Need some help--what can you tell me about Presbyterians?

[Kat45]

I actually have a job interview next week, the first one since my last job disappeared at the end of last year. It's an administrative job at a Presbyterian church. I've done similiar work at two churches, both Episcopalian, and I belong to a UCC church.

Is there anything I should know about the Presbyterian faith before my interview? I did some research, and my observations so far are that they use the word "sin" a lot and they consider homosexual activity to be a sin. I need a job pretty badly so I want to be careful as to what I say on the interview, but I also need to know if I can deal with working with a church of this faith (before I get my hopes up for the job). Thanks.

[Critters2]

1. Are they PCUSA, or some other form of Presbyterian?

Prebys can run the gamut from "very much like UCC" to raving fundies. They come out of the same heritage as the UCC--the Reformation based in Geneva--and in reality, should be theologically identical to the UCC. The only real difference should be in polity. The power in the Presby tradition lies more with the Presbytery (similar to our Association, but, again, with more power), and less with the congregation. The pastor is moderator of the congregation, yet, somehow, not a member of the local church. Pastors belong not to the church, but to the Presbytery.

As I say, theologically, there shouldn't be much diff between Presbys and us. We're both Reformed Christians. But Presbyterians do have a larger and more vocal Conservative wing. These were mostly part of the Southern Presbys (Presbyterian Church in the US) who broke with the United Presbyterians over support of slavery during the Civil War. Like the Southern Baptists, once they were severed from the Northern moderates and liberals, they went all batshit crazy conservative.

In the 1980's, the Northern and Southern Presbys reunited, and, imo, the Northerners bent over backwards to make the conservatives happy. Since then, the PCUSA has been more conservative than the old UPC used to be. The main issue they're fighting over, not surprisingly, is glbt stuff-marriage and ordination. In this, they're just like the United Methodists, the American Baptists, and others. Hell, we'd be fighting about it more if it weren't for the fact that UCC churches can just vote to leave and take their property. Oh, that's another thing, Presby congregations don't own their own buildings...the Presbytery does.

So, long story short (I know, too late), there are liberal Presbyterians and conservative Presbyterians and everybody in between. They seem to be becoming more conservative, but there are still good folks trying to fight that trend.

One way to know more about the church is to find out if it's a More Light Congregation (the equivalent to Open and Affirming in the UCC), or a "Confessing Church", which are the equivalent of the Biblical Witness Fellowship. Another liberal group within the PCUSA is the Covenant Network. which is more conciliatory than the More Lights, but pro-glbt in its own way.

So, that's what I can tell you. Hope this helps!

[Kat45]

2. Thank you. This gives me more things to look for when I explore their web site.

I'm crossing my fingers that this church is not conservative because I really need a job.

[supernova]

3. Really check out which Presby Denom it is

PCUSA is the largest, and the "mainline" one. As Critters says, they run the gamut. It really depends on the make up of the individual congregation how conservative or liberal they are. I attended one that was about 60/40 conservative/liberal. Lots of families that had built the church in the 1750s are still around today.

There are smaller, very much more conservative flavors of Presbyterians such as Presbyterian Church in America. PCiA make the Southern Baptist Convention look like a singles cruise. :P So do try to pin down which kind of Presbyterians you are dealing with. If they are talking about "sin" A LOT, it may be a more conservative congregation. If it is a More Light church, so much the better.

"Presbyterian" really refers to a representative style of church government, more than specific doctrine. You have a group of elders ("presbyters") who are elected in each church. The elders serve three year terms. They perform the administrative business of the church, for example: worship committee, personnel, education, business, and so on. Some churches have trustees who take care of the grounds, real estate, and cemetery. Elders will also attend Presbytery meetings with the minister on a rotating basis. If you're really lucky, you get to go to General Assembly, which is now every two years in PCUSA.

Generally presbyterians aren't real "preachy." The life of the mind is valued and supported in liturgy as well as education. All the same self-effacing jokes Garrison Keillor makes about Lutherans can also be made about Presbyterians. :-)

FYI - Fred Rogers, aka "Mr Rogers" was an ordained Presbyterian Minister. He's quite typical.

Supernova, former Elder, PCUSA.

P.S. - If you get the job, you must develop a passion for bag pipes and kilts! :D

[Rabrrrrrr]

4. Best when deep-fried. Yum yum! But don't let them anywhere near gospel music.

As others have said, it depends on the branch of Presbyterianism they are, and then also depends on the local congregation.

They *should* be like the UCC churches. But they won't necessarily be so.

And Presbyterianism is not a faith. Christianity is the faith; Presbyterian is a denomination (or expression) of that faith.

Although for some Presbyterians - especially some of the old-school older ones - the Presbyterianism itself becomes the faith, and the Jesus stuff becomes incidental. Same with some of the old school Congregationalists and Methodists.

[supernova]

5. Never met a committee we didn't like!

:P

[Kat45]

6. I realize that Presbyterianism is a denomination, but it seems to me

that there are too many denominations who think that their denomination equals Christianity, equals the faith. I hope this particular church isn't among them.

[supernova]

10. Ecumenical

PCUSA is very aware of other denoms and other faiths and works in the larger church community in missions and education, accepting others as brothers and sisters in the faith. I'm not sure you would find very many people who would say "Presby or Bust!" Again, a type of corporate egoism that you find in nondenom fundy churches just isn't present in the mainlines. If you aren't sure, ask, in a friendly way of course. I'm not the only one who believes in more than one path to God. Again, that's quite personal how far any individual carries that.

[Kat45]

7. I just listened to one of their sermons, which are available on their web site.

It was ok, though overly long in my opinion. That eased my mind a little bit.

[Adsos Letter]

8. The Scots rejected the Anglican Book of Prayer which Charles I tried to impose on them...

and initiated the First Bishops War. The Scots were Presbyterians. :D

[supernova]

9. Except they call it The Church of Scotland

;-)

http://www.churchofscotland.org.uk/index.htm

[Adsos Letter]

11. That's OK; Anglicanism is an anachronism for that period.

if we are gonna' be technical about it. :D