A question about speaking in tongues

[hvn_nbr_2]

My concept of the idea of speaking in tongues is from the story in Acts of how the apostles addressed large crowds of multiple nationalities; and although the apostles spoke in their own language, all the people in the crowds understood what they said in their own languages.

That seems to me to be the polar opposite of what "holy roller" churches mean when they do speaking in tongues:

Everybody understands in their own language vs. nobody understands a word.

The speaker is speaking coherently and knows what they're saying vs. the speaker doesn't have a clue themselves what they're saying.

Everything is understandable in real language to everyone vs. babbling nonsense streams of syllables from no language at all.

If they're really speaking in tongues, rather than just excitedly babbling, why doesn't everybody understand? I have a vague recollection of someone sometime telling me that there are other stories somewhere in the Bible about a phenomenon more like modern speaking in tongues, but I don't remember it.

Anyone able to enlighten me?

[Rabrrrrrr]

1. I think it's something that's faked by charlatan evil church leaders,

and something that is induced through unethical emotional manipulation (by said charlatan evil church leaders) in their people.

I don't think it's a true spiritual revelation/moment at all.

The only times I know of that someone speaks in tongues is during hyper-emotional, hyper-manipulative, moments in pentecostal worship services.

In my opinion, if speaking in tongues were a real and true thing, it would happen outside of those calculatedly manipulative moments.

I know the Bible talks about it as a spiritual gift, and I don't doubt that it exists - but I find it interesting that the only denominations that seem to exercise it at such extensively high levels of occurrance are denominations that started in the United States in the 1800s.

The whole speaking in tongues/rapture/evangelical conservative hatefilled shitbag/dispensationalist asshole movement that is around today is a tradition that simply, in all truth and honesty, cannot trace itself past circa 1800 England and United States.

These assholes - most of the leaders of which are charlatans, abusive assmunches, evil fucks, and otherwise not worth the time it takes to spit on them - have no standing in historical christian experience whatsoever. NONE! WHATSOEVER!!!

It's all bullshit, at the least, and unethical manipulation and unchristian at the worst.

No different than the fuckers who prey on the elderly, or the heretical evil fucks who are pushing the prosperity gospel.

I pray to God that McCain loses so that these unethical, heretical, evil pieces of shit will lose some of their power.

[Critters2]

2. They quote some other passages to justify the gibberish kind of speaking in tongues.

The part of 1 Corinthians 13 that talks about "I speak in the tongues of men and of angels", for instance. They claim "tongues of angels" is speaking in tongues--languages people don't understand but God and angels do. There are some other places they quote, too. I can't remember 'em right off, would have to do a little research. Most Pentecostal pastors and theologians are smart enough to know that Acts 2 doesn't describe ecstatic glossolalia as they practice it, so they do have other verses they point to.

[RevCheesehead]

3. And any reputable Pentecostal would tell you..

that even if someone DOES exhibit the gift of tongues, it is useless to the community unless there is someone present who can translate.

Don't laugh, Rabrrrrrr - there really ARE reputable Pentecostals out there. They just don't get much publicity.

[R. P. McMurphy]

7. If I'm not mistaken, Paul warns against...

speaking in tongues unless there is someone there to translate. He said it was much more useful for someone to prophesy (sp?) than to speak in tongues without translation.

[Kat45]

4. I agree with you about the story in Acts.

And elsewhere where the Bible speaks of the different gifts that people get, it says that some speak in tongues, others interpret tongues and lists other gifts as well. No gift is better than the others, which causes me to wonder why the Pentecostals put such emphasis on tongues. And of course, it is useless to have someone speaking in tongues if there isn't someone to interpret, and I don't recall ever seeing someone doing that.

[Lydia Leftcoast]

5. The typical "speaking in tongues" experience is just trance

the same phenomenon found in "spirit possession" in Voodoo, Santería, and other non-Christian religions.

Back when I was a graduate student, I heard a lecture by a linguist who had studied the "tongues" phenomena. He found that they consisted of repeated syllables and never contained sounds that were not found in the person's own language. In other words, when Latino Pentecostals "speak in tongues," those "tongues" follow Spanish patterns, and when English-speaking Pentecostals "speak in tongues," those "tongues" follow English sound patterns.

In behavioral terms, a Pentecostal "speaking in tongues" acts exactly like a devotee of Voodoo in trance, caught up in a consciously manipulated ecstasy.

[R. P. McMurphy]

6. One Biblical reference to speaking in tongues is found...

in Mark 16: 17.

Years ago I attended one Pentecostal church where speaking in tongues was a regular activity of some in the congregation. I have attended another where laying on of hands to heal the sick (verse 18) was practiced. Picking up snakes and drinking poison (also in verse 18) is not something I've witnessed (although I'm sure it happens).

In verses 17 and 18 Jesus is telling the apostles the signs that will accompany those who believe in him.

(thanks to Rabrrrrrr in another post for telling how to insert a citation without having unwanted smileys show up)

[Kat45]

8. There is at least one church where they pick up snakes

I once saw a report of it on television; the church may have been in Georgia, but I'm not sure. I don't know if it was Pentecostal or not, but picking up snakes was their thing.

[R. P. McMurphy]

9. Now that you mention it - I saw...

a crime show a year-or-so ago about a minister in a snake-handling pentecostal church that tried to murder his wife.