Bill and Hill push for anybody but Dean.

[coloradodem2005]

I don't know how valid this is because it was posted by a conservative on rotharmy. But here goes:

Former Vermont Governor Howard Dean may be the frontrunner in the race for Democratic National Committee chairman, but the party's two biggest stars are quietly working behind the scenes to torpedo his chances.

"The Clintons don't like Dean on substance or style, seeing him as too left and too loose-lipped," reports Newsweek in Monday editions.

The former first couple headlined an inauguration night bash at the D.C. home of former Clinton pollster Mark Penn, where one attendee said, "There was a ton of positive energy at the house - except for the fear and loathing of Dean."
The Clintons are doing their best to keep their antipathy towards Dean under wraps, lest he win the post and throw his support to someone besides Hillary in 2008.
<snip>

http://www.rotharmy.com/forums/showthread.php?s=&threadid=16121

http://www.newsmax.com/archives/ic/2005/1/23/83029.shtml

If I recall correctly, we don't consider News max reliable, so this could be bullshit.

[nashville_brook]

1. only one way to find out -- someone is going to have to call

bill n hill

whose got their number?

[ultraist]

2. Could be BS, but...

the Clintons have made several moves to show how "bi-partisan" they are lately including the Bush invitation to the Clinton Library, Hillary's support of government grants to faith based orgs, Bill's tsunami fundraiser org with partner George I, etc.

They are setting the stage for their centrist movement for Hillary to take the lead on, in a 2008 Presidential run. How could they support Dean if they want the party to remain centrist?

Didn't the Clinton's support Kerry during the primaries and not Dean?

[judy]

3. I think they

supported Clark...

[ultraist]

10. Oh, right, they did support Clark

Thanks!

[FrenchieCat]

36. But what does it mean if they supported Clark?

Were they not supposed to support someone? Were they supposed to support Dean even if they didn't think he was the one that could beat George Bush.

Gore supported Dean. What does that say about him?

Hillary and Clinton didn't endorse Clark

Gore endorsed Dean

What's the problem? I don't get it.

[LSdemocrat]

4. Complete BS

One of the right-wing's favorite tactics is to claim that there are all sorts of factions in the Democratic party who only care about their personal careers and not the party or the people.

Also note that the only quote is completely anonymous and that none of the "facts" are sourced.

[never_get_over_it]

26. This sounds exactly like the Clintons

I don't think it is BS at all - I supported Bill Clinton and Hillary whole heartedly because of what was done to them by the right, but no more - they will do anything to get elected - they are too conservative - Hillary has been pandering to the right this past week with her faith based crap and her supposed pro-choice talk - I didn't think she would run for President - now I'm sure she is - and she will NEVER win - their hand picked guy Terry McAuliffe was completely ineffective - they are too cozy with the Bush family - I'm through with them - if the Clintons don't want Dean my support for him just doubled

[desertalien]

40. I completely agree with you.

I am now very suspicious of the Clinton's and their cronies.
:mad:

[OKNancy]

5. Actually there is a post in Editorials

quoting Newsweek. They say it's true.


http://www.democraticunderground.com/discuss/duboard.php?az=view_all&address=103x100196

[napi21]

6. I think Bill is a star of the Dem party, but no one I know is a BC!

I guess it's politics for different people to support different people for take charge positions. If that's what they believe, that's their privilege. I happen to support Den for the DNC Chair. I hope there are voters within the DNC who can look at the field of candidates and make a decision on who is going to be best for the job, and not only because of some star supporters.

[merh]

7. Well, that settles it for me.

Definitely Dean for DNC chairman.

Bill & Hill are too repuglite for my taste. The suck ups to the RWers need to revisit the party's basic tenets and stop trying to appease the repukes.

Bill wants head of UN so badly he is willing to dance with the devils that tormented his presidency and persecuted him, well that is his choice, but it sure sucks for the party.

[KoKo]

8. Well, Dean compared Bill Clinton to FDR on Stuffy's show this a.m.

He said we Democrats are waiting for another FDR or Clinton (who had the kind of charm and political savy that we rarely see) instead of working to build up our Grassroots. He said he's talked with Clinton on many subjects and he's brilliant.

So, I take the word of two Right Wing sites about the Clinton's dissing Dean behind his back as evidence that the RW want's to fracture the Dems on the issue of Dean.

At one time we weren't allowed to post from sites like "News Max" on DU...but I guess the rules have lessened since we've grown larger. :eyes:

[AntiCoup2K4]

12. I would argue that there IS a value to posting from RW sources....

NewsHax, WashingMoonie Times, FAUX, etc. are the ones who are printing the direct Bush Fraudministration/PNAC spin most of the time. It's a good way to monitor what the fucking idiots are up to without actually having to watch FAUX or register at their neocon websites.

