he has to say.

My issues with him are in terms of professional concerns. He does things that would get the rest of us hauled before our respective Church and Ministry Committees. He chose his own successor. Yet, a local UCC colleague was recently reprimanded for reading the profiles of interim candidates for the church she was leaving, and then expressing her opinion to members of the search committee. We're all told not to involve ourselves with the search for our successors.

I've heard the case made that choosing one's successor is the tradition in the Black Church. It was also the tradition in the German Church, but those churches were discouraged from continuing that tradition after the merger.

He clearly endorsed Obama from the pulpit, putting his church's 501c3 status at risk. If I were to do that, John Thomas wouldn't be holding any news conference to offer me support.

So, while I have nothing but support for his theology and his message, I do wish there were equity in terms of professional matters. I am told that his C&M Committee is struggling now with problems all of this has raised, including the PR and the National Church's public support of him. It's created a difficult situation.

So, yeah, I'm proud of his work. But no one is perfect. We are once again reminded.

[Rabrrrrrr]

3. The UCC is definitely in a time of ecclesiastical transition.

What to do with a black UCC church, which the UCC never really had before, that carries on traditions of denominations outside the UCC - such as choosing one's successor.

What to do with Samoans who traditionally do not have educated clergy, but have clergy who are called from within the congregation?

How do we properly license and vet the lay people who will be needed to serve the small rural churches who can't afford an ordained minister?

We're going to be having some real conversations in the UCC about this.

And I'm not sure where I stand on this, either - is it fair to expect the white guy to take college grad school and some other hoops before getting "Rev." before their name, while at the same only needing for the Samoan guy to say "My church ordained me"?

What I would like to see - pursuant to your early critique of Wright getting away with stuff the C&M committees would go ballistic over - is to see the white churches support their pastors with the love, dedication, honor, and forgiveness that the black churches do.

The white churches scrimp and scrounge and give the pastor as little as they possibly can because he/she is just the hired help, and then complain when his car isn't in good enough shape and his clothing is old and frayed and his house is falling apart; the black churches, in general, think that their pastor should live well, of course the pastor should have a new working good quality car and wear quality well-made clothing and have a nice house! How he looks reflects on how we look, so we should give him enough money to look good!

I think of Bertha's situation, in which the church doesn't think she's keeping the parsonage clean enough - her church gives her a date by which to have it cleaned. In a black church, I think, the congregation would be "Oh, my! We're not giving pastor enough time to clean the parsonage - come on, everyone, let's go give him/her a hand and clean that and set up a group to do monthly cleaning!"

Anyway, that was a tangent. Sorry.

[Critters2]

4. From your keyboard to God's ears (but don't hold your breath).

"We're going to be having some real conversations in the UCC about this."

No, we're not. And that's the problem. Some of us have been asking for real conversations about these issues for years. In Iowa, we talked often about the national church's unwillingness to look for new ways to support clergy in rural areas, where the size of the population alone made it difficult for communities to support ordained clergy. If we're really in covenant, why can't larger urban and suburban churches be asked to help with the support of rural, or small urban churches? Why is it impossible to even discuss such things?

It would be nice if recent events led to real conversations...if, when JT was calling for a "sacred conversation" about race, he'd also have called for one concerning clergy compensation and standards equity. You'll notice that never came up. We keep avoiding and avoiding these issues. They need to be dealt with, but no one with any authority has the balls to raise them.

I personally feel it's condescending to say we can't expect minority churches or small churches to hold their pastors to the same standards as larger, European churches. We can. We just don't. So, many hardworking pastors are just getting by, while some retire to 1.6 million dollar homes, paid for in full by their congregation. Some of us are told to stay out of search and call issues of our churches, on pain of loss of standing. Others choose their own successors, with the full support of Cleveland.

All of this is problematic. But don't expect anyone in Cleveland...or Westchester...to take up these issues any time soon.