[Renew Deal]

9. It's all about the Clinton's getting elected.

DIfferent people will want a sympathetic chairman. The Clinton's have their choices. Kerry has his choice. I'm not sure who else has influence at that level.

[AntiCoup2K4]

11. You're from Roth Army?

Who is this?

BTW, for the benefit of everyone else, the guy who posted the NewsHax link over there goes by the name of "John Ashcroft", so that tells you what side he's on. Actually he's a reasonably intelligent guy, for a right winger. There are far worse specimens of the far right over there.

[coloradodem2005]

14. I just post on it occasionally.

I am not "from" there. I got it from there. THough, I figured since the guy posts as Ashcroft that that was bad.

[ooglymoogly]

13. NOT BUYING IT

[janx]

15. The rumor mill is in full swing I see!

It's not surprising.

[Stop_the_War]

16. .

[KoKo]

17. Fineman of MSNBC obviously reads the same websites. He's just

done an article which says what this says about the Clintons and Dean...

How much more of this do we need....when we can get it from Newsweek, NYT's, WaPo or our MSM sites. We don't need to read the "source," too!
:eyes:

[FrenchieCat]

37. It's called circular journalism....

and this is the way that the presstitutes spread their rumors....

The story starts in some Right Win Hack Mag.....but at some point it is picked up at newsweek, which is owned by the same stockholders who won the Washington Post...so it ends up appearing there. MSnbc has a partnership with Newsweek, which is why Newsweeks articles are posted at a MSnbc website. Fineman works for Newsweek and is a guest on MSnbc very often. General Electric is the owner of MSnbc,NBC, and CNBC's news orgs. Just like Time magazine (hardcopy and web) is owned by the same people who own CNN.

The story goes round and round....until they begin using each other as sources. However, if you really read the story from various publications, most of it has been copied from the original sources...and then non backed up opinions are thrown in to make the information appear more fleshed out. MSnbc uses Newsweek as a source, and vice versa, and round and round.

The New York Post, Drudge, Washington Times, Faux and the other RW are always glad once the rumor hits Newsweek....cause it means that their job is now complete and the Mainstream media takes over from there. AP is the last in the chain....that's when the "rumor" gets dissiminated to hundreds of local papers....eventually it will show up in the New York times.

It sounds complex....but is easy, and they have been doing this for quite some time.

[ScreamingMeemie]

18. Hillary lost me when I saw her clinking champagne glasses at the DNC

in July. I could care less what she and Bill think these days, true or not. Another elitist cockroach IMO.

[Duncan Grant]

23. I'm so glad you mentioned this!

Was it just me but did you see Hillary and McAuliffe during Dean's speech at the convention? Near the end of his speech, the camera panned up to the VIP box and there they sat, exchanging a few words, giggling, then a quick toast and more giggling.

It didn't look like they were celebrating Dean's accomplishments or toasting Sen. Kerry either. This is just my sordid little story but I wonder if anyone else saw this or better yet, does anyone know what the real story is?

Glad you're doing better MrsG, we were all concerned about you. :hi:

[ScreamingMeemie]

25. That's exactly what I was referring to! You weren't the only one.

PassingFair and I both were given the ickies by it!

Thanks for the well wishes. I am so glad to be on the mend. :hi:

[PassingFair]

29. Mrs. Grumpy and I are working on a new DLC logo:

Clinking champagne glasses!

[demo dutch]

19. I love Dean, but don't think he's right for the DNC Chair

[Beth in VT]

20. There is evidently a stop Dean effort underway,

but Dean is winning in the straw poll.

He is the Republicans' greatest threat and we can expect them to continue to go after him in subtle and straightforward ways.

He also represents a party of the people which I think also threatens the Clintons, who are part of the establishment/problem.

[rucky]

21. Then why doesn't Bill apply for the job?

he'd get it.

[Streetdoc270]

22. Thats reason to vote for him in my book

I have not been pleased with anything out of the Clintons latley, from the DOMA to Hillery supporting Bernie as DHS head. If they are anti-Dean than I say vote him in! Its the shakeup that we need as a party, this 'Repub lite' strategy that the Clintons seem to be selling is not working.

[Pam-Moby]

27. Its Dean for me!!!

I believe that it is time that we put someone at the head of the party that is not afraid that if they are not aligned with B*sh that their chance of getting into office is hampered. Hillary's strategy is exactly what we do not need. Nothing like telling the repugs that b*sh's agenda is correct.

[Azathoth]

24. I'm starting to get a little tired of Bill

When Bill Clinton left office, I figured that he would spend most of his time writing memoirs and working to promote Democratic issues and causes the same way Carter has. Unfortunately, Bill has done nothing but try to manipulate the party to his own advantage and generally work to aggrandize himself. Instead of taking a vocal stance against the war -- and as a former president, he would have been a powerful voice -- he's done nothing but undermine the anti-war position and cozy up to Dubya for his own benefit. Instead of working to involve the grassroots and progressive wing of the party, he's done nothing but try to alienate them. And I'm not a rabid Deaniac by any means, but Bill's anti-Dean jihad is starting to get on my nerves.

[leftchick]

28. It would not surprise me in the least...

aren't the Clintons both DLC?

[YNGW]

30. DailyKos also reported this.

I believe the next DNC chair will be whoever President Clinton wants it to be. He's the head of the party and he runs the show. If Dean will get on board then he might get the nod. If he doesn't, then he definitely won't.

[Maat]

31. I'm getting darn tired of the two royal families ...

the Clintons and the Bushies fighting over who is going to be my king and my queen. It has now been that way since 1988.

I used to think that President Clinton and Senator Clinton were the greatest. Lately, they have disappointed me, however. For example, Senator Clinton's kind words about faith-based intiatives. I was a social worker, and I now how those programs work out. AND, then there's Bill's suggestion to Senator Kerry, right before the election, that he BACK those hateful anti-gay amendments that passed in the states.

That took them down several notches.

For once, they'd better pay attention to what I would like. They had better get their heads out of their .... the Beltway. I want Governor Howard Dean for DNC chair. He's straight-talking and dedicated. He's enthusiastic and has great ideas. He would motivate me and many others I know. I will not be supporting whomever blasts Dean. Their loss.

[ProgressiveConn]

32. Obviously they are against Dean.

Dean means the end of the DLC.

[Deep13]

33. If true...

If this is true, it is pretty good reason in my judgment not to support him. Dean is a rather polarizing figure, though it is hard not to like him. Frankly, that Fowler guy seems to have his head screwed on right.

[news_junkie]

34. I definitely think somethings up...

With Bill and Hill (and others). Excerpts from a letter from Donna Brazille were posted several places today (I think it was originally published in Roll Call).

Here's part of it:

Dear Governor:
I have known and admired you for more than 16 years. As you recall, we first met while working on the Dick Gephardt for President Committee back in 1987. Although Gephardt lost in the primary, your unwavering support of a little-known Congressman from the Midwest was crucial and helped validate his campaign proposals on health care....

...But just as you appeared to be on the verge of catching fire in the Iowa caucuses, the winter turned harsh. People loved you in their hearts, but they became frightened of what it would mean for the Democratic Party to have you serve as our standard-bearer. Some of those same people are now involved in a last-ditch effort to stop your candidacy.
Your youthful, tech-savvy supporters were new to the game of hardball presidential politics. They were playing in a league where the rules change based on who's in the game. Soon, some party insiders flush with cash went to work to cool your jets. You haven't quite been the same since the moment they made and paid for a video comparing you to Osama bin Laden.

Perhaps this time you will make it to the top. But, as you have experienced, the climb up the ladder from ex-governor, ex-presidential candidate to chairman can be steep. The hurdles now, like the obstacles you confronted in the Democratic primaries, are mainly about ego. For all its talk about inclusiveness, the Democratic Party is extremely turf conscious. Thus, it's incumbent on you to reach out and bring these people, the very ones who went to the mat to stop you, into the fold.

The bigger fish in the Democratic pond (the party is still swimming upstream) are truly bottom feeders eating away their young, casting aside callously their base and ignorant of the sharks circling our old coalitions. They have dismissed an entire generation of potential leaders when they held power by failing to lift up those who were coming behind. With you, some of the people who have been kept down found their voice. No matter what happens next week, keep fighting for them.

[DaedelusNemo]

39. Donna Brazille sure surprised me! +20 points for Donna. /nt

[OzarkDem]

43. Job Security

As Donnie Fowler even acknowledged, Dems need to clean house at the national level and replace the "advisors" who have lost one presidential election after another.

IIRC Brazile has yet to run a winning presidential campaign, so in a way, her condemnation of Dean is a compliment.

The old school Dem insiders need to show some respect for fellow Dems and support for the party by stepping aside and letting new ideas take hold. They tried and failed numerous times. Its time to move on.

[ClarkUSA]

35. We are Now Listening To Freepers? This is Bullshit

Did you hear Newsweek's managing editor gush over Bush yesterday as the "American emperor"?

They are trying to divide the Party.

Give me one direct quote from the Clintons that they are Stop-Dean. This quoting of GOP-friendly sources is so much crap.

[mandyky]

38. Ryan Lizza of TNR has a great piece out

on the DNC race for chair. He did not mention Clintons specifically but Carville had a quote that made my blood boil. Check Editorials and Articles forum for the link to the article.

[lancdem]

41. This is that recycled Fineman crap

BTW, it's irrelevant. Dean is in. And I hope he does a helluva job.

[DemDogs]

42. What was Dean-Clinton dispute when he was President?

I have head there was a big break, but I don't know what it was